First Potteries Discussion

[G760XRE]

Had a walk past First Potteries Adderley Green depot today and noticed 2 freshly painted deckers from other operators.

First Wessex 33967 SN65ZDD - Ultraviolet livery.

Rotala Diamond 40628 BJ15TWG - Blue Diamond livery.

Unfortunately due to where they had been parked, I couldn't get a picture of either.

 

[capitalpotter]

Had a walk past First Potteries Adderley Green depot today and noticed 2 freshly painted deckers from other operators.

First Wessex 33967 SN65ZDD - Ultraviolet livery.

Rotala Diamond 40628 BJ15TWG - Blue Diamond livery.

Unfortunately due to where they had been parked, I couldn't get a picture of either.

Need to spend some time painting their own fleet. The 3 streetlites they've painted aren't even in service

 

[43055]

Had a walk past First Potteries Adderley Green depot today and noticed 2 freshly painted deckers from other operators.

First Wessex 33967 SN65ZDD - Ultraviolet livery.

Seems a long way to go for some paint.

Need to spend some time painting their own fleet. The 3 streetlites they've painted aren't even in service

Indeed.

 

[G760XRE]

Seems a long way to go for some paint.

Indeed.

I can understand the external work they do for income generation. But these First repaints are coming from south coat operations more frequently at the moment. If Stoke is the nearest in house painting operation First have, they'll never get Ultraviolet rolled out in any meaningful quantity. As for the repainted streetlites I too find it odd all 3 still remain not back in service. 63359 hasn't moved an inch since I got a picture a couple of weeks ago.

 

[capitalpotter]

I can understand the external work they do for income generation. But these First repaints are coming from south coat operations more frequently at the moment. If Stoke is the nearest in house painting operation First have, they'll never get Ultraviolet rolled out in any meaningful quantity. As for the repainted streetlites I too find it odd all 3 still remain not back in service. 63359 hasn't moved an inch since I got a picture a couple of weeks ago.

By the time 90% of the fleet is in ultraviolet First will have changed livery again

 

[43055]

If bustimes is correct then Streetlite 47520 is in the new livery and has returned to service.

 

[G760XRE]

Just wandered past Adderley Green depot and noticed 2 ex London Central E200s on site, most probably for repaint. 1 is Se143 YX61BXL, the other is possibly Se144 YX61BXM but I couldn't ID this one for certain.

These show as being withdrawn over a year ago. Does anyone know who the current owner of these vehicles is?

 

[sonic2009]

Just wandered past Adderley Green depot and noticed 2 ex London Central E200s on site, most probably for repaint. 1 is Se143 YX61BXL, the other is possibly Se144 YX61BXM but I couldn't ID this one for certain.

These show as being withdrawn over a year ago. Does anyone know who the current owner of these vehicles is?

Looking at UK buses website, they are listed on fleetlist for Go East Anglia with no depot allocated and in reserve, this fleetlist was done in November 2024, so they could either be sold on again or painting into livery for Go East Anglia?

 

[G760XRE]

Noted at Potteries depot today was freshly repainted 63118 SK63KGN. https://www.flickr.com/photos/195213371@N03/54388000756/in/datetaken-public/
This streetlite formerly wore local 'Mainline' livery. Quite surprised these are getting repainted given they were done only a couple of years ago. When there are ex Sheffield 16 plate E200MMCs in old Firstgroup livery from new, and still plenty of the 66 plate ex Portsmouth Fareham & Gosport E200MMCs in Eclipse livery from new.

Is there a plan to thier repaints, or is it a scattergun approach of, presumably, painting anything that is available at the depot when there is a free slot in the paint shop?

 

[Lewisham2221]

Is there a plan to thier repaints, or is it a scattergun approach of, presumably, painting anything that is available at the depot when there is a free slot in the paint shop?

That's been the approach to Potteries repaints for years!

 

[capitalpotter]

Noted at Potteries depot today was freshly repainted 63118 SK63KGN. https://www.flickr.com/photos/195213371@N03/54388000756/in/datetaken-public/
This streetlite formerly wore local 'Mainline' livery. Quite surprised these are getting repainted given they were done only a couple of years ago. When there are ex Sheffield 16 plate E200MMCs in old Firstgroup livery from new, and still plenty of the 66 plate ex Portsmouth Fareham & Gosport E200MMCs in Eclipse livery from new.

Is there a plan to thier repaints, or is it a scattergun approach of, presumably, painting anything that is available at the depot when there is a free slot in the paint shop?

Scattergun approach sum first potteries up very well

 

[Baxenden Bank]

Service 11X (Hanley - Saxonfields - Newcastle) commences on 27 April. Not sure how this impacts on the current 11 / 11B.
Details on bustines.org here.

 

[G760XRE]

Service 11X (Hanley - Saxonfields - Newcastle) commences on 27 April. Not sure how this impacts on the current 11 / 11B.
Details on bustines.org here.

By combining the 3 timetables, it looks like that instead of every 11 routing via Saxonfields during the daytime M-F, this is reduced to every 3rd Hanley - Newcastle & Newcastle - Hanley trip going via the estate. The other 2 trips revert to going via Anchor Road.

 

[43055]

By combining the 3 timetables, it looks like that instead of every 11 routing via Saxonfields during the daytime M-F, this is reduced to every 3rd Hanley - Newcastle & Newcastle - Hanley trip going via the estate. The other 2 trips revert to going via Anchor Road.

Yes and now makes a messy 5ish buses per hour combined timetable with 2 11's, 2 11B's and 1 11X with gaps ranging from 5 to 21 mins. Must of took inspiration from the 38/39/103 corridor.

 

[capitalpotter]

Yes and now makes a messy 5ish buses per hour combined timetable with 2 11's, 2 11B's and 1 11X with gaps ranging from 5 to 21 mins. Must of took inspiration from the 38/39/103 corridor.

Why not either number them 11,11A,11B or 10,11,12

 

[Baxenden Bank]

Why not either number them 11,11A,11B or 10,11,12

Because it is First. They are hell bent on making their services as incomprehensible and unattractive as possible.

The changes to the 11 results in one fewer buses being required, eight instead of nine. 31 buses per weekday arriving into Newcastle instead of 36.

 

[Simon75]

Yes and now makes a messy 5ish buses per hour combined timetable with 2 11's, 2 11B's and 1 11X with gaps ranging from 5 to 21 mins. Must of took inspiration from the 38/39/103 corridor.

I do hope sometime soon they will stop using AI generated timetables

 

[G760XRE]

Because it is First. They are hell bent on making their services as incomprehensible and unattractive as possible.

The changes to the 11 results in one fewer buses being required, eight instead of nine. 31 buses per weekday arriving into Newcastle instead of 36.

The only positive from this mess of a timetable is differentiating between the 11's that go via Saxonfields and those that don't. I guess the logic on the numbering is 11B for Bentillee and 11X for SaXonfields...
I do miss clock face timetables. Thanks Baxdenbank for working out it will save First a vehicle a day. From a bean counters perspective it's ideal - reduces 1 bus per day but frequency by a few minutes in the main. So saving for the operator, without having to advertise a frequency reduction. Win win for First. To hell with us poor saps who have to actually use their services!

 

[Baxenden Bank]

The only positive from this mess of a timetable is differentiating between the 11's that go via Saxonfields and those that don't. I guess the logic on the numbering is 11B for Bentillee and 11X for SaXonfields...
I do miss clock face timetables. Thanks Baxdenbank for working out it will save First a vehicle a day. From a bean counters perspective it's ideal - reduces 1 bus per day but frequency by a few minutes in the main. So saving for the operator, without having to advertise a frequency reduction. Win win for First. To hell with us poor saps who have to actually use their services!

It's only ideal from the beancounters perspective if they are in the job for a short while, get their bonus for making cost savings, then move on before the impact of their decisions comes back and bites them on the bum through reduced revenue down the line. Reduced frequency = less attractive = lower patronage over time. These AI timetables and their random headways do allow this type of sneaky reduction to be implemented much more easily. One bus at a time rather than three. But people aren't that stupid, even if they don't count the exact number of buses per day. They know when there are "stupid gaps between buses, 15 minutes then 25 minutes then whatever". They certainly know when they have been stood at the stop for a long time and decide to get a taxi this time and everytime in future.

Correction to yesterdays post, I miscounted the quantum of buses arriving into Newcastle (probably lost some whilst using the scroll bar on bustimes.org).
Departures from Hanley: 63 down from 72.
Services on the 11B: 23 down from 30, essentially every 30 minutes instead of every 24.
Services via Saxonfields: 6 down from 15.
Services Hanley to Longton overall: 40 no change.
Arrivals into Newcastle 34 down from 36.

There is a large gap in the afternoon departures from Newcastle between 1615 and 1700. Is that a quiet time when no-one wants to travel? It looks like a 1622 arrival goes off to do something else.

 

[Baxenden Bank]

In addition to the 11 etc services already discussed, there appear to be a raft of other timetable changes introduced on 27th April. The Staffordshire County Council site shows the following (link here), but they only report services which enter Staffordshire. By following the link from bustimes.org you can view the BODS data but extracting the data is time consuming.

"Timetable data from First Bus/Bus Open Data Service (BODS), 18 March 2024"

• expand the PD0000003 section
• expand the FPOT section
• choose the registration/service you are interested in and select a date after 26th April.

There are some errors in the data, check more than one date to confirm eg 36 is showing the Sunday times for Monday 28th which is, as far as I can see, not a public holiday, but the 30th has what I would think is the correct timetable as per current.

• First Potteries service 6A (Blythe Bridge - Hanley) will have a revised timetable.
• First Potteries service 11 (Newcastle - Hanley) will have a revised timetable.
• New service 11X will be operated by First Potteries, Monday to Friday, between Newcastle, Longton and Hanley.
• First Potteries service 18 (Leek - Hanley) will have a revised timetable.
• First Potteries service 25 (Keele University - Hanley) will have a revised timetable.
• First Potteries services 38 / 39 / 38A / 39A (Kidsgrove - Newcastle) will have a revised timetable.
• First Potteries service 103 (Crewe - Hanley) will have a revised timetable.

• New Aimee’s Travel service 29 will operate Monday to Friday between Leek, Ipstones, Foxt, Whiston and Cheadle.
• New Aimee’s Travel service 30A will operate Monday to Friday between Leek, Ipstones, Froghall and Cheadle.

 

[43055]

Walking past Adderley Green depot today I noted a 3rd ex Leicester Streetlite 63359 SM65WMC has been freshly repainted into the new group ultraviolet livery, joining 63348/9 which have been done for a few weeks but have yet to re-enter service.
When 67174 was the 1st to be painted into this livery, I thought the ex eclipse E200 MMCs were going to be prioritised due to their non-standard livery. But it appears they've changed tack. Probably as this batch of streetlites are the oldest vehicles in the fleet which haven't been repainted since new.

Link to picture (mine). Apologies about the quality.

63359 SM65WMC

First Potteries Streelite, freshly painted into the new First bus 'ultraviolet' livery. Adderley Green depot 07.02.2025

www.flickr.com

2 months later 63348 appears to be out on the 22!

 

[Baxenden Bank]

First Potteries introduce a reduced service 40 from Monday, just Mount Pleasant to Newstead, hourly daytime. Replacing the withdrawn D & G service.

 

[G760XRE]

Had a walk past the depot earlier. Lots of vehicles from other First divisions on site awaiting repaint, including Potteries 67181 which has had various new panels replaced in bare metal and white plastic, but yet to be rubbed down.
Additionally on site was a B8RLE brand new in dealer white. This only has part of the reg showing (BU25???). Is this 6012 for D&G bus, does anyone know?
Other First vehicles seen on site for painting as follows;
33700 SN12AHF (Still in Orange Frequent 14s Leicester livery)
35684 MF22SYV (Still in Baderline livery)
44607 YC14RUU (Rubbed down ready for painting)
63310 SN65OLR (Fully painted including vinyls)
63371 SL16RBF (Refurbished panels, not rubbed down)
63410 SV22VWO (Rubbed down ready for painting)

Managed a couple of shots showing 63310. A couple of the others are in the distance on the first photo

First Potteries Depot

Various native Potteries buses at rest on Good Friday, along with repainted Portsmouth 63310. In the distance is a dealer white brand new Volvo B8RLE. This had only BU25 of its registration showing, last 3 letters blanked out. Unknown who this is for, but assuming it's another for D&G, given a...

www.flickr.com

First Potteries Depot

Freshly painted Portsmouth Streetlite 63310 SN65OLR, surrounded by Potteries native Streetlites 63360 & 63356. 18.04.25

www.flickr.com

Rear shot of 44607 & 63371. Difficult to see the registrations due to vegetation, sorry

63371 SL16RBF

First Bee Network Wright Streetlite. At Potteries deport for repaint into Bee Network yellow reportedly. 18.04.25

www.flickr.com

 

[JD2168]

33684 & 63410 for First South Yorkshire Olive Grove, 63410 being the last one in Eclipse livery.

Interestingly Potteries B7RLE Eclipse DTV 69382 has been getting about a bit recently, was in Sheffield on Thursday, a few miles from home:

 

[G760XRE]

Noticed today that 3 of the ex Bristol Streetdecks, 35684, 88 & 90 are now apparently staying with Potteries, according to a recent edit on Bustimes.

Vehicle edits – bustimes.org

bustimes.org

Is this accurate? There are several low bridges in Stoke that will fit a low height version but not a standard, with a couple being near to the depot.
All 3 are at Adderley Green depot anyway, 2 have already been painted and vinyls applied. Managed a picture of one this morning -

35684 MF22SYV

Wright Streetdeck in new Ultraviolet livery. Reportedly staying with Potteries. New to First Bristol

www.flickr.com

Also on site recently painted is 33695 SN12AGZ, down as First Leicester but expected to transfer to Colchester.

 

[aswilliamsuk]

Noticed today that 3 of the ex Bristol Streetdecks, 35684, 88 & 90 are now apparently staying with Potteries, according to a recent edit on Bustimes.

Vehicle edits – bustimes.org

bustimes.org

Is this accurate? There are several low bridges in Stoke that will fit a low height version but not a standard, with a couple being near to the depot.
All 3 are at Adderley Green depot anyway, 2 have already been painted and vinyls applied. Managed a picture of one this morning -

35684 MF22SYV

Wright Streetdeck in new Ultraviolet livery. Reportedly staying with Potteries. New to First Bristol

www.flickr.com

Also on site recently painted is 33695 SN12AGZ, down as First Leicester but expected to transfer to Colchester.

Seems a surprising move, but possible - the additional context being that a recent change to the signage at a railway bridge in the Peak District has meant that existing 'deckers at Olive Grove cannot currently work the FSY workings on the 272 (Sheffield - Castleton). Clearly, there is a need for 'deckers for the route, so a swap of low-height examples for similarly new full-height StreetDecks appears to be the solution. Now, will those moving from Potteries to FSY get repainted first, I wonder?

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

Is this accurate? There are several low bridges in Stoke that will fit a low height version but not a standard, with a couple being near to the depot.
All 3 are at Adderley Green depot anyway, 2 have already been painted and vinyls applied. Managed a picture of one this morning -

It would make sense as First Potteries did replace some standard height e400s with low height Streetdecks from York, as part of the drive to provide commonality with the other Streetdecks. So they have more low heights than the need, IIRC.

 

[G760XRE]

It would make sense as First Potteries did replace some standard height e400s with low height Streetdecks from York, as part of the drive to provide commonality with the other Streetdecks. So they have more low heights than the need, IIRC.

Were these E400's the ex orange Excel liveries ones? I remember several were sent to replace the ex Leicester B7TLs. However, I don't believe these were operated (apart from a handful of Painsley School journeys) before moving on again, due to the low bridge issue around Stoke. However, they could definitely accommodate 3 with route restrictions im sure. Just hope a driver doesn't forget the height difference when returning to depot!

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

Were these E400's the ex orange Excel liveries ones? I remember several were sent to replace the ex Leicester B7TLs. However, I don't believe these were operated (apart from a handful of Painsley School journeys) before moving on again, due to the low bridge issue around Stoke. However, they could definitely accommodate 3 with route restrictions im sure. Just hope a driver doesn't forget the height difference when returning to depot!

They were definitely operated - plenty of photos on flickr with the 101 being a regular haunt. So regular Streetdecks would be fine on there or the 18.

 

[JD2168]

Seems a surprising move, but possible - the additional context being that a recent change to the signage at a railway bridge in the Peak District has meant that existing 'deckers at Olive Grove cannot currently work the FSY workings on the 272 (Sheffield - Castleton). Clearly, there is a need for 'deckers for the route, so a swap of low-height examples for similarly new full-height StreetDecks appears to be the solution. Now, will those moving from Potteries to FSY get repainted first, I wonder?

Rumours of 8 low height StreetDecks moving to Olive Grove. The current single deck only on 272 struggles with loadings particularly at weekends