State of Merseyrail infrastructure - "this is why we can't have nice things"

Bletchleyite · 25 Feb 2019

Spent a bit of time bimbling around Merseyrail this weekend, and one thing of particular note was the state relatively new infrastructure has been allowed to get into for lack of maintenance. I'm thinking in particular things like a failure to paint wooden surfaces (doors etc) and to sand and paint metal items such as lamp standards, handrails and structural members (the bottom of the ticket office at Kirkdale, on a bridge over the rails, looks dangerous to me, there is so much corrosion of the steel members).

Why has this been allowed to happen? It seems far worse than other TOCs, other than possibly the GWML innersuburban stations which are also a disgrace. It will only cause significant cost and disruption to sort it when things actually do fail.

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frodshamfella · 25 Feb 2019

Im not sure it's worse, I think Merseyrail stations are pretty good as a rule. However I do think maintenance generally is pretty poor these days in the UK in general. At my local station (Acton Bridge), saw them painting the foot bridge , doors etc in the rain !

Legolash2o · 25 Feb 2019

There's a footbridge at Hessle that makes me ask the same question as it looks unsafe. The picture below was from 2013 but it looks worse now.

Bletchleyite · 25 Feb 2019

Legolash2o said:
There's a footbridge at Hessle that makes me ask the same question as it looks unsafe. The picture below was from 2013 but it looks worse now.
View attachment 59608

The one at Ardwick does make me wonder (particularly with 25kV under it), but I doubt anyone ever actually uses it!

tonysk14 · 25 Feb 2019

Bletchleyite said:
The one at Ardwick does make me wonder (particularly with 25kV under it), but I doubt anyone ever actually uses it!

Actually, about 6 people a day.

L&Y Robert · 25 Feb 2019

"Spent a bit of time bimbling around Merseyrail" - Bletchleyite, post 1.
A new word has burst upon me. 'To Bimble'. Not the same as 'Grising' then? Or maybe it's local to Bletchley. "We say it all the time down Bletchley way, like".

Bletchleyite · 25 Feb 2019

L&Y Robert said:
"Spent a bit of time bimbling around Merseyrail" - Bletchleyite, post 1.
A new word has burst upon me. 'To Bimble'. Not the same as 'Grising' then? Or maybe it's local to Bletchley. "We say it all the time down Bletchley way, like".

Bimbling? I thought it was a Northern thing. You'd more likely "bimble" on foot than on the train (e.g. "going for a little bimble in the countryside" would be going for a short, not particularly quick, fairly aimless walk) but I think it fitted the activity I took part in.

https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/bimble

Ploughman · 25 Feb 2019

Used Bimbling since the 70's at least.
Possible it may have military usage as well.

Skie · 26 Feb 2019

Seaforth & Litherland has a nice water feature on the mid-point of the ramp to the platforms. It's the location where, when this was a station with 4 platforms, there are old passenger tunnels under the lines to access the outside platforms. The tracks seemingly drain directly into this area, which just floods out onto the ramp. Heavy enough rain means the entire flat section of the ramp gains an impressive lake, which forces anyone wanting to get past to do a bit of wading.
It's been like this for years, and all they ever do if it's reported is to get out the brush and push the water down the ramp.

Maintenance is definitely on the cheap sadly. The trains are filthy in areas you wouldn't expect dirt to get and they only get a superficial mop every so often. And with the wash road out of action whilst it's rebuilt for the new units, the train exteriors are looking filthy too but that can't really be avoided.

Bletchleyite · 26 Feb 2019

One thing also of note is that the vast majority of stations have not had new signage since BR days. Oddly, the (only?) other TOC that they share this with, VTWC, is one that is rather bigger on publicity!

47271 · 26 Feb 2019

There's a lot of it about. Stopped briefly at Lancaster yesterday I looked up and thought what a shocking state the footbridge is in.

ic31420 · 27 Feb 2019

47271 said:
There's a lot of it about. Stopped briefly at Lancaster yesterday I looked up and thought what a shocking state the footbridge is in.

Add Lever Street footbridge in Bolton to that too.

I suppose they're a Pita to access.

frodshamfella · 27 Feb 2019

Not forgetting how grotty Crewe Station is !

AM9 · 27 Feb 2019

ic31420 said:
Add Lever Street footbridge in Bolton to that too.

I suppose they're a Pita to access.

The Lever Street footbridge has just got even more difficult to paint with 25kV just beneath it. Maybe cheaper to pay the local graffiti 'artists' to spray it, high voltage doesn't seem to bother them, - job done overnight and no possession required.

Mutant Lemming · 27 Feb 2019

At least Merseyrail stations are staffed for most of the day - neighbouring authorities have run down and unstaffed stations

DarloRich · 27 Feb 2019

47271 said:
There's a lot of it about. Stopped briefly at Lancaster yesterday I looked up and thought what a shocking state the footbridge is in.

do you mean it looks in poor decorative order or you think it is unsafe?

urbophile · 27 Feb 2019

Brunswick is a case in point. Brand new 20+ years ago, its Meccano-like structure still looks impressive but close up much of it (especially the footbridge) is rusty and in need of cleaning and painting. Most Merseyrail stations are attractive and generally well maintained, but while some of them seem to get regular attention others (quite arbitrarily it seems) are neglected. All about money I suppose.

Statto · 27 Feb 2019

Skie said:
Seaforth & Litherland has a nice water feature on the mid-point of the ramp to the platforms. It's the location where, when this was a station with 4 platforms, there are old passenger tunnels under the lines to access the outside platforms. The tracks seemingly drain directly into this area, which just floods out onto the ramp. Heavy enough rain means the entire flat section of the ramp gains an impressive lake, which forces anyone wanting to get past to do a bit of wading.
It's been like this for years, and all they ever do if it's reported is to get out the brush and push the water down the ramp.

Maintenance is definitely on the cheap sadly. The trains are filthy in areas you wouldn't expect dirt to get and they only get a superficial mop every so often. And with the wash road out of action whilst it's rebuilt for the new units, the train exteriors are looking filthy too but that can't really be avoided.

Some Merseyrail units are stabled overnight at stations, on my line at Rock Ferry/New Brighton & West Kirby, rather then go to the depot & get a clean which is why they can be filthy, i'm not sure how often the units are cleaned.

cactustwirly · 27 Feb 2019

Bletchleyite said:
Spent a bit of time bimbling around Merseyrail this weekend, and one thing of particular note was the state relatively new infrastructure has been allowed to get into for lack of maintenance. I'm thinking in particular things like a failure to paint wooden surfaces (doors etc) and to sand and paint metal items such as lamp standards, handrails and structural members (the bottom of the ticket office at Kirkdale, on a bridge over the rails, looks dangerous to me, there is so much corrosion of the steel members).

Why has this been allowed to happen? It seems far worse than other TOCs, other than possibly the GWML innersuburban stations which are also a disgrace. It will only cause significant cost and disruption to sort it when things actually do fail.

Blame TfL for the state of the GWML stations, they're bad because they're in the middle being rebuilt
The GWR managed stations are perfecty fine, a lot better than the innersuburban GA and GTR stations.

Bletchleyite · 27 Feb 2019

cactustwirly said:
Blame TfL for the state of the GWML stations, they're bad because they're in the middle being rebuilt
The GWR managed stations are perfecty fine, a lot better than the innersuburban GA and GTR stations.

They have been bad since well before TfL had any involvement at all. A number of SWR (SWT) stations were similar - Brockenhurst for one had flaking paint all over the place. And it's not even a hard job on a third-rail line.

Bletchleyite · 27 Feb 2019

DarloRich said:
do you mean it looks in poor decorative order or you think it is unsafe?

I don't know about Lancaster, but when I saw the rust and bubbling paint on the I-beams holding up Kirkdale ticket office I have certainly wondered what safety margin was used in its construction and how long it can last before it falls down, hopefully not on top of a person or a train.

NorthernSpirit · 27 Feb 2019

Mutant Lemming said:
At least Merseyrail stations are staffed for most of the day - neighbouring authorities have run down and unstaffed stations

Looking at the state of Grimsby Docks railway station which is both unstaffed and not covered by a Combined Authority or PTE, had (when I was there in 2016) glass all over the platform, the shelter was trashed, one of the on-platform Yonder alarms had been ripped out leaving its pole and wires poking out and to top it off there was some flytipped items in the locked car park.

Jozhua · 27 Feb 2019

Whilst I can't speak for Merseyrail, there are definitely TOC's who do more with less and maintain their trains and stations to a good standard! East Midlands Trains 153/6/8 are a good example of how these fleets should be.

Whilst we do live in a society where it seems to be "cheaper" to just throw broken things away, in the world of the railways where equipment is specialised and built in limited quantities, investment in good maintenance should hopefully save money in the long run. As well as being good for passengers!

Vinnym · 27 Feb 2019

I understand the op however Merseyrail have turned up this week at Old Roan and started repainting the shelters, how far the repaint is going to extend, who knows?

73001 · 27 Feb 2019

Vinnym said:
I understand the op however Merseyrail have turned up this week at Old Roan and started repainting the shelters, how far the repaint is going to extend, who knows?

It's Aintree Races in a few weeks... Old Roan is incredibly busy over the 3 day event. I expect that's as far as the repainting will go (Aintree is usually in fairly good nick all year round).

jamesst · 27 Feb 2019

Statto said:
Some Merseyrail units are stabled overnight at stations, on my line at Rock Ferry/New Brighton & West Kirby, rather then go to the depot & get a clean which is why they can be filthy, i'm not sure how often the units are cleaned.

The other thing to remember now aswell is aside from a few daytime cleaners going through the train with a bin bag, the cleaning (or lack of it) and maintenance is now under the control of Stadler and not Merseyrail.

Bletchleyite · 27 Feb 2019

jamesst said:
The other thing to remember now aswell is aside from a few daytime cleaners going through the train with a bin bag, the cleaning (or lack of it) and maintenance is now under the control of Stadler and not Merseyrail.

Presumably only of the trains?

FWIW, I did note during my "bimbling" that the cleanliness of the train interiors had actually improved over past experience. It's the stations which seem to be going to rack and ruin.

modernrail · 28 Feb 2019

What are the franchise requirements for station maintenance on Merseyrail?In commercial leases you produce a schedule of condition at the start of the lease and one at the end. If there is a discrepancy the lease holder is obliged to pay to the Landlord an amount for any dilapidations.

47271 · 28 Feb 2019

DarloRich said:
do you mean it looks in poor decorative order or you think it is unsafe?

More rust than paintwork mixing it with 25kV a few inches away, it looks like it hasn't been painted in 20 years. I'm sure it's perfectly safe, it just looks very dodgy to anyone who doesn't know, and I include myself as someone who doesn't know.

modernrail · 28 Feb 2019

47271 said:
More rust than paintwork mixing it with 25kV a few inches away, it looks like it hasn't been painted in 20 years. I'm sure it's perfectly safe, it just looks very dodgy to anyone who doesn't know, and I include myself as someone who doesn't know.

Surely there is a category between 'looks pretty' and 'unsafe' and that is something like, 'has adequate preventative maintenance to minimise/avoid inflated maintenance or unnecessary capital costs.' Let's face it, that is the main purpose of painting something!

State of Merseyrail infrastructure - "this is why we can't have nice things"

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