• Our booking engine at tickets.railforums.co.uk (powered by TrainSplit) helps support the running of the forum with every ticket purchase! Find out more and ask any questions/give us feedback in this thread!

Danny Baker sacked

Status
Not open for further replies.
J

jon0844

Veteran Member
Joined
1 Feb 2009
Messages
28,058
Location
UK
Daz28 said:
I don’t view this progress as positive and I fear for where it may lead society.
Click to expand...

Perhaps it makes people think before they speak (or Tweet). You're effectively able to broadcast to the entire world, and anyone that didn't hear you the first time might the second (as your Tweet remains in existence 'forever').

I speak as someone who could be classed as a Danny Baker fan, even if I've not listened to him for some years. I had that feeling of disappointment when I saw this, as I felt let down by his actions.

He cannot possibly have been unaware of how such an image would, or at the very least could, be interpreted.
 
Sponsor Post - registered members do not see these adverts; click here to register, or click here to log in
R

RailUK Forums

D

Daz28

Member
Joined
11 Feb 2010
Messages
310
Location
Elmstead Woods
jon0844 said:
Perhaps it makes people think before they speak (or Tweet).
He cannot possibly have been unaware of how such an image would, or at the very least could, be interpreted.
Click to expand...

I think that’s the point, he didn’t think sufficiently.

He must have been unaware of how it could have been interpreted, otherwise why would would he have deliberately posted something racist and offensive and then deleted it and apologised minutes later?
 
fowler9

fowler9

Established Member
Joined
29 Oct 2013
Messages
8,367
Location
Liverpool
The internet has opened up a huge can of worms. Many years ago I was suspended by a former employer for e mail abuse. It was all linked in with a story that made the national press.

It all started when someone accidentally forwarded a joke e mail to a member of the public instead of a colleague. The company started investigating and suspended literally hundreds of us.

I was suspended on full pay for forwarding an e mail that was racist. It was racist because way down the e mail chain that I forwarded on someone had made a racist comment I hadn't seen. It was forwarded to me by a member of the race that was insulted in a bizarre turn of events. She was also investigated.

The investigation was stopped when the company realised that they would have to sack thousands of people from the bottom to the top for inappropriate e mail content on the work e mail system.

I was suspended on full pay over Christmas and New Year and kept my job which was frankly a result. People who sent me hard-core porn never even got suspended. Several friends got sacked but on appeal were given clean references. No one above the bottom level in the company even got suspended and everyone knew they were involved. All the dodgy stuff came in through IT or people high up because us scum never had internet or external email access.

It was quit an experience. I kept my job. Most of the people sacked ended up with better jobs.
 
4

404250

Member
Joined
25 May 2018
Messages
367
It's a bit like the drug debate. Education will be of more benefit to society than punishment in the long term.
 
B

Belperpete

Established Member
Joined
17 Aug 2018
Messages
1,650
Things have moved on since the Saville/Ross/Deaton eras. The BBC was rightly savaged for their response to these incidents for not taking sufficiently strong and swift action. The BBC had to do something because if they hadn't, they would have been seen as effectively condoning what one of their presenters had broadcast on social media. And the gravity of the offense caused was such that a slap on the wrist would not do.

His actions afterwards also did not do him any favours. There was little sign of contrition in his apology, and his claim that he didn't know that Megan has mixed-race heritage was patently ridiculous from someone with his media background. He seemed more concerned about having got the sack than contrite about the offense that he had caused.

Unfortunately the excuse "I didn't mean to be offensive" counts for little as it is routinely used by many people who say things that they clearly intend to be offensive. Whether he meant to be offensive or not, he clearly offended a significant number of reasonable people. Such things may be excusable when said by an unthinking elderly relative brought up in a different era, but they cannot be excused when said by someone holding a position of influence.

I personally don't think that Danny Baker was being deliberately racist, and regret that he has been sacked, but it was his fault - I am astounded that anyone could use that picture to comment on the birth of any baby without thinking it might cause offense.
 
M

Master29

Established Member
Joined
19 Feb 2015
Messages
1,970
AndrewE said:
Come on!
He may be quite entertaining, but I believe he is also a keen football follower. He must be aware of how offensive the racist chanting of monkey grunts aimed at black players is considered to be, and how much effort is being made to discourage it.
So if he's not racist how else can anyone interpret a picture of a monkey or ape baby titled "royal offspring" or whatever when the first mixed-race child has just been born into the royal family?
I am appalled by it and think he deserved his sacking.
Click to expand...
Indeed. He is a Millwall fan and would clearly have known this would land him in the clarts. Like anyone in the public eye he stands or falls by his actions and comments. Stars are quick to utilize the media when it works in their favour but when the cruel mistress strikes they are the first to bleat how "the press ruined their lives".
 
D

David M

Member
Joined
16 Jan 2018
Messages
153
I've been abroad since May 9 and thought until now that he was sacked due to his criticising the Royal Family - it didn't even cross my mind that it was perceived as being racist.
 
G

greyman42

Established Member
Joined
14 Aug 2017
Messages
4,941
David M said:
I've been abroad since May 9 and thought until now that he was sacked due to his criticising the Royal Family - it didn't even cross my mind that it was perceived as being racist.
Click to expand...
I did not see it as criticism or racism. To me it was just a light-hearted joke.
 
RJ

RJ

Established Member
Joined
25 Jun 2005
Messages
8,408
Location
Back office
There is some serious naivety being displayed in this thread.

The type of person who would actually post something like that is probably the type of person who is openly racist among like minded chums out of public view. This is probably why he claims to have been thrown under the bus, because he may well have friends at that workplace he shared many of these kind of "jokes" with.

His claims about not knowing anything about the ethnicity of the child are not believable. A newborn who can't defend themselves is not fair game for derisory jokes.

Some people harbour negative/bigoted views of other demographics be it based on race, sexual orientation, gender etc. but the majority have a filter which stops them from making that obvious to people it will offend. Don't be under any illusion it was intended as an innocent joke with no racial connotations. The only thing he'll be regretting is failing to consider his audience.

Unless you've been living under a rock or a place bereft of online communications for the last 10 years, inappropriate use of social media is one thing that can result in disciplinary action if it brings an employer into disrepute. I can see that many people sympathise with his flavour of humour but he isn't the first and won't be the last to be let go because of this.
 
Last edited:
Peter Mugridge

Peter Mugridge

Veteran Member
Joined
8 Apr 2010
Messages
14,829
Location
Epsom
Am I right in thinking that he is the same person who was filmed a few years ago - and this was shown on one of the "Alright on the Night" type out-take series - being very abusive to a member of Railtrack ( as it then was ) staff at Waterloo when he decided to turn up with a film crew without first making the necessary arrangements and then deciding, when told, that the rules didn't apply to him anyway?
 
T

Typhoon

Established Member
Joined
2 Nov 2017
Messages
3,520
Location
Kent
Peter Mugridge said:
Am I right in thinking that he is the same person who was filmed a few years ago - and this was shown on one of the "Alright on the Night" type out-take series - being very abusive to a member of Railtrack ( as it then was ) staff at Waterloo when he decided to turn up with a film crew without first making the necessary arrangements and then deciding, when told, that the rules didn't apply to him anyway?
Click to expand...
Do you mean https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GU_xMreGxbk ?

In which case the answer is 'yes' and shows a side of him I haven't seen before. No request, no apology. Just a 'do you know who I am?' approach. It was more than a few years ago though, he had hair then!
 
433N

433N

Guest
Joined
20 Jun 2017
Messages
752
RJ said:
His claims about not knowing anything about the ethnicity of the child are not believable. A newborn who can't defend themselves is not fair game for derisory jokes.
Click to expand...

I think that the first sentence is the nub of the issue. Is it the responsibility of citizens of this country to (a) know about every offspring of minor members of the royal family and (b) know about the ethnicity of every offspring of minor members of the royal family ? And then to remember them at some distant point in the future.

Yes, perhaps in the early days of 'the pregnancy' I might have (accidentally) read something about it, but I had completely forgotten by the time the sprog was born because (a) I'm not interested , (b) it matters not one jot to me and (c) I have a life.

Whilst I know very little of Baker, I can give him the benefit of the doubt because perhaps his attitude is/was exactly the same as mine. I wouldn't have done the chimp tweet though , because I can do no better parody of the royal family than they do of themselves. I think a constant awareness of all matters pertaining to all aspects of the royal family is a little bit too much to expect of citizens ; obviously, I am not worthy.

This common 'newborn who can't defend themselves' statement is bizarre. I am completely at a loss as to how people think that Baker's tweet had anything to do with a personal attack on the baby at all ; 100% about the family and system it is born into. But 2019, you know, people do like to find things to take offence to.
 
O

OneOffDave

Member
Joined
2 Apr 2015
Messages
453
433N said:
I think that the first sentence is the nub of the issue. Is it the responsibility of citizens of this country to (a) know about every offspring of minor members of the royal family and (b) know about the ethnicity of every offspring of minor members of the royal family ? And then to remember them at some distant point in the future.

Yes, perhaps in the early days of 'the pregnancy' I might have (accidentally) read something about it, but I had completely forgotten by the time the sprog was born because (a) I'm not interested , (b) it matters not one jot to me and (c) I have a life.
Click to expand...

We do have a basic responsibility as decent human beings not to be racist. Megan's ethnicity doesn't change over time so it's not something that you have to remember for the future. It's a similar situation with the child's ethnicity. This stuff isn't rocket science. As someone who works in the media, often with a topical bent, it's not unreasonable to expect Danny Baker to be aware of which member of the royal family had just had child given how it was all over the media at the time. It wasn't some secret event that happened a million miles away and no one was told. As for his claim that he didn't realise the imagery might be perceived as racist, presumably he must have failed to hear all the monkey chanting aimed at black footballers while at his beloved Millwall
 
433N

433N

Guest
Joined
20 Jun 2017
Messages
752
OneOffDave said:
We do have a basic responsibility as decent human beings not to be racist. Megan's ethnicity doesn't change over time so it's not something that you have to remember for the future. It's a similar situation with the child's ethnicity. This stuff isn't rocket science. As someone who works in the media, often with a topical bent, it's not unreasonable to expect Danny Baker to be aware of which member of the royal family had just had child given how it was all over the media at the time. It wasn't some secret event that happened a million miles away and no one was told. As for his claim that he didn't realise the imagery might be perceived as racist, presumably he must have failed to hear all the monkey chanting aimed at black footballers while at his beloved Millwall
Click to expand...

We do have a responsibility not to be racist, yes.

Alternatively, perhaps Baker sees/saw 'Megan' (although I doubt he's on first name terms with her) as a person or a member of the royal family or a woman or someone from that telly programme rather than a person from an ethnic minority ; similarly her baby. Perhaps someone's ethnicity isn't such a big issue for him ; I don't really know because I don't really know the bloke nor any of his output.
 
Strat-tastic

Strat-tastic

Established Member
Joined
27 Oct 2010
Messages
1,370
Location
Outrageous Grace
433N said:
I don't know !

You pull me up over a sentence ending in a preposition and then you let me off over a 'sentence' which doesn't even have a verb in it.

You can't even get a proper pedant these days. This country is going to the dogs. :frown:
Click to expand...

Sorry, my bag :lol:
 
RJ

RJ

Established Member
Joined
25 Jun 2005
Messages
8,408
Location
Back office
433N said:
I think that the first sentence is the nub of the issue. Is it the responsibility of citizens of this country to (a) know about every offspring of minor members of the royal family and (b) know about the ethnicity of every offspring of minor members of the royal family ? And then to remember them at some distant point in the future.

Yes, perhaps in the early days of 'the pregnancy' I might have (accidentally) read something about it, but I had completely forgotten by the time the sprog was born because (a) I'm not interested , (b) it matters not one jot to me and (c) I have a life.

Whilst I know very little of Baker, I can give him the benefit of the doubt because perhaps his attitude is/was exactly the same as mine. I wouldn't have done the chimp tweet though , because I can do no better parody of the royal family than they do of themselves. I think a constant awareness of all matters pertaining to all aspects of the royal family is a little bit too much to expect of citizens ; obviously, I am not worthy.

This common 'newborn who can't defend themselves' statement is bizarre. I am completely at a loss as to how people think that Baker's tweet had anything to do with a personal attack on the baby at all ; 100% about the family and system it is born into. But 2019, you know, people do like to find things to take offence to.
Click to expand...

I suspect you're blase about it because the slur is not aimed at you, though do correct me if I'm wrong. For those it is aimed at and those who don't agree with slurs as humour, it's clear to see the offensive intent behind it.

I don't think you even believe what you say - this is a UK media personality we are talking about and at the time, pretty much every media outlet for weeks was swamped with stories about the pregnancy and then the birth of the baby.

Maybe your gripe is with the fact that times have changed and there are some things you can't really get away with because of the effect they have on other people any more. Tough luck really.
 
G

Groningen

Established Member
Joined
14 Jan 2015
Messages
2,866
Did Boris Johnson sometimes have racist comments and look; still running for PM. Well Danny is around 60 (!?) years; so only a few years till his pension.
 
433N

433N

Guest
Joined
20 Jun 2017
Messages
752
RJ said:
I suspect you're blase about it because the slur is not aimed at you, though do correct me if I'm wrong.
Click to expand...

You are correct, I am not a member of the royal family or Meghan Markle's baby.

RJ said:
I don't think you even believe what you say
Click to expand...

I am not sure what you believe that I believe since I don't think I expressed what I believe ... but feel free to conflate away if it makes you feel better.

RJ said:
... this is a UK media personality we are talking about and at the time, pretty much every media outlet for weeks was swamped with stories about the pregnancy and then the birth of the baby.
Click to expand...

Oh wow. A UK media personality ... so is every contestant on Love Island.

I'm now sorry that I let my subscription to OK and Hello magazines lapse ; I am missing sooooo much. I only tend to follow serious news stories. Story : "Baby is Going to Be Born !!! " doesn't really float my boat and so I don't read further. I defer to the expertise of you royal watchers on such matters, should I feel the need.

RJ said:
Maybe your gripe is with the fact that times have changed and there are some things you can't really get away with because of the effect they have on other people any more. Tough luck really.
Click to expand...

I don't have a gripe.

I hope you enjoyed your rant ; I just don't know why you quoted my post because it was of no relevance to your diatribe.
 
scotrail158713

scotrail158713

Established Member
Joined
30 Jan 2019
Messages
1,797
Location
Dundee
We need to move on from this. He tweeted something which had the potential to be funny if it was thought through properly. He was claiming the birth of the child was like a circus so he found a picture of a couple walking out a hospital with a circus animal (monkey).
When it was pointed out to him the potential for that to be viewed as racist, he quite rightly took it down. If it was a picture of a couple with, for example, an elephant or tiger, then I genuinely believe it would’ve been thought of as humorous. He has since profusely apologised and said that he genuinely didn’t mean for it to be racist. I am quite happy to believe him, and apart from on this forum I haven’t read anything on this issue since about a day after it happened.
Everyone else across the country seems to have moved on, so why haven’t some people on this forum?
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Top