NCL - KGX .. Family & Friends Railcard discount not showing ??

I am looking for fares for a friend, who wants to travel from Newcastle to Kings Cross next week .. see images

Out (from NCL) Wednesday, Return Saturday

2 adults and 1 child

I told him to buy a family & friend railcard, but when I look at the prices the discount isn't showing .. not really sure why .. can anybody help please.

Or find a better deal

We'd need to see the exact fares being sold to better advise, but as we know, LNER like to do their own thing, and so it's important to keep in mind that tickets like "LNER Family Single (2 Adults 1 Child)" are not permitted to be railcard discountable.

Willie Bee said:

I am looking for fares for a friend, who wants to travel from Newcastle to Kings Cross next week .. see images.

Click to expand...

The times of the outward and return trains are different on the two screenshots, despite both having the same date, origin and destination.

Without Railcard:
NCL 09:30 - 13:00 KGX
KGX 15:30 - 18:38 NCL

With Railcard:
NCL 09:30 - 12:48 KGX
KGX 15:48 - 18:46 NCL

What is going on here?

kkong said:

The times of the outward and return trains are different on the two screenshots, despite both having the same date, origin and destination.

Without Railcard:
NCL 09:30 - 13:00 KGX
KGX 15:30 - 18:38 NCL

With Railcard:
NCL 09:30 - 12:48 KGX
KGX 15:48 - 18:46 NCL

What is going on here?

Click to expand...

One of them is direct the other has a change at York onto the stopping LNER service. If you look at the first screenshot both 0930 options are shown, the second screen shot just shows the one.

Willie Bee said:

I told him to buy a family & friend railcard, but when I look at the prices the discount isn't showing .. not really sure why .. can anybody help please.

Click to expand...

The railcard is working by the by but there's just very interesting interactions going on with the LNER Family Single tickets and then discounted tickets with the Family & Friends Railcard so it isn't immediately obvious.

Take, for instance, the 0930 direct service to London and the 1530 back. Without a Railcard Trainsplit is finding a Newcastle to London and then London to Newcastle Family Single at £75 each way total £155. With the railcard it's finding a Newcastle to Darlington and Darlington to York Advances (discounted with the Railcard) then a York to London Family Single (no additional discount). Coming back it's finding London to Darlington and Darlington to Newcastle Advances (discounted with the Railcard). Total of that is £164.45 with share of split saving. It's also why the 1548 shows up on the one with the railcard discount but doesn't on the one without. The 1548 is a Lumo service and so has the Railcard discount applied and shows up as it's a similar price to the LNER services but without the railcard is much more expensive than the LNER services using a Family Single.

Ironically for this journey assuming that they're happy to travel with LNER they may be better off just buying LNER Family Singles without using a railcard at all. Though if they intend to do any other rail journeys using other operators in the next year a railcard may still make sense for those journeys.

ainsworth74 said:

The railcard is working by the by but there's just very interesting interactions going on with the LNER Family Single tickets and then discounted tickets with the Family & Friends Railcard so it isn't immediately obvious.

Take, for instance, the 0930 direct service to London and the 1530 back. Without a Railcard Trainsplit is finding a Newcastle to London and then London to Newcastle Family Single at £75 each way total £155. With the railcard it's finding a Newcastle to Darlington and Darlington to York Advances (discounted with the Railcard) then a York to London Family Single (no additional discount). Coming back it's finding London to Darlington and Darlington to Newcastle Advances (discounted with the Railcard). Total of that is £164.45 with share of split saving. It's also why the 1548 shows up on the one with the railcard discount but doesn't on the one without. The 1548 is a Lumo service and so has the Railcard discount applied and shows up as it's a similar price to the LNER services but without the railcard is much more expensive than the LNER services using a Family Single.

Ironically for this journey assuming that they're happy to travel with LNER they may be better off just buying LNER Family Singles without using a railcard at all. Though if they intend to do any other rail journeys using other operators in the next year a railcard may still make sense for those journeys.

Click to expand...

What was that about Simpler Fares again?

kkong said:

What was that about Simpler Fares again?

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Well quite! Though I do, to be fair, think that it's a good idea of LNERs that should be rolled out more widely unlike the current "trial" but yes it does interact a bit messily with the Family & Friends Railcard particularly when splitting comes into question!

kkong said:

The times of the outward and return trains are different on the two screenshots, despite both having the same date, origin and destination.

Without Railcard:
NCL 09:30 - 13:00 KGX
KGX 15:30 - 18:38 NCL

With Railcard:
NCL 09:30 - 12:48 KGX
KGX 15:48 - 18:46 NCL

What is going on here?

Click to expand...

OP here .. I realise that .. just getting my friend rough prices.

He has actually booked now .. £155 return which isn't too bad.

I don't have a Family & Friends railcard .. just found it strange that there was hardly any reduction

Willie Bee said:

I don't have a Family & Friends railcard .. just found it strange that there was hardly any reduction

Click to expand...

Yeah as above it's because LNER already offer a ticket aimed at families which offers basically the same discount level but without the need for a railcard. Try a booking for say Newcastle to Birmingham and you'll spot that the railcard offers a discount immediately

I've had similar when looking at booking three adult LNER tickets, with one passenger having a 16-17 railcard. Three adults has a 20% group discount so the railcard is disregarded.

OP here ... I'm clear now ... thanks again for all your replies

kkong said:

What was that about Simpler Fares again?

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'Simpler' fares generally mean more expensive fares, at least for those who buy the lower priced tickets!

If LNER were instructed to "simplify" in this case, they would likely remove the Family fares, which would result in families simply being priced off the train and onto the roads.

(Of course it could be argued that there are other ways to attract families/groups than these fares, but that's beyond the scope of this thread, and one for Speculative Discussion!)