Long Distance Super Off Peak through London at Peak Times

Hi All,

Apologies if this is not the right place to ask, but I wonder if I could ask for some advice and hopefully some guidance please? I've recently booked a journey from Milton Keynes Central (MKC) to St Ives (SIV) for 10th May - I've copied the journey details from the booking email I received below, though have some questions, and I'm starting to doubt myself whether I've booked the correct ticket or not.

I've got a couple of questions, which I'm hoping someone will be able to help me with.

• The ticket has a restriction code of nre.co.uk/KX on it, but when visiting the URL I get a page not found error. Are you able to help me find out what restrictions I have on this ticket please? Ideally I'd like to see if I can travel earlier from MKC to London Euston (EUS) to have a bit of time to traverse between EUS and London Paddington (PAD).

• Even though the ticket is Super Off Peak, the journey I have been given appears to be during Peak hours (especially on the journey into EUS from MKC). Is anyone able to advise if this is valid? I did wonder whether there were any easements because of the length of the journey out of London? (It may be relevant but I could not book any seat reservations for my Outbound journey for either leg - I had to do that separately)

Thanks ever so much!


Outward Journey
Milton Keynes Central to St Ives (Cornwall) on 10 May 2024

The restriction code for this fare has just been changed from YX to KX but the associated text for the restriction has not yet been added to the database.
From looking at the 'unpublished data' it appears this is meant to be valid for your journey as it bars travel out of Paddington up to 10:03, and your train departs at 10:04. There is no restriction on arrival time at Euston.

The fare is set by GWR, so it's no surprise that no time restrictions are given for your journey into Euston. That will be fine, although the ticket might not work the barriers at Milton Keynes and Euston and you'll have to explain that the Super-Offpeak restrictions only apply to the GWR part of the journey.

They're applying what was previously the "Network Rule" in that time restrictions were lifted for journeys that started in the Network Southeast area but had destinations that were outside it. The rule does not universally apply now, and the restrictions are those given for the individual tickets.

Done this a fair few times from Bletchley and never had a problem. WMT's gateline staff do tend to be reasonably competent and are generally rail staff rather than security guards.

Welcome to the forum! We ask that abbreviations or codes are explained the first time they're used on a thread, in case people aren't familiar with them, so I've edited your post accordingly

There are three principles of rail ticketing to note here.

Firstly, there is no such thing as a blanket "peak" or "off-peak" train or time of day. The ticket you hold determines the trains you can take; the only "peak" restrictions that apply are those shown in the restriction code of the ticket you hold. The applicable restriction code (KX) has no restrictions on trains to/from Euston - the only relevant restrictions for this journey are to/from Paddington. Whilst you're correct that the human-readable text for this code appears to be missing (which is very poor), the electronic data used by journey planners shows that it is intended to be a copy of restriction code YX, whose restrictions are available to read here.

Secondly, you are entitled to travel in accordance with any itinerary you are offered in conjunction with your ticket - even if the booking site you use happens to have made a mistake (which isn't the case here). This is because of consumer and contract law (as well as common sense): the train companies must honour what people are told when they buy tickets. You have been offered an itinerary involving the 08:35 from Milton Keynes so as a minimum, you're entitled to take that service.

Finally, there is a rule of thumb known as the Network Area Rule, which applies to most "intercity" journeys that involve crossing London. This rule means that if the ticket is to or from a station within the Network Area, there are usually no time restrictions for the part of the journey between London and the Network Area origin/destination - but rather only on the "Intercity" part of the journey. Restriction codes KX/YX generally speaking follow this - with the exception of having some restrictions into St Pancras, but they don't apply to your journey from MKC.

When combining all of these principles, it's therefore 'easy' to see why it is correct that there are no restrictions between Milton Keynes and London on this ticket. There are no restrictions on that part of the journey in the restriction code; you have been offered an itinerary involving the 08:35 and thus can rely on that; and finally, all of this is in keeping with the Network Area Rule (of thumb).

Aook said:

• Even though the ticket is Super Off Peak, the journey I have been given appears to be during Peak hours (especially on the journey into EUS from MKC). Is anyone able to advise if this is valid?

Click to expand...

As others have said, there are no "peak" restrictions between MKC and EUS on this ticket.

It is a valid itinerary, is intended to be such, and is in accordance with long-standing principles regarding longer distance tickets.

The chances of an incorrectly trained member of staff claiming your ticket is invalid is low, however it's not zero, as some train companies do lack sufficient training in this area. Rest assured if you buy a ticket from our site, travel in accordancw with the itinerary, and are incorrectly charged an excess fare (or in any other way mistreated), we would be happy to provide advice regarding how to claim the monies back from the rogue train company.

Morning everyone.

Firstly, I just wanted to say thank you each for taking the time to reply to me (a new joiner to the forum) and share your knowledge - it really is appreciated. As many have mentioned, when you break down the constituent parts it's quite reasonable to understand. I think it was just a little unnerving when I couldn't find the restriction code explanation, and having spoken to GWR customer services the only response I received was 'you can only travel on super off peak services'. Though it's safe to say I'll be using brfares in the future - so thanks for the tip!

I'll make sure to print off the booking/journey itinerary too should it be needed as extra 'evidence' should any staff have questions.

Last but not least, Watershed - Thanks for the welcome, and noted for next time to watch out for abbreviations.

Thanks all!

Watershed said:

Whilst you're correct that the human-readable text for this code appears to be missing (which is very poor), the electronic data used by journey planners shows that it is intended to be a copy of restriction code YX, whose restrictions are available to read here.

Click to expand...

The public facing info for YX bans outwards travel on trains timed to depart Paddington after 0429 and before 1010. The itinerary gives a 1004 departure.

Of course, as you say, holding that itinerary makes travel on the 1004 completely valid, but it doesn't tie in with the YX restriction - not that there is anything in the public domain to suggest that YX has any relevance anyway.

Let us know how it goes. You have a valid itinerary.