Maybe they agreed a mutual exchange in conjunction with TFGM given the need for more flexibility due to late deliveries of new builds. They certainly wouldn’t have done it to derail the process given the implications of that in a contractural relationship. I’m not sure why you seem to think any operator would be so spiteful.
You clearly dont remember Stagecoach’s stance when the quality partnership was on the cards in the north east several years ago. The suggestion of any kind of control being taken back by the PTE and they threatened to pull out of the area all together.
But the point is, if they weren't adding vehicles to the pool (as with Wigan) then everyone bidding for the franchises would know during the bidding process and therefore needed to have a plan to deal with the lack of vehicles being inherited. If Stagecoach decide to not honour their commitment to adding vehicles to the pool then I am sure there is some legal redress that TfGM can pursue.
Do we know if Stagecoach have agreed to add any vehicles to the pool?
The legal battles went to appeal but Stagecoach sat that out leaving just Rotala to fight it.
Stagecoach still played a pretty big part in trying to have the whole thing stopped.
Yes they did. But you can't assume that the new owners have the same views about franchising as the old owners, without evidence. They may do, but they may not do.
Stagecoach was the biggest bus company in Greater Manchester. If I remember correctly, Stagecoach Manchester was their biggest operation outside London. Franchising was always going to be a threat to their business.
Personally, I think most of you are really all over thinking this. At risk of this still being marginally off topic, I'll keep it brief. TfGM will have sat down with Stagecoach (as per the others) and will have discussed and made offers for which ever vehicles they would like. Stagecoach are a business, they're not going to act like children with toys, if the money is good in their eyes they'll sell. If they think not, they won't. Metroline will know already what they do and don't need, be it all or half or whatever.
But that isn’t the same business, new owners, new management just the same name. They are contracted to provide whatever has been agreed and will fulfil that.
Wythenshawe may need some double-deckers as a couple of major services are transferring there from Stockport.
I live on the 409 route and In the hour or so I was out washing my Car the majority of buses were either in corporate stagecoach livery, GNW livery or Oxford livery. Only one was yellow and that was a 24 plate MMC.
Unless we have another company failing, like Bournemouth, or a smaller operator, such as McGills, buying a large number of electric buses and nowhere to cascade the replaced buses to.
How big is your car?
I noticed your bias in another post and I feel it's a tad unfair, perhaps wait a bit longer for things to improve? Nothing ever happens over night. How long did it take FirstBus to eradicate the various GMBuses liveries? Years... and they had a lot more painters back then as well... So I'd realistically expect a couple of years before pretty much every bus is yellow in this instance... Then perhaps we'll deal with making every bus the same shade of yellow...
They expect things to happen overnight, play these simulation games and they think they're experts.I noticed your bias in another post and I feel it's a tad unfair, perhaps wait abit longer for things to improve? Nothing ever happens over night. How long did it take FirstBus to irradiate the various GMBuses liveries? Years... and they had alot more painters back then aswell... So I'd realistically expect a couple of years before pretty much every bus is yellow in this instance... Then perhaps we'll deal with making every bus the same shade of yellow...
It’s good being colourblind because I can’t see any difference in the shades - I also thought that the 135 B9s were yellow on the front when I first moved up here to be fairI noticed your bias in another post and I feel it's a tad unfair, perhaps wait abit longer for things to improve? Nothing ever happens over night. How long did it take FirstBus to irradiate the various GMBuses liveries? Years... and they had alot more painters back then aswell... So I'd realistically expect a couple of years before pretty much every bus is yellow in this instance... Then perhaps we'll deal with making every bus the same shade of yellow...
I think that Stagecoach may well consider an attempt at de-railing things, but they have a good relationship with ComfortDelGro in general - bare in mind, the two companies run the Megabus and Citylink operations together. If anything, Stagecoach may just loan stuff to Metroline, but if they were to sell things like the 12xxx Enviros as mentioned above, I would not be surprised. Keep enough to prevent any Tridents having to stay for T3 as well, and then sell/loan the rest to Metroline.
Well that's fair to bet money on, but Metroline bidded anyway, so clearly have a plan IF no vehicles were included.
Good point about the Stagecoach CDL relationship
It’s not being harsh on Stagecoach, and Stagecoach’s relationship with Metroline. Stagecoach won’t be happy at handing over a very successful group business. Obviously they have to maintain a working relationship with TFGM but might possibly have plans elsewhere for much of the south Manchester Fleet.
It’s not bias it’s being realistic. Sorry if that upsets up.I noticed your bias in another post and I feel it's a tad unfair, perhaps wait a bit longer for things to improve? Nothing ever happens over night. How long did it take FirstBus to eradicate the various GMBuses liveries? Years... and they had a lot more painters back then as well... So I'd realistically expect a couple of years before pretty much every bus is yellow in this instance... Then perhaps we'll deal with making every bus the same shade of yellow...
Takes me 4 hours to completely detail it.
Oh yeah... I know which is the more "realistic" response...
It is a matter of public record that Stagecoach WERE very unhappy with franchising and they tried to derail it through legal challenges. That failed and Stagecoach withdrew (whilst Rotala continued legal avenues). Given that they have subsequently won four large depots plus the Little Hulton schools operation, they seem to have got over their objections and, whilst they'll not make the money that they did, they seem to have adopted the pragmatic view that the world has changed and they have to adapt.
Perhaps this can be the last time this has to be written, I feel it's getting a tad repetitive...
Latest fleetcard has 10 E400MMC's departing, presumably imminently......10473-10478 to Stagecoach South and 10479-10482 to Stagecoach South East, although all appear to be still in service in Manchester at the moment....
I saw that 183 not long ago, I thought it the routes would stay with Stotts until end of contract. Hasn't Oldham got some of the new Solo's stagecoach ordered that would be more appropriate? Usually load is <5 on any given run. A decker is just carrying around air.
Come out of the paint shop and look at it from a drivers point of view. It’s a mess. Hopefully it gets better but the whole thing has been rushed. Lessons have not been learned from Tranche one, and it’s not Stagecoach’s fault but the people at the top supposedly running the show.Oh yeah... I know which is the more "realistic" response...
Stotts often ran a decker on it as it inter worked with a school, not sure if that’s still the case though, however I believe a brand new 24 plate Solo SR has been delivered to Oldham so possibly for that.
Doesn’t surprise me.
Of course and if a good amount of money can be made like Diamond and GNW got out of it then I’m sure Stagecoach will take the opportunity to pool some vehicles but will also move some stuff out to other groups which is evident on the latest fleet card with some MMC’s being moved to other groups - not the older E400’s we would all have expected to go.
An excellent response...
There is also a difference between Arriva and Stagecoach losing operations and potentially therefore their views regarding vehicles.