tfw756rider
Member
Oh OK, thanks - I did wonder.
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Transport for Wales Class 230
- Thread starter CaergwrleKen
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RailUK Forums
It is interesting reading these responses.
I presumed that as a new design the alternators would be matched to the speed at which the engines developed maximum power hence running 'full throttle' a combined constant power of ~600kW less the losses in the alternators, drives and motors would be delivered unlike mechanical transmission as first generation DMU's.
I did ponder the weight of the gensets and batteries compared to the engines and transmissions of 150 and 165/6 sets. After 50+ years of development I would expect a better power to weight ratio than for a 20x DEMU power pack which would offset the weight of the batteries. Also the D-Stock to be lighter construction.
I presumed that as a new design the alternators would be matched to the speed at which the engines developed maximum power hence running 'full throttle' a combined constant power of ~600kW less the losses in the alternators, drives and motors would be delivered unlike mechanical transmission as first generation DMU's.
I did ponder the weight of the gensets and batteries compared to the engines and transmissions of 150 and 165/6 sets. After 50+ years of development I would expect a better power to weight ratio than for a 20x DEMU power pack which would offset the weight of the batteries. Also the D-Stock to be lighter construction.
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There is a better power to weight ratio. Even a 2 car 20x is best part of 85tons not 55 quoted (that's the power car alone).
Invincible
Member
Quick check on RTT and 007 and 008 plus one 197 seemed to work today
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But from starting from a station the diesel engines will be in tickover (or switched off!), so batteries will be proving power.
Has the problems preventing charge or switching off diesel engines in stations been identified and fixed?
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'full throttle' will only be needed when climbing a hill
But from starting from a station the diesel engines will be in tickover (or switched off!), so batteries will be proving power.
Has the problems preventing charge or switching off diesel engines in stations been identified and fixed?
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WirralLine
Member
On the 230s they seem to just rev high 90% of the time, deafeningly loud with the fans on when hot too. They didnt used to do this, they used to tickover and only rev up when required (usually when accelerating), 008 had some mods done last year to the point where a staff notice went up advising that it would sound different but is normal for the mods it had - the different sound being it seems to sit revving high most of the time.
Invincible
Member
Perhaps to ensure the hybrid mode trickle charge with the higher capacity batteries is enough when outside the stations and gradients?
Presumably they have some monitoring on this?
Zontar
Member
230 006 failed again today
It appears that yesterday (Sunday 18th May 2025) every service was operated by a class 230 and was successfully on time.
Is this the first day of 230 only operations on the line? previously mixed working with 150s then 197s. Unsure if 197s took over 150s or if they were brought in to cover for 230s previous issues.
Is this the first day of 230 only operations on the line? previously mixed working with 150s then 197s. Unsure if 197s took over 150s or if they were brought in to cover for 230s previous issues.
I don’t think it’s as simple as that but ever since it went to 3-train operation on a 45-minute frequency it was always planned for 3 230s. I think it started with one 230 and two 197s, then went to two 230s and one 197, and now at the May timetable change it’s finally gone to full 230 operation on all three diagrams.
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On a Sunday most (but not all) trains shunt out at Bidston before returning to form the next service around 15 minutes later. This does add some resilience.
Philip Roberts
Member
It's all 230s again today. 006, 008 and 009
Zontar
Member
And predictably at least one of them has failed and there's hours of delay minutes and cancellations.
WirralLine
Member
A passcom was pulled apparently and couldn't be reset. Train empty to Birkenhead depot with safety system isolated. The further delays and cancellations were caused by some sort of signalling cockup which resulted in the the depot bound 230 blocking the other one.
Philip Roberts
Member
They're all out and performing fine again
Lewisham2221
Established Member
6, 7 and 9 appear to have operated the full service without issue so far today (now I've jinxed it 
)
)
Philip Roberts
Member
We got there in the end. All's well that ends well
Peter Sarf
Established Member
Sooner or later you will not be needing (wanting) your WARM coat
.I do wonder how the hot weather coupled with pollen will affect the 230s after their last modifications.
Should be some improvement, hopefully enough.
Let us not forget that the Wrexham/Bidston line does have a punishing schedule for any DMU.
WirralLine
Member
230008 and its dodgy passcom (again).
Also points failure at Penyffordd caused further disruption
Zontar
Member
230 failed again today, subsequent cancellations throughout the day.
tfw756rider
Member
Which one, do you know?
Zontar
Member
Not sure, just heard on the grapevine
WirralLine
Member
009 with hot batteries
Phillipimo
Member
Realtime Trains suggests it was 010 which was on the 09:32 arrival at Bidston, but the next round trip to Wrexham to cancelled. It came back into service for the next trip from Bidston at 11:51 and stayed out in service.
https://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/se...0/0000-2359?stp=WVS&show=all&order=wtt&toc=AW Link to all TfW services at Bidston today.
Zontar
Member
2 units failed today. 1 taken out of service and another had to have it's gen sets replaced.
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tfw756rider
Member
Thanks
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No worries, now answered
Philip Roberts
Member
009 and 010 are working again todayThanks
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No worries, now answered
Zontar
Member
Another failure today, 230009
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Which had to be resuced, that also failed
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