USB ports and sockets on trains not working - is this getting worse?

SimonR2 · 28 Jun 2025

I travel frequently on Greater Anglia trains and sometimes Southeastern, Southern or c2c. On Greater Anglia trains there has been an increasing recurrence of USB ports and sockets around me not working, to the extent that I have had to resort to my charger plug or even portable charger (not sure about the rest - I haven’t travelled on c2c very recently, and only recently have ports/sockets become available on that network). Needless to say, this is quite annoying to find so many of them not working when being able to charge your phone on longer journeys is something you should be able to take for granted. This is quite unacceptable service in my book and these should be maintained as regularly as ticket machines (probably more so, given so many people, including myself, use e-tickets 99+% of the time).

I’ve been thinking of sending a report of this to Greater Anglia containing what I’ve observed so far, including the train numbers, locations of problem power points and journey details (if the latter helps). Here’s what I’ve recorded:

459514
23/06/2025 09:36-10:08 Liverpool Street to Chelmsford, front 4 x 2 in front coach
Six out of eight USB ports not working
Doesn’t work when I use my charger (doesn’t even fit into the front facing one on the right)
Even affects response when I attempt to use cable

453119
28/06/2025 15:41-16:14 Chelmsford to Liverpool Street, front 4-seat section on right in second coach from front
Not one of the four USB ports and two sockets are working

In addition to seeking your thoughts/advice on this, just one question out of curiosity - what do the train numbers refer to? Are they related to the age of the train, or more to do with the journeys they are scheduled for?

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pokemonsuper9 · 28 Jun 2025

SimonR2 said:
459514
23/06/2025 09:36-10:08 Liverpool Street to Chelmsford, front 4 x 2 in front coach
Six out of eight USB ports not working
Doesn’t work when I use my charger (doesn’t even fit into the front facing one on the right)
Even affects response when I attempt to use cable

453119
28/06/2025 15:41-16:14 Chelmsford to Liverpool Street, front 4-seat section on right in second coach from front
Not one of the four USB ports and two sockets are working

In addition to seeking your thoughts/advice on this, just one question out of curiosity - what do the train numbers refer to? Are they related to the age of the train, or more to do with the journeys they are scheduled for?

Those numbers are carriage numbers,
453119 is in unit 720119 and 459514 is in unit 720514. They aren't directly an indication of age, they just belong to the carriage.
The Class 720s are quite new trains, only coming into service over the last 5 years.

styles · 28 Jun 2025

I'm surprised the number of people who take the risk plugging their phones into public USB ports at all to be honest.

Parallel · 28 Jun 2025

Had a very bizarre situation today on two different Inverness Class 158s where my phone was connected and showing charge, but it was remaining on its current battery percentage. The ScotRail HST I’m on now is charging it as usual though.

Mikey C · 28 Jun 2025

Parallel said:
Had a very bizarre situation today on two different Inverness Class 158s where my phone was connected and showing charge, but it was remaining on its current battery percentage. The ScotRail HST I’m on now is charging it as usual though.

I imagine the former was charging but REALLY slowly. My phone gives me a warning when this happens.

D365 · 28 Jun 2025

styles said:
I'm surprised the number of people who take the risk plugging their phones into public USB ports at all to be honest.

In what sense? Certainly the USB outlets on British rolling stock are power only - there is no data interface.

pokemonsuper9 · 28 Jun 2025

Parallel said:
Had a very bizarre situation today on two different Inverness Class 158s where my phone was connected and showing charge, but it was remaining on its current battery percentage

I got that quite a lot today, but that's no suprise since I was on quite a high percentage (so charging is slower) and was playing Pokemon go (which takes quite a lot of power).

owidoe · 28 Jun 2025

D365 said:
In what sense? Certainly the USB outlets on British rolling stock are power only - there is no data interface.

Juice jacking - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Hasn't been seen in the wild, but it's plausible. I don't use public USB ports and I don't scan QR codes. I went hungry in Bristol for that last one.

WirralLine · 28 Jun 2025

Parallel said:
Had a very bizarre situation today on two different Inverness Class 158s where my phone was connected and showing charge, but it was remaining on its current battery percentage. The ScotRail HST I’m on now is charging it as usual though.

I find on the TfW 158s my phone hardly charges at all (even loses % if being used at the same time) when the engines are idling. When the engines are revving it charges a bit quicker but still slowly. Not an issue if you sit at a table and use the proper sockets though.

In answer to the OPs question, most of the time the USBs dont work due to vandalism - you find people shoving chewing gum, paper etc in them and also some people like to poke pens or keys or something in there to deliberately damage them. Often if a lot of them arnt working (usually a whole side of a coach, or the entire coach) its because they whole thing has tripped. Probably due to a short or an overload.

duffield · 29 Jun 2025

owidoe said:
Juice jacking - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Hasn't been seen in the wild, but it's plausible. I don't use public USB ports and I don't scan QR codes. I went hungry in Bristol for that last one.

That requires someone to actually start dismantling part of the train** to install the malicious hardware - and to do this multiple times, for each socket, if they're serious about it. I regard this as so implausible as to be irrelevant. As if that wasn't enough it also needs an unpatched exploit in the phone software to stop it prompting for a data connection***. The only case I can see this happening would be something like a targeted attack on a high-value target by installing such a device in the USB socket in their hotel room.

My evaluation is that the only real risk from a train USB socket is that it's been damaged by misuse or vandalism in such a way that it fries your device when you plug in, but with my cheap phone I'm prepared to accept that small risk after inspecting the port for obvious damage.

Now QR codes, that is a real, active threat, actually happening with stickers over the real code (in car parks particularly). It's a cheap, easy, low-risk exploit unlike the difficult, risky and potentially expensive and low reward ratio "juice jacking".

** If you just attached a fake malicious socket to the front of the real one, it would stick out like a sore thumb, unless it was carefully and specifically crafted for the specific sockets - vanishingly unlikely.

***I'm pretty sure my Android 15 phone doesn't even prompt anymore to allow a data connection over USB; it's denied by default and you have dig around in the settings to enable it.

stadler · 29 Jun 2025

I have noticed more and more 377s and 387s with faulty sockets recently. I think often these things just never get reported. If it is just one socket broken (rather than an issue with the whole carriage) then it probably never gets noticed by the depot and then does not get fixed.

Kite159 · 29 Jun 2025

duffield said:
I'm pretty sure my Android 15 phone doesn't even prompt anymore to allow a data connection over USB; it's denied by default and you have dig around in the settings to enable it.

Likewise with my phone, when I connect it to my laptop to transfer photos across. Needs going into a drop-down menu to change from "Charging Only" to "Data Transfer" and with my fingerprint to confirm it.

Peter Mugridge · 29 Jun 2025

stadler said:
I have noticed more and more 377s and 387s with faulty sockets recently. I think often these things just never get reported. If it is just one socket broken (rather than an issue with the whole carriage) then it probably never gets noticed by the depot and then does not get fixed.

Something I've noticed which may be related, although this relates to the three pin plug sockets on the 377s rather than any USB sockets...

On the train from Epsom, charging seems painfully slow, perhaps 1% in ten minutes. Once the train reaches West Croydon, charging from there to London Bridge seems closer to the 1% a minute that I would normally expect. In the reverse direction, it's usually fairly fast from London Bridge and then slower - but not that much slower - once past West Croydon.

Curious? Is there less juice in the 3rd rail below West Croydon causing the train to prioritise systems with the sockets being way down the list?

frankmoh · Friday at 22:39

Peter Mugridge said:
Something I've noticed which may be related, although this relates to the three pin plug sockets on the 377s rather than any USB sockets...

On the train from Epsom, charging seems painfully slow, perhaps 1% in ten minutes. Once the train reaches West Croydon, charging from there to London Bridge seems closer to the 1% a minute that I would normally expect. In the reverse direction, it's usually fairly fast from London Bridge and then slower - but not that much slower - once past West Croydon.

Curious? Is there less juice in the 3rd rail below West Croydon causing the train to prioritise systems with the sockets being way down the list?

Dead thread but maybe its 3rd rail vs overhead? The 377s are dual voltage after all.

Russel · Friday at 22:51

I don't bother with USB's in public because more often than not, they simply don't work.

USB Connections seem to be too fragile to be used en-mass in public.

With respect, that seems like paranoia to me.

owidoe said:
Hasn't been seen in the wild, but it's plausible. I don't use public USB ports and I don't scan QR codes. I went hungry in Bristol for that last one.

frankmoh · Friday at 22:57

Russel said:
I don't bother with USB's in public because more often than not, they simply don't work.

USB Connections seem to be too fragile to be used en-mass in public.

With respect, that seems like paranoia to me.

I think having QR codes for menus is evil, especially when there is poor service in the restaurant. But I digress. I think the normal 3-pin plug is a good compromise for ease of use and for robustness, but I think it being quite large is why most trains (aside from Electrostars and Desiro Cities from what I've seen) do not have them.

Mikey C · Friday at 23:13

frankmoh said:
I think having QR codes for menus is evil, especially when there is poor service in the restaurant. But I digress. I think the normal 3-pin plug is a good compromise for ease of use and for robustness, but I think it being quite large is why most trains (aside from Electrostars and Desiro Cities from what I've seen) do not have them.

Lots of people carry around a USB cable as it takes no space. Carrying around one with a plug as well is much more bulky, which is why people don't tend to carry them just to charge phones on the move, as opposed to laptops.

Russel · Friday at 23:16

Mikey C said:
Lots of people carry around a USB cable as it takes no space. Carrying around one with a plug as well is much more bulky, which is why people don't tend to carry them just to charge phones on the move, as opposed to laptops.

I'd rather carry the plug too, rather than rely on USB sockets that either don't work or are glacially slow.

Bungle965 · Friday at 23:16

I think my biggest frustration is that on trains whether new or refurbished they’re coming out still with USB A sockets, times are changing and USB C is more and more default.
My local buses have both something which is think is possibly sensible.

Russel · Friday at 23:18

Bungle965 said:
I think my biggest frustration is that on trains whether new or refurbished they’re coming out still with USB A sockets, times are changing and USB C is more and more default.
My local buses have both something which is think is possibly sensible.

Are USB-C sockets more robust that A?

frankmoh · Friday at 23:47

Russel said:
Are USB-C sockets more robust that A?

If anything they are worse because they are smaller.

Anyways this discussion can be solved by simply charging your phone or whatever before setting off. That is if your journey is less than an hour or so, no USB ports on long-distance trains is awful.

Peter Mugridge · Friday at 23:53

frankmoh said:
Dead thread but maybe its 3rd rail vs overhead? The 377s are dual voltage after all.

It's third rail all the way from Epsom to London Bridge, though...

duffield · Saturday at 00:00

Bungle965 said:
I think my biggest frustration is that on trains whether new or refurbished they’re coming out still with USB A sockets, times are changing and USB C is more and more default.
My local buses have both something which is think is possibly sensible.

It's true USB-C is standard at the phone end now, but why not just carry a USB-A to USB-C cable? That will work for USB-A or dual A/C charging sockets.

My USB-C phone charger is a wall plug with a USB-A outlet and a USB-A to C cable, so I just use that cable.

boiledbeans2 · Saturday at 00:21

SimonR2 said:
I travel frequently on Greater Anglia trains and sometimes Southeastern, Southern or c2c. On Greater Anglia trains there has been an increasing recurrence of USB ports and sockets around me not working, to the extent that I have had to resort to my charger plug or even portable charger (not sure about the rest - I haven’t travelled on c2c very recently, and only recently have ports/sockets become available on that network). Needless to say, this is quite annoying to find so many of them not working when being able to charge your phone on longer journeys is something you should be able to take for granted. This is quite unacceptable service in my book and these should be maintained as regularly as ticket machines (probably more so, given so many people, including myself, use e-tickets 99+% of the time).

I’ve been thinking of sending a report of this to Greater Anglia containing what I’ve observed so far, including the train numbers, locations of problem power points and journey details (if the latter helps). Here’s what I’ve recorded:

459514
23/06/2025 09:36-10:08 Liverpool Street to Chelmsford, front 4 x 2 in front coach
Six out of eight USB ports not working
Doesn’t work when I use my charger (doesn’t even fit into the front facing one on the right)
Even affects response when I attempt to use cable

453119
28/06/2025 15:41-16:14 Chelmsford to Liverpool Street, front 4-seat section on right in second coach from front
Not one of the four USB ports and two sockets are working

In addition to seeking your thoughts/advice on this, just one question out of curiosity - what do the train numbers refer to? Are they related to the age of the train, or more to do with the journeys they are scheduled for?

I use GA regularly and notice the same thing. Even on one charging unit with a 3-pin socket and 2 USB sockets, it's possible that only 1 of the USB socket works while the other doesn't.

In contrast, the Class 345 USB sockets seem to be quite reliable so far.

Harpo · Saturday at 03:01

Parallel said:
Had a very bizarre situation today on two different Inverness Class 158s where my phone was connected and showing charge, but it was remaining on its current battery percentage.

I’d not be surprised if 158’s USB output is a bit naff. In original form, 158s had very little surplus electrical power. Cambrian ETCS needed about 2kw on board each unit which was just about available but, had already been ring-fenced for cab aircon. A big (expensive!) programme of energy efficiency (lighting etc.) was paid for by the ETCS project to free-up the power needed. Public sockets followed later on that fleet.

pokemonsuper9 · Saturday at 08:30

Does anyone have a USB-A voltmeter (are those even a common thing?) and can go around testing trains' ports.

Harpo said:
I’d not be surprised if 158’s USB output is a bit naff. In original form, 158s had very little surplus electrical power.

I can completely imagine that, although on Northern's I can about hold at the same percentage while playing Pokemon Go (but the train wasn't that busy, and not that many people use the USB ports).

frankmoh · Saturday at 11:30

pokemonsuper9 said:
Does anyone have a USB-A voltmeter (are those even a common thing?) and can go around testing trains' ports.

I can completely imagine that, although on Northern's I can about hold at the same percentage while playing Pokemon Go (but the train wasn't that busy, and not that many people use the USB ports).

~~Pokemon Go in 2025? I never knew that game was still running.~~

Do any other members of the Sprinter family also have USB ports fitted right now? Maybe some are better or worse than others?

43096 · Saturday at 11:33

duffield said:
It's true USB-C is standard at the phone end now, but why not just carry a USB-A to USB-C cable? That will work for USB-A or dual A/C charging sockets.

My USB-C phone charger is a wall plug with a USB-A outlet and a USB-A to C cable, so I just use that cable.

But most/all phones now have USB-C both ends.

ScottGallagher · Saturday at 11:35

frankmoh said:
~~Pokemon Go in 2025? I never knew that game was still running.~~

Do any other members of the Sprinter family also have USB ports fitted right now? Maybe some are better or worse than others?

Northerns 156 fleet definetley do, never found one not to work.

duffield · Saturday at 11:44

pokemonsuper9 said:
Does anyone have a USB-A voltmeter (are those even a common thing?) and can go around testing trains' ports.
...

If that's a serious proposition, I'd advise against it. It would probably look like very abnormal behaviour and pretty suspicious, going around connecting some odd-looking piece of equipment to port after port. If I saw this I'd report it to train staff, and if I was train staff I'd probably call BTP on the grounds that it might be some sort of sabotage or vandalism. Even once you'd shown it was just a volt meter, it's probably a bylaw offence (interfering with railway equipment or such like) since the sockets are clearly intended for charging mobile devices and not for freelance testing, and they have no way to know if your device might or might not even unintentionally damage the socket by shorting or overloading it somehow.

USB ports and sockets on trains not working - is this getting worse?

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