08:40 Zurich to Graz - Panorama carriage

[philjo]

I am starting to plan for a trip to Austria next year.

I will be spending a week in Schladming.

The plan at the moment is to travel via Paris to Zurich, stay 1 night then get the 08:40 EC 163 Transalpin service via the Arla Pass, which calls at Schladming. (the train destination is Graz)

The EUropean timetable shows that this services includes a Panorama carriage.
The train composition at the site below indicates that this is first class.
http://www.vagonweb.cz/razeni/vlak.php?zeme=SBB&cislo=163&nazev=Transalpin&rok=2016&lang=en#v46


Where is the best place to book this - is the panorama carriage bookable online?
also is it a 1st class coach or is another supplement payable?
on a couple of sample dates in October:

The OBB site first claimed there was no 1st class then offered 1st at 150 euros more than the standard advance fare. (std advance is 39 euros)

Loco2 is charging £159 for first class (£93 for std class) - flexible tickets only

swiss railways (SBB) site is offering a 1st class advanced single ticket for 83 Swiss Francs - which seems to be the best deal at the moment.

It is an EC service not a railjet - OBB offers advanced fares for 1st class on the railjets from Zurich at a 15 euro supplement over the std class, but not on the 08:40.
The alternative option using the 06:40 or 10:40 railjets involve a 12 minute change at Salzburg - is that connection feasible?

 

[Bletchleyite]

Usually these are classed as first class. If you find you're unable to reserve, there are normally a few unreserved seats you can take.

The SBB fare sounds good.

 

[class387]

The panoramic coach is a standard first class coach with no supplement. I'm not sure how to reserve seats in it but if there are empty unreserved seats you should be able to just sit in it. I've never been on the Austrian route of the train, but sit on the left for the Zurich - Sargans section - the train runs along the Zurichsee and Walensee.

I've read some pretty bad things about first on the Railjets, so I don't see any reason to go first other than the panoramic coach on EC163.

 

[LNW-GW Joint]

I travelled on this train in June.
I did Geneva-Feldkirch one afternoon (IC/RJ), and Feldkirch-Innsbruck-Graz the next day (IC/EC163).
One ticket cost €39, the other €34, both 1st class from ÖBB.
Maybe you have to wait until the advance booking horizon starts for the best fares - 6 months I think.
Not knowing about the Panorama car in EC163 at the time, I booked an hour's stopover in Innsbruck for provisions, and picked up the Graz train there.
Later I found out the train composition and realised I could have sat in the Panorama car all the way! Never mind.
I didn't book seats, and there was no need (no supplement required).
The Panorama car was practically empty throughout, until a group of hikers got on at Selzthal. I had a pair of bays to myself, ideal for photography on both sides.
It was an SBB car, and is excellent, much nicer than an RJ car. There are two trains in circuit, but I don't know if the other is identical or not.
It seemed rather odd to have an SBB car in an otherwise ÖBB train.
A beautiful journey in every respect, especially at the price.
I put a couple of pictures up in this thread (post #7): http://www.railforums.co.uk/showthread.php?t=134558

I'm not a fan of the new ÖBB web site (I booked on the old one), and you don't seem to be able to insert stopovers any more - it only offers the direct route.

 

[Bletchleyite]

I've read some pretty bad things about first on the Railjets

Yes, it's dire. Only bother for the panoramic coach (which is worth it).

 

[Polarbear]

As mentioned above, use the OBB site as they sell advance tickets at €39 single for the full trip. The SBB site sells the same tickets, but usually more expensive.

Myself & a friend did the complete journey from Zurich in late April last year & it was well worth it.

As I recall, the two sets are identical-OBB stock with an SBB observation car.

 

[Groningen]

Remember that in Buchs (Switzerland) the train changes direction.

 

[DaiGog]

As mentioned above, use the OBB site as they sell advance tickets at €39 single for the full trip. The SBB site sells the same tickets, but usually more expensive.

Myself & a friend did the complete journey from Zurich in late April last year & it was well worth it.

As I recall, the two sets are identical-OBB stock with an SBB observation car.

The cheaper tickets were indeed on the OBB site, and included a check box to reserve in the 'Panoramawagen' at a small cost (IIRC 3 euros each).

It's well worth the trip in the panorama coach - in the event, despite checking the box to reserve seats in there, we were allocated seats in an ordinary first class coach, but there were plenty of seats available from Zurich in there. The scenery, once you pop out of the long tunnel out of Zurich, is pretty much unbroken all the way to Graz. Thoroughly recommended!

 

[LNW-GW Joint]

The cheaper tickets were indeed on the OBB site, and included a check box to reserve in the 'Panoramawagen' at a small cost (IIRC 3 euros each).

That'll be the standard €3 reservation fee for any seat.
It's not a supplement for the panorama car.

 

[philjo]

Thanks all for your various comments/suggestions.
How far in advance do bookings open for this service?
I'm getting the important dates together so I can book the various legs of the trip when they open.

After the week walking in Schladming I am planning a couple of days in Vienna then returning probably via Cologne/Brussels (possibly using the sleeper).

 

[DaiGog]

Thanks all for your various comments/suggestions.
How far in advance do bookings open for this service?
I'm getting the important dates together so I can book the various legs of the trip when they open.

After the week walking in Schladming I am planning a couple of days in Vienna then returning probably via Cologne/Brussels (possibly using the sleeper).

Generally, 90 days before travel, as is the case in the UK.

Obviously I don't know what your budget is, but I would recommend the Motel One outside Wien Hbf if you intend to stay in Vienna. Excellent quality and well worth the price (typically 59 Euro per night booked in advance, in my experience) and there is also one at Westbahnhof. Just don't do what I did - book one and turn up at the other........

 

[Bletchleyite]

Obviously I don't know what your budget is, but I would recommend the Motel One outside Wien Hbf if you intend to stay in Vienna. Excellent quality and well worth the price (typically 59 Euro per night booked in advance, in my experience) and there is also one at Westbahnhof. Just don't do what I did - book one and turn up at the other........

I did that in Edinburgh, fortunately they are less than 5 minutes' walk apart.

Motel One are absolutely excellent - certainly my first choice of budget hotel if available, and TBH I'd choose them over many low to mid-range hotels like Ibis or Mercure. It's hard to believe their prices compare well with the awful Travelodge.

 

[LNW-GW Joint]

I try and use Intercity Hotels (part of DB I think, and usually adjacent to main stations), as they give you a free transport ticket for the duration of your stay.
There's one near Vienna Westbf.

I booked my Geneva-Feldkirch-Graz trip on the ÖBB site, nearly 6 months in advance.

 

[philjo]

Thanks for the hotel suggestions.
The ÖBB site seems to be harder to use than the old one.
It seems to hang in Safari -can't get past the initial search results listing of the journey options. then reverts back to today's date.
Not much more success in Firefox.

I tried a couple of sample dates in October 2016.
maybe it works better if I log in first?
The old site I used a couple of years ago never had this problem (though that site kept reverting back to German on about every 3rd click!).