A Giesl Austerity [SOLVED]

[Greenhead156]

I hope someone can help me identify the loco and the location on the photo below:

From the image caption, I only have this information: this is a National Coal Board West Midlands Division Austerity, photographed in 1961. I also have the information that 22 sets of Giesl ejectors for Austerity locos were delivered to NCB. [EDITED] The latter info must be incomplete, however, as I managed to identify 28 NCB Austerities with Giesls:

1. Hunslet 2859/1943: Giesl-equipped in 1959 at Baddesley Colliery, No. 1, also fitted with smoke arrester
2. [ADDED] Hunslet 2878/1944: in the 1960s at Shilbottle/Ashington network, No. 46
3. Hunslet 2895/1943: in the 1960s at Granville Colliery ("Granville No. ?")
4. [ADDED] Hunslet 3160/1944: Giesl-equipped in 1961 at Deep Pit Colliery, fitted with smoke arrester, in 1962 moved to Sneyd then Victoria Colliery, 1965 to Norton Colliery where it became No. 18
5. [ADDED] Hunslet 3191/1944: Giesl-equipped in 1960 at Whitburn Colliery, No. 9 then No. 2 from 1963, stint at Lambton/Philadelphia in 1965/66 where it became No. 2B, Wearmouth Colliery from 1966
6. Hunslet 3196/1944: Giesl-equipped in 1965, Ashington network, No. 53
7. Hunslet 3302/1945: in the 1960s at the Walkden network, "Stanley"
8. Hunslet 3692/1950: by end-of-1960s at Cronton Colliery, "Monty"
9. Hunslet 3695/1950: at Bickershaw Colliery, had a Giesl by the early 1970s, "Rodney"
10. Hunslet 3696/1950: in the 1960s at the Walkden network, "Respite"
11. Hunslet 3698/1950: in the 1960s at the Walkden network, "Repulse"
12. Hunslet 3699/1950: in the 1960s at the Walkden network, "Revenge"
13. Hunslet 3771/1952: in the 1960s at Granville Colliery, "Granville No. 5"
14. Hunslet 3778/1952: in the 1960s at the Walkden network, "Warspite"
15. Hunslet 3779/1952: in the 1960s at Cronton Colliery, "Robin Hill"
16. [ADDED] Hunslet 3808/1954: Giesl-equipped in 1960 at the Walkden network
17. Hunslet 3809/1954: in the 1960s at the Wemyss network as No. 18
18. Hunslet 3823/1954: in the 1960s at the Walkden network, "Warrior" (later renamed "Fred" at Bickershaw Colliery)
19. Hunslet 3831/1955: in the 1960s at Bickershaw Colliery, "Stanley"
20. Hunslet 3837/1955: in the 1960s at the Wemyss network as No. 20, later No. 21 (still later at Comrie Colliery as No. 5)
21. Hunslet 3843/1956: in the 1960s at the Walkden network, "Wizard"
22. Hudswell Clarke 1778/1945: in the 1960s at the Walkden network, "Charles"
23. [ADDED] Vulcan Foundry 5278/1945: in the 1960s at the Ashington network, No. 26
24. Vulcan Foundry 5306/1945: in the 1960s at Whittle Colliery, No. 33
25. Robert Stephenson & Hawthorn 7104/1943: Giesl-equipped in 1960, Whittle Colliery, No. 44
26. [ADDED] Robert Stephenson & Hawthorn 7178/1943: Giesl-equipped in 1967, Ashington network, No. 27
27. Bagnall 2750/1943: in the 1960s at Woodhorn Colliery, No. 49
28. Bagnall 2777/1945: Giesl added in 1968 at Comrie Colliery

Now, the only one on the list stationed at a West Midlands Division colliery is the first, but I can't find photos of that weird footbridge, and Baddesley Colliery seems to have had wooden plank hoppers with a bright "X" mark rather than the steel hoppers on the photo. If the division info is wrong, the lack of a nameplate on the side of the saddle tank and the year 1961 excludes most of the others, leaving the two from the Wemyss network and the two Whittle Colliery locos, but no luck with the footbridge there either.

Any ideas?

 

[30907]

No ideas, but would that weird footbridge be some sort of conveyor? And is the signal identifiable?

 

[Johnuk123]

No ideas, but would that weird footbridge be some sort of conveyor? And is the signal identifiable?

I've never seen a footbridge like that I think some sort of conveyor could well be right.

 

[Arglwydd Golau]

More of a forlorn hope I know, but having a few spare minutes I had a look at some of my fathers rather poor photographs taken at Industrial locations in the early 1970's, much to my surprise there is a photo of one of the loco's on your list, Bagnall 2777 - taken at Comrie Colliery on 21/09/1972.
I know you mention NCB West Midlands Division and that the Giesl was only added in 1968 but Dad did make a note that it was ex WD Bicester...and of course what would WD be doing with steel hoppers? Clutching at straws here!

 

[Greenhead156]

I managed to identify the last of the 22 Giesl Austerities: it's Hunslet 3196/1944, or No. 53 at Ashington. I updated the first post accordingly.

As a result, I can narrow the search down to three+1 networks (Baddesley/Kingsbury, Wemyss, Whittle/Ashington/Backworth; and Comrie where Hunslet 3837 ended its career) and seven locos. But there are elements that match and don't match for all. For the Ashington locos: they all had a plate covering the gap in the tank in front of the Giesl ejector but they pulled steel hoppers like on the mystery photo. (The last loco I found also had a large lamp in front of that plate.)

That weird bridge may well be a conveyor, but it is weird for that, too: I can't recognise a loader at the end or a continuation to the left of the tracks.

 

[30907]

The hoppers strongly suggest NER territory to me, and I rather think the signals are NER too.

 

[Greenhead156]

The hoppers strongly suggest NER territory to me, and I rather think the signals are NER too.

You were right!

One month later, after inquiries in multiple other forums and checking every possible detail in the photo with literally hundreds of Google image searches, I have finally identified both the loco and the location with 100% certainty.

The loco: Hunslet 3191/1944.

This loco was equipped with a Giesl ejector at Whitburn Colliery (south of South Shields) in 1960. At the time, it was No. 9, but was re-numbered No. 2 in 1963. The loco was nicknamed "Funkenbanger" and drivers didn't like it. Books claim that the Giesl ejector was removed in 1963, but a later photo (below) contradicts this: rather, the changes were the addition of a third side footboard and a wasp pattern on the buffer beam. In December 1965, it was moved to Lambton/Philadelphia, where it was re-numbered No. 2B. Already in June 1966, it was moved to Wearmouth Colliery, where it was scrapped in 1969.

I found one single photo of the loco (being sold at eBid), which shows it in its modified state in May 1966, heading cab first for Philadelphia:

The location: just north-west of Whitburn Colliery, near what was Marsden Village, looking south-east.

For Whitburn Colliery itself, see this aerial photo (looking north). At top left, you can barely see a signal box and sidings, two of which continued for several hundred metres where the line ran between Whitburn Quarry and the one-time village of Marsden (see aerial imagehttp://www.disused-stations.org.uk/m/marsden/marsden_village_aerial3.jpg and ground-level photos looking south-east and looking north-west). The sidings passed coal drops and lime kilns (both still visible), and in front of those, the westernmost siding ran in a trench (see this aerial photo of the northern half of the sidings, with the end of the trench section at bottom). On the above-mentioned ground-level photo looking north-west, you can see the signal gantry with three signals, from the opposite direction compared to my photo. What appear to be two more signals to the left of the triple signal on my photo are actually the chimneys of Marsden Village post office, the only building of the village still standing today.

The mystery bridge was in front of the lime kilns, and I found a 1968 photo from another angle:

It appears to have been a conveyor of sorts, after all, ending in a loader that was almost completely covered by the loco on my photo (though now I recognise that both the edge of its bottom and its top left corner are barely visible).

I thank for the hints I received from the posters here, they helped in my search.

 

[30907]

Fascinating piece of research, thanks.