Changes to international trains from the Netherlands in 2025

[DanielB]

The new timetable as of December 15th, 2024 includes many changes to the international trains to and from the Netherlands, which I'll summarize in this post. Full details are also visible in the journey planners like at bahn.de.

• The current intercity Amsterdam - Brussels will cease to exist. Instead a new Eurocity Direct will run from Lelystad Centrum via Amsterdam South to Brussels South, calling only at Antwerp Central and Brussels South after Rotterdam. Journey time will be reduced to 2 hours and 8 minutes. This service is operated with Belgium-compatible ICNG sets (initially complemented with a few Traxx + ICRmh sets). Saver tickets start as of € 16 (Rotterdam - Antwerp)
• Additional to the Eurocity Direct a new EuroCity will run from Rotterdam Central to Brussels South (via the same route as the current intercity), operated by NMBS I11 coaches hauled by a Traxx. This doubles the number of trains between Rotterdam and Brussels from 16 to 32 a day. Saver tickets start as of € 10,10 (Rotterdam - Antwerp). More details at NS International.
• A new ICE service (224/225) will run from Amsterdam Central to Munich once a day.
• The Nightjet from Amsterdam Central to Vienna / Innsbruck is rerouted via the border crossing at Bad Bentheim and will call at Amersfoort Central, Deventer, Münster, Hamm, Kassel and Würzburg before continueing via the current route. As of April apparently the new Nightjet trainsets will operate on this route.
• The Nightjet from Amsterdam Central to Zürich HB is rerouted via the border crossing at Venlo and will call at Utrecht Central and Eindhoven Central prior to continueing to Cologne and further into Switzerland.

Overall some nice improvement, though there are several downsides as well. Discounts in the Netherlands will not be valid on Eurocity Direct south of Rotterdam, which will significantly increase the ticket prices for subscription holders (currently you do get discounts on the Dutch portion of the route). And as ICE 224 and 225 are ran by the same train, arrival of the return working in Amsterdam is quite late in the evening (around 23.00 hrs), which makes it less attractive for who has some onward travel to reach home. The train towards Munich is timed better in that respect.
Also the ECD has a lengthy stop in Antwerp to be overtaken by a Eurostar and does not call in Brussels North, resulting in a journey like Rotterdam - Luxembourg actually taking 4 minutes longer using the ECD compared to using the slower EC instead.

 

[30907]

• The Nightjet from Amsterdam Central to Vienna / Innsbruck is rerouted via the border crossing at Bad Bentheim and will call at Amersfoort Central, Deventer, Münster, Hamm, Kassel and Würzburg before continueing via the current route. As of April apparently the new Nightjet trainsets will operate on this route.
• The Nightjet from Amsterdam Central to Zürich HB is rerouted via the border crossing at Venlo and will call at Utrecht Central and Eindhoven Central prior to continueing to Cologne and further into Switzerland.

Are these long-term changes or connected with engineering work on the Emmerich route? Losing Duesseldorf/Koeln-Innsbruck would be a major loss.

 

[DanielB]

Are these long-term changes or connected with engineering work on the Emmerich route? Losing Duesseldorf/Koeln-Innsbruck would be a major loss.

A bit of both. This timetable it is due to the lengthy engineering works on the Emmerich - Oberhausen route, but the Rhein-Ruhr area is also seen as a major contributor to the unreliability of the Amsterdam Nightjet.

In the longer term plans, there is a topic elsewhere in this forum section, they want to operate the Vienna and Innsbruck portions seperately (with longer trains to Vienna). Then Amsterdam - Vienna is routed via Amersfoort - Deventer - Bad Bentheim and Amsterdam - Innsbruck via Utrecht - Arnhem - Emmerich when I'm not mistaken.

 

[duesselmartin]

that Vienna diversion would mean loosing Cologne to the Bruxelles portion. Hopefully it will run daily in the future then.

 

[eastwestdivide]

Do we know if Interrail tickets will be valid with no supplements on both the new BE/NL Eurocity and Eurocity Direct services?

 

[Nunners]

that Vienna diversion would mean loosing Cologne to the Bruxelles portion. Hopefully it will run daily in the future then.

That's now combined with the Paris train rather than the Amsterdam

 

[rvdborgt]

Do we know if Interrail tickets be valid with no supplements on both the new BE/NL Eurocity and Eurocity Direct services?

That should indeed be the case. The EC doesn't have any supplements anyway and for the ECD NS confirmed this to the consumers' organisations but there doesn't seem to be any information online yet.

 

[johncrossley]

I got an email from SNCB International about this. One thing to note is that flexible tickets are not interchangable between Eurocity and Eurocity Direct.

 

[30907]

In the longer term plans, there is a topic elsewhere in this forum section, they want to operate the Vienna and Innsbruck portions seperately (with longer trains to Vienna). Then Amsterdam - Vienna is routed via Amersfoort - Deventer - Bad Bentheim and Amsterdam - Innsbruck via Utrecht - Arnhem - Emmerich when I'm not mistaken.

Thanks.
Running longer trains to Vienna must mean de-coupling it from the Hamburg train - interesting!

 

[rvdborgt]

NMBS/SNCB now confirmed in their 'product sheets' that passes and FIP are valid in EC and ECD.

 

[citycat]

I gather from another site that there is going to be a Brussels to Paris EC service too. Anybody know what kind of stock will be on it?

 

[popeter45]

Thanks.
Running longer trains to Vienna must mean de-coupling it from the Hamburg train - interesting!

wonder if that could lead to re-adding car wagons to the hamburg train?, both ends still have car facilities that are still both in use

 

[signed]

Brussels to Paris EC service too

SNCB competing with themselves? That could be good, or will that be ran by NS (which could be very weird for SNCB/NS relations)?

 

[rvdborgt]

I gather from another site that there is going to be a Brussels to Paris EC service too. Anybody know what kind of stock will be on it?

I11 NMBS/SNCB plus an 18. It will run as Ouigo Classique, because SNCF.

Brussel-Zuid 07:38, 13:38 and 18:38 (Mon-Sat)/19:38 (Sun).
Intermediate stops at Mons, Aulnoye and Creil, Brussels-Paris in about 3 hours.

Departure from Paris Nord at 08:28 (Sat/Sun), 12:28 and 19:15.
They're still discussing the exact departure time of the first train Mon-Fri. I guess paths around 8:30 are scarce.
Interrail/Eurail validity is supposedly still under discussion.

 

[citycat]

SNCB competing with themselves? That could be good, or will that be ran by NS (which could be very weird for SNCB/NS relations)?

SNCB running it apparently

 

[signed]

SNCB running it apparently

That can't make any less sense, they're litterally shareholders in Eurostar, are they selling? Nevermind

 

[rvdborgt]

SNCB running it apparently

It's going to be a co-operation with SNCF.

 

[signed]

Brussels-Paris in about 3 hours.

It's a slow service then, let's see if that sees more success than IzY (the former low-cost spinoff of Thalys)

 

[rvdborgt]

It's a slow service then,

Kind of. The pre-HSL non-stop services did Brussels-Paris in 2.5 hours, so they loose a bit of time on top of the 3 stops.

 

[30907]

wonder if that could lead to re-adding car wagons to the hamburg train?, both ends still have car facilities that are still both in use

The capacity created is Vienna-Nuremberg(-Amsterdam) though as the Innsbruck-Hamburg portion will still run (as will Innsbruck-Amsterdam).

 

[Austriantrain]

The capacity created is Vienna-Nuremberg(-Amsterdam) though as the Innsbruck-Hamburg portion will still run (as will Innsbruck-Amsterdam).

The new NJ sets obviously don’t allow car carriers anymore when they run double. I expect car transport to be even further reduced to seasonal holiday night trains such as Bratislava - Split.

Vienna - Hamburg was quite popular though in season for Scandinavia holiday travelers wanting to reduce driving distance. And for motorcyclists of course.

 

[Fragezeichnen]

Almost unbelievably in this day and age, a brand new car loading facility is to be built in Hamburg in the next couple of years(DB InfraGo was forced to do so after losing a court case brought by passenger interest groups). It would be ironic and rather embarrassing if it ends up never being used!

 

[Ianigsy]

I11 NMBS/SNCB plus an 18. It will run as Ouigo Classique, because SNCF.

Brussel-Zuid 07:38, 13:38 and 18:38 (Mon-Sat)/19:38 (Sun).
Intermediate stops at Mons, Aulnoye and Creil, Brussels-Paris in about 3 hours.

Departure from Paris Nord at 08:28 (Sat/Sun), 12:28 and 19:15.
They're still discussing the exact departure time of the first train Mon-Fri. I guess paths around 8:30 are scarce.
Interrail/Eurail validity is supposedly still under discussion.

I remember from a visit to Mons in 2015 that losing the “TGV Wallon” was a contentious local issue - ten years to sort it out seems to be about par for the course with Belgian project management!

 

[MarcVD]

I remember from a visit to Mons in 2015 that losing the “TGV Wallon” was a contentious local issue - ten years to sort it out seems to be about par for the course with Belgian project management!

Solving this 10 years old issue is just a happy coincidence. The goal of this operation is to "occupy the terrain" before another company does.