Chiltern Main Line - Broken Down Freight Train and Met Line extension to Aylesbury

[aylesbury2]

Chiltern have confirmed that trains are being diverted via AYS on the Princes Risborough branch line, is any more known at this time?

 

[67018]

Just got this email from the Chiltern alert service:

The northbound London to Birmingham line is blocked due to a broken down freight train. We currently estimate that services will be able to resume from 18:00. Thereafter we anticipate that there may be some delays and last minute cancellations as we get the service back to normal.

Ticket acceptance is in place with Virgin, London Midland, FGW and Arriva bus route 300 bet. Aylesbury and High Wycombe.

We apologise for the disruption this evening.

 

[Nippy]

6Z34 failed just north of Gerrards Cross.

 

[tsr]

I understand there's a problem with the engine (or related systems) of the locomotive on 6Z34. I believe Chiltern staff are attending the incident to try to help fix the fault ASAP, even though it is not their train.

EDIT: 6Z34 is now on the move, after nearly 3 hours at a standstill.

 

[aylesbury2]

I was thinking of going down to AYS to get a look at some of the 'Mainline' stock which is rarely seen there, but it sounds like it'll be a wasted journey, I'm not sure where the reversing from the AYS-MYB via AMR to the AYS-PRR lines is done, probably just south of the platforms so I probably would've had to look from through the Lloyds Bank building's car park fence to get an indirect view.

 

[67018]

Last time I was diverted that way, I'm sure the trains reversed in the platforms at Aylesbury. So probably worth a look, although might be too late if they've got the freight moving now.

 

[sammyg901]

The reversal / change ends is usually done in P2 of Aylesbury station which can access both lines.

 

[aylesbury2]

Last time I was diverted that way, I'm sure the trains reversed in the platforms at Aylesbury. So probably worth a look, although might be too late if they've got the freight moving now.

The reversal / change ends is usually done in P2 of Aylesbury station which can access both lines.

I fear it probably is too late, thanks for the info as I was very interested to know what happens in this very rare situation - nothing more exciting than this happens down at Aylesbury unfortunately!

 

[168lover]

67012 was the loco that came to the rescue. I was stuck at Gerrards Cross and I saw it going through light head towards the location of the freight train and then saw it going through Wycombe with the freight train in tow. I had to get back on a replacement bus service. I have to applaud how quick Chiltern got buses and how helpful their staff were.
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nothing more exciting than this happens down at Aylesbury unfortunately!

You are not wrong there, you do get mainline stock going to and from the depot thoe.

 

[aylesbury2]

67012 was the loco that came to the rescue. I was stuck at Gerrards Cross and I saw it going through light head towards the location of the freight train and then saw it going through Wycombe with the freight train in tow. I had to get back on a replacement bus service. I have to applaud how quick Chiltern got buses and how helpful their staff were.

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You are not wrong there, you do get mainline stock going to and from the depot thoe.

Yep, we get the occasional 168 (very appropriate name btw ) and once in a blue moon 172s for the depot coming up via PRR. In over a decade of commuting quite regularly for both business and leisure, I think I've been on 2 168s, the rest 165s - a clear vast majority.

 

[67018]

You are not wrong there, you do get mainline stock going to and from the depot thoe.

There is also the odd 168 on Aylesbury services, to heighten the excitement - for example weekday 2H67 1628 Aylesbury to London Marylebone is a 168 (or certainly was recently).

 

[aylesbury2]

There is also the odd 168 on Aylesbury services, to heighten the excitement - for example weekday 2H67 1628 Aylesbury to London Marylebone is a 168 (or certainly was recently).

Yep, although a weekday service at that time (especially one heading in to London) is probably used by very few people - the ultimate definition of off-peak!

 

[168lover]

Yep, we get the occasional 168 (very appropriate name btw ) and once in a blue moon 172s for the depot coming up via PRR. In over a decade of commuting quite regularly for both business and leisure, I think I've been on 2 168s, the rest 165s - a clear vast majority.

In my 5 trips to Aylesbury I have seen 3 168s, the banbury loco haul set, a 66 and a 121. The rest of the trains have been 165s.

 

[MichaelAMW]

Yep, although a weekday service at that time (especially one heading in to London) is probably used by very few people - the ultimate definition of off-peak!

In fact, there is quite a lot of school-related traffic in the Amersham-Aylesbury-Wycombe triangle - Bucks still has grammar schools so there is a fair bit of long-distance (for a school journey) travel - and this helps fill the afternoon trains. I should have thought that by that time the travel home from work in Aylesbury would also be picking up, but unlike my remark about the schools that's speculation.

 

[aylesbury2]

School buses are still undoubtedly the preferred option and I don't know of anyone who takes the train however - news to me.

 

[168lover]

In fact, there is quite a lot of school-related traffic in the Amersham-Aylesbury-Wycombe triangle - Bucks still has grammar schools so there is a fair bit of long-distance (for a school journey) travel - and this helps fill the afternoon trains. I should have thought that by that time the travel home from work in Aylesbury would also be picking up, but unlike my remark about the schools that's speculation.

For anybody that is not aware I am fourteen. My old secondary school in Wycombe(I have recently moved to a secondary school in Gerrards Cross) had quite alot of people taking the train to and from school everyday from Aylesbury. Even now at Gerrards Cross one of my friends comes in from Wendover everyday.

 

[aylesbury2]

For anybody that is not aware I am fourteen. My old secondary school in Wycombe(I have recently moved to a secondary school in Gerrards Cross) had quite alot of people taking the train to and from school everyday from Aylesbury. Even now at Gerrards Cross one of my friends comes in from Wendover everyday.

Maybe one day I'll be at AYS at this sort of time (going to MYB for a concert etc.) to see for myself, perhaps there is a lot of traffic coming in to Aylesbury rather than out of it at this time of day. Most commuters coming back in from London won't be doing so until after 5 I wouldn't have thought.

 

[67018]

Maybe one day I'll be at AYS at this sort of time (going to MYB for a concert etc.) to see for myself, perhaps there is a lot of traffic coming in to Aylesbury rather than out of it at this time of day. Most commuters coming back in from London won't be doing so until after 5 I wouldn't have thought.

The reason the working I pointed out is a 168 is probably more to do with positioning of stock - this particular journey joins onto another 168 at Marylebone ro form the (7-car) 1747 to Birmingham - which is one of the busiest peak time trains.

 

[168lover]

67012 Shropshire Lad at Gerrards Cross waiting to go into the Carriage sidings to eventually couple onto the freight train and tow it out of the way.

 

[aylesbury2]

The reason the working I pointed out is a 168 is probably more to do with positioning of stock - this particular journey joins onto another 168 at Marylebone ro form the (7-car) 1747 to Birmingham - which is one of the busiest peak time trains.

Yeah, that or maintenance is the simply only reason why you'd ever see a 168 at AYS, it simply doesn't make sense for Chiltern to have its main intercity stock working this slow commuter line. If only things had been different and Beeching hadn't shut the GCML to Rugby and beyond.

Personally, in the future (when I probably will have moved and will no longer be a resident of the Aylesbury Vale - I don't live anywhere near the town centre btw), I'd like to see either the Met Line re-extended to AYS when the need for electrification comes, or for Chiltern to take over the Met Line, transfer it to NR-only and then to electrify it. The line speed is so ridiculously slow with both operators running on it, one with DMUs and one with S Stock, it needs to transfer to one or the other, and should be electrified sooner or later anyway. Aylesbury has had no investment whatsoever since the early 2000s with the exception of AVP which on the whole is pointless.
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HS2 seems so likely to go ahead that I think any opposition is stupid now, however the Labour Party have been examining the possibility of it being a (partly already existing) HS2 alternative. This seems very unlikely though!

 

[NickBucks]

The John Colet school in Wendover and one of the schools in Rickmansworth provide quite a few passengers for the mid afternoon trains.

 

[t_star2001uk]

The John Colet school in Wendover and one of the schools in Rickmansworth provide quite a few passengers for the mid afternoon trains.

Yes i had a train full of the little darlings earlier on a Rickmansworth....lol

 

[CyrusWuff]

I was thinking of going down to AYS to get a look at some of the 'Mainline' stock which is rarely seen there, but it sounds like it'll be a wasted journey, I'm not sure where the reversing from the AYS-MYB via AMR to the AYS-PRR lines is done, probably just south of the platforms so I probably would've had to look from through the Lloyds Bank building's car park fence to get an indirect view.

It would have been a wasted journey, as the loco-hauled sets can't run via Amersham as neither the 67s nor the DVTs (nor the Class 172s) are fitted with tripcocks.

As such (ignoring platform lengths for a moment) the furthest they'd be able to go is Harrow-on-the-Hill (Northbound) or Amersham (Southbound).

 

[aylesbury2]

It would have been a wasted journey, as the loco-hauled sets can't run via Amersham as neither the 67s nor the DVTs (nor the Class 172s) are fitted with tripcocks.

As such (ignoring platform lengths for a moment) the furthest they'd be able to go is Harrow-on-the-Hill (Northbound) or Amersham (Southbound).

I know, I was just thinking in terms of 168s (which have the tripcock) as I haven't seen one there for a long while.

 

[67018]

Personally, in the future (when I probably will have moved and will no longer be a resident of the Aylesbury Vale - I don't live anywhere near the town centre btw), I'd like to see either the Met Line re-extended to AYS when the need for electrification comes, or for Chiltern to take over the Met Line, transfer it to NR-only and then to electrify it. The line speed is so ridiculously slow with both operators running on it, one with DMUs and one with S Stock, it needs to transfer to one or the other, and should be electrified sooner or later anyway. Aylesbury has had no investment whatsoever since the early 2000s with the exception of AVP which on the whole is pointless.

Sounds like a good starter for at least one new thread there, although I think the debate has been done to death before. Trouble is, Aylesbury commuters won't like a lengthy trek on S stock, nor will Met line users welcome losing their direct link to the City in favour of being dumped at Marylebone, which is (relatively speaking) a bit of a PITA to get to/from.

I wouldn't call AVP pointless given the huge amount of new housing being built there. And East-West rail will add connectivity to Milton Keynes, so investment is on the way. There are plenty of places that do worse, as the 'North of England getting a rough deal' thread reminds us!

 

[aylesbury2]

I wouldn't call AVP pointless given the huge amount of new housing being built there. And East-West rail will add connectivity to Milton Keynes, so investment is on the way. There are plenty of places that do worse, as the 'North of England getting a rough deal' thread reminds us!

I would. As I've stated in a previous thread ("East Midlands Parkway - pointless? "), the houses are in a very unattractive area, and there are a multitude of reasons why they are a hard sell. Local estate agents I've spoken to as part of a research project have stated that many are empty and pretty much all sales are to people on the first rung of the housing ladder who have no alternative other than Help to Buy.

 

[67018]

I would. As I've stated in a previous thread ("East Midlands Parkway - pointless? "), the houses are in a very unattractive area, and there are a multitude of reasons why they are a hard sell. Local estate agents I've spoken to as part of a research project have stated that many are empty and pretty much all sales are to people on the first rung of the housing ladder who have no alternative other than Help to Buy.

Now this is an interesting one. Elsewhere, people lament the lack of affordable housing in the South East, and the pressure it puts on essential workers on lowish wages. And yet here are some houses in quite a decent location, handy for commuting, and presumably selling for affordable prices (assuming demand is as low as you say). Sounds like a good thing, no?

Doubtless the area will become more attractive as it develops as well. After all, if this logic had been used, big chunks of the London Underground would never have been built, with their stations opening in the middle of fields.

 

[aylesbury2]

Now this is an interesting one. Elsewhere, people lament the lack of affordable housing in the South East, and the pressure it puts on essential workers on lowish wages. And yet here are some houses in quite a decent location, handy for commuting, and presumably selling for affordable prices (assuming demand is as low as you say). Sounds like a good thing, no?

Doubtless the area will become more attractive as it develops as well. After all, if this logic had been used, big chunks of the London Underground would never have been built, with their stations opening in the middle of fields.

This is what I said:

I think Aylesbury Vale Parkway has to be one of the most pointless stations built - it cost over £10 million, is a whopping 4 minutes away from the town centre station and is surrounded by unoccupied new houses. I'm sorry, but who would want to live on the Berryfields development? It's on a floodplain with noisy overhead electric power lines running right across it, on a busy A road, next to the railway line (plus binliners running to Calvert 3 times a day), as well as being right next to the Rabans Lane tip and sewage plant. Lovely. Aylesbury never gets busy - there are way too many new empty car parks so the council are discounting them now at peak times - what's the point in having park and ride facilities for a small town which is absolutely terrible for shopping.

Last year, only 81000 people used it, compared to over 1 million users at Aylesbury.

I'd like to add that the reason why I think the Met Line flopped originally was because of the decision to extend all the way to Verney Junction, which is over 50 miles from central Lobdon. Many villages between Aylesbury and Bicester are small, hence the lack of demand and eventual demise of the Met Line. Many current residents of these villages choose to go to Bicester North or MKC because the main line trains are on the whole so much more pleasant and an awful lot faster, despite the stations being situated much further north of London than Aylesbury.

I think passengers at Aylesbury would enjoy being able to use cheaper Oyster card fares - especially for kids where fares are significantly reduced. Whilst there are 8 more stops that some slow Met Line trains make, with only one operator on the Met Line there could be faster services which bypass the lesser-used stations like Moor Park and Northwood Hills due to there being just a single operator, and more train paths available as a result. The speed of the line could then be increased as TFL have plans to increase the voltage of the line which will mean higher speeds in the very near future. Things like toilets need to be sorted out, but the toilets on the 165s are awful compared to the main line trains, and it's not as if the 165s have tables for work (apart from a 10cmx10cm coffee holder), power sockets or a catering service, so nothing will be lost - but what's gained is newer, quieter, more comfortable rolling stock with better air conditioning (I know many Chiltern-defenders say that it's brilliant on 165s but it really isn't anything special - and they have a real lack of any facilities at all).

The S Stock is much better in terms of disabled access, and third/fourth rail electrification and the conversion to TFL signage beyond Amersham wouldn't cost very much at all. Chiltern could then run EWR services and also the freight 'binliners' via Risborough only (as is already planned or happening), leaving the seldom-used AVP to be served by EWR Chiltern services which stop at Aylesbury - passengers can then change with a frequent connection to get right into the heart of London with frequent Met Line services to stations with far better tube connection than the Bakerloo-only Marylebone such as King's Cross (for Eurostar too) and Baker Street.

I accept that this thread has now been hijacked!

 

[Cherry_Picker]

If some serious money was spent on that branch line then Aylesbury - London via Princes Risborough could probably be done in 40 minutes. Wont happen though.

 

[NickBucks]

And yet here are some houses in quite a decent location, handy for commuting, and presumably selling for affordable prices (assuming demand is as low as you say). Sounds like a good thing, no?

Doubtless the area will become more attractive as it develops as well. After all, if this logic had been used, big chunks of the London Underground would never have been built, with their stations opening in the middle of fields.

Not sure this is true. There are not many jobs being created in Aylesbury, It remains a commuter town principally to London but also to Milton Keynes as the new estates are north of the town. Aylesbury itself is not a good shopping centre. I suspect there are more attractive towns the same distance from London which have better transport prospects. The E-W line and Aylesbury- MK connection won't be available until 2019 at the earliest, There are no plans to improve the Aylesbury- Marylebone via Amersham service so as the op said selling the houses to the north of Aylesbury will not be easy. Okay Aylesbury Vale Parkway is there but the journey time on a packed 165 Turbo is not good and as other posters have said Marylebone is out of the way.

Best way forward would be to double track Princess Risborough- Aylesbury and electrify in the long term. Fast Marylebone - Aylesury services could then be run via that route.