Class 150 replaces 175 (Arriva Trains Wales)

[PacerTrain142]

hello everyone.


So I’m travelling down to Wales from Manchester. Booked seat reservations and was expecting a nice comfortable journey on a fast, quiet, smooth inter-city train to fly me into Wales.

But instead, what do I find? A 2 car 150 sitting there at man Piccadilly. No seat reservations, no trolley/buffet service, very cramped and very noisy, especially at high speeds. It’s so noisy I can barely even hear any of the other passengers speak. They might as well have put a pacer on. In fact, a 143 would be much better (and probably much quieter than this noisy beast). Give me a pacer any day!

Don’t get me wrong, the 150 is okay for short-medium distance journeys with plenty of stops.

But to use it on an inter city service on the main line with the engine going full pelt for long periods at just 75 mph?? No thanks.


The poor engine seems to be getting tired. It keeps cutting out and then starting up again.


Oh well, at least it has free WiFi and seat trays (though these are very dirty).


The poor engine must be exhausted, we have been going at full throttle for miles now and it’s sooooo noisy and slow. It would probably be faster to drive there!


So anyone who travels frequently with this operator, is this a regular thing?




EDIT: It gets worse. Just been in the loo. Struggled to lock the door, took me a few times to lock it. Dirty toilet and guess what no water and no soap from the soap dispenser. I’m sorry but this just unacceptable.


This is the WORST train I have ever been on. It's nothing more than a noisy filthy rot box. ;(

It should be the 150's that should be scrapped, not the pacers.

Will probably have to put up with them for many more years sadly.

Especially as I live on the Colne-Preston branch it will probably just be 150's all the way once the pacers go.

There, I finally snapped.

 

[PHILIPE]

hello everyone.


So I’m travelling down to Wales from Manchester. Booked seat reservations and was expecting a nice comfortable journey on a fast, quiet, smooth inter-city train to fly me into Wales.

But instead, what do I find? A 2 car 150 sitting there at man Piccadilly. No seat reservations, no trolley/buffet service, very cramped and very noisy, especially at high speeds. It’s so noisy I can barely even hear any of the other passengers speak. They might as well have put a pacer on. In fact, a 143 would be much better (and probably much quieter than this noisy beast). Give me a pacer any day!

Don’t get me wrong, the 150 is okay for short-medium distance journeys with plenty of stops.

But to use it on an inter city service on the main line with the engine going full pelt for long periods at just 75 mph?? No thanks.


The poor engine seems to be getting tired. It keeps cutting out and then starting up again.


Oh well, at least it has free WiFi and seat trays (though these are very dirty).


The poor engine must be exhausted, we have been going at full throttle for miles now and it’s sooooo noisy and slow. It would probably be faster to drive there!


So anyone who travels frequently with this operator, is this a regular thing?

We now ask a regular question - would you have preferred the train to be cancelled ? ATW have a severe shortage of units at the present time and 150s are commonplace substituting on this route. On a Sunday, though, they have booked work due to 175s being in the wrong place and spread across the Network.

For some info, you might like to read this thread:-

www.railforums.co.uk/threads/atw-keolis-amey-wales-prm-fleet-updates.166304

 

[PacerTrain142]

We now ask a regular question - would you have preferred the train to be cancelled ? ATW have a severe shortage of units at the present time and 150s are commonplace substituting on this route. On a Sunday, though, they have booked work due to 175s being in the wrong place and spread across the Network.

For some info, you might like to read this thread:-

www.railforums.co.uk/threads/atw-keolis-amey-wales-prm-fleet-updates.166304

If that means travelling on suitable rolling stock for the route then yes I'd rather they cancelled it than put this old flea bag on.

 

[headshot119]

If that means travelling on suitable rolling stock for the route then yes I'd rather they cancelled it than put this old flea bag on.

Not many will agree with you.

I'd much rather something turned up to run the service than have to wait an hour for the next one, potentially missing connections further down the line.

 

[PacerTrain142]

Not many will agree with you.

I'd much rather something turned up to run the service than have to wait an hour for the next one, potentially missing connections further down the line.

I understand that, but once this train arrives at my destination then that’s it. At the moment my legs are cramped, my ears have had enough of the noise and the train is getting very busy.

Two carriages really isn’t enough for a service like this, they could at least strapped a 153 to the back or use a 3 car 143 instead.

 

[headshot119]

I understand that, but once this train arrives at my destination then that’s it. At the moment my legs are cramped, my ears have had enough of the noise and the train is getting very busy.

Two carriages really isn’t enough for a service like this, they could at least strapped a 153 to the back or use a 3 car 143 instead.

3 car 143s don't exist, and finding a 153 to tack onto the service would mean services elsewhere being short formed or cancelled.

At the same time, a 2 car 175 probably isn't enough by your logic either.

 

[PacerTrain142]

3 car 143s don't exist, and finding a 153 to tack onto the service would mean services elsewhere being short formed or cancelled.

At the same time, a 2 car 175 probably isn't enough by your logic either.

They don’t?

I’m sure I remember travelling on a 3 car 143 when I visited the reviera line in Devon last year.

 

[E_Reeves]

They don’t?

I’m sure I remember travelling on a 3 car 143 when I visited the reviera line in Devon last year.

They quite often put a 153 on the back of 143s down there, but no, 3 car 143s don't exist.

 

[LNW-GW Joint]

Not sure what train you were on but I would have considered changing at Shrewsbury and picking up the following Holyhead-Cardiff (depending on the hour).
And if you had a flexible ticket you could have gone via Birmingham on XC on a Voyager/170 with decent aircon.
ATW's refurbished 150s are normally a decent ride, if not up to 175 standard. You must have picked a bad day (though they do come round more often these days).
Summer Saturdays generally don't show the railways in their best light.

 

[Class465fan]

They quite often put a 153 on the back of 143s down there, but no, 3 car 143s don't exist.

I think he meant 144s instead of 143s.

 

[londonboi]

I would love to be a class 150 hurtling long distances at speed I bet the suspension is amazing

 

[Michael.Y]

I think he meant 144s instead of 143s.

Which makes even less sense as ATW have never operated 144s either.

IIRC Pacers aren't allowed on the Marches line beyond Abergavenny. They don't have tables or seat-back flip down tables, and have even more prehistoric facilities than the 150s.

Having worked 150s on the Marches to Holyhead and Manchester I haven't found them to be overly noisy or rattly and as previous posters have mentioned any train is better than no train - they can keep comfortably to the path and linespeed and their door layout means access and egress is a little smoother than 175s or 158s.

 

[Parallel]

There was a notification on JourneyCheck a few days ago for an ATW service from Manchester to South Wales that had was a 150 and had seat reservations enforced(!) and also no working toilet. So believe it or not, it could’ve been worse.

Pacers are not cleared north of Craven Arms and Shrewsbury and Crewe ATW crews don’t sign them.

3 car 143s not possible. As others have said, 2 x 143s or 143 + 153 are a common sight in Devon. Though you can also occasionally see 143 + 150 and there was also a 143 + 158 working once last year. GWR/FGW (a couple of years ago) did also run a 6-car Pacer formation in the afternoon from Exeter to Paignton and back, formed of 3x143s.

 

[class387]

If that means travelling on suitable rolling stock for the route then yes I'd rather they cancelled it than put this old flea bag on.

Why didn't you just wait for the next one then?

 

[Kneedown]

To answer one point, i'm afraid the engine reverting to idle, and then cutting back in after a while is a fault common to all 15X units, eapecially this time of year. It's caused by high coolant temperature during hot weather. The engine reverts to idle to prevent damage caused by overheating, and cuts back in when the coolant temperature has dropped sufficiently.

 

[6Gman]

I have travelled Cardiff - Crewe on a 150. Not brilliant, but better than two trainloads on the train an hour later.

 

[Polarbear]

Whilst a 150/2 isn't ideal for a long haul, it's loads better than a non-existent cancelled service.

Alos, whilst 150/2's may be basic, they're pretty tough old things. I remember when they did the likes of Hull - Chester in the late 1980's - and then they replaced 45's & Mk2's!

 

[daikilo]

The 150s were a huge improvement compared to the DMUs they replaced. Admitedly, time has taken its toll but at least the engine restarts by itself. Anyway, only five years left in the W&B franchise.

 

[dk1]

It's all well & good saying they should attatch a 153 to the formation but was there one available? I would very much doubt it. Unfortunately there just aren't spare DMUs sitting about with most franchises that operate them.

 

[Andy Pacer]

My personal problem with a 150 is the seat layout, there always seems to be wasted space, presumably all those doors don’t help ether! Give me 2x153 any day!!

 

[6Gman]

PacerTrain142 may be too young to remember but in the early 1980s there was an evening service Hereford to Crewe operated by one of those First Generation 3-car Suburban units. 3+2 seating and a door to each bay. Now that was heavy going.

 

[High Dyke]

Perhaps the OP would've preferred a rail replacement bus instead...?

 

[Ibex]

I noticed one of the Birmingham International - Aberystwyth / Pwllheli's was a 158+150 vice two 158's one day this week (Wednesday?). The 150 was coming off at Shrewsbury (no ERTMS of course) and the Pwllheli portion was cancelled. No sign of any road transport from Machynlleth either, pretty poor for a two hourly service.

 

[sw1ller]

Which makes even less sense as ATW have never operated 144s either.

IIRC Pacers aren't allowed on the Marches line beyond Abergavenny. They don't have tables or seat-back flip down tables, and have even more prehistoric facilities than the 150s.

Having worked 150s on the Marches to Holyhead and Manchester I haven't found them to be overly noisy or rattly and as previous posters have mentioned any train is better than no train - they can keep comfortably to the path and linespeed and their door layout means access and egress is a little smoother than 175s or 158s.

I will say, having worked these trains for some time now, there is one 150, when travelling in a certain direction, is very, very noisey. So much so that it’s common for a guard to pop in to see if I’ve got all the windows open or even the gangway door in the cab! I can’t hear it myself driving but it must be bad! Had a few guards mention it to me now. Need to remember which one it is.

 

[PHILIPE]

I noticed one of the Birmingham International - Aberystwyth / Pwllheli's was a 158+150 vice two 158's one day this week (Wednesday?). The 150 was coming off at Shrewsbury (no ERTMS of course) and the Pwllheli portion was cancelled. No sign of any road transport from Machynlleth either, pretty poor for a two hourly service.

ATW posted on Journey Check and are still doing, due to the number of cancellations at the moment, providing road transport by Lloyds Coaches. 150s working to Birmingham in similar circumstances are quite frequent lately.

 

[Parallel]

150s also frequently turn up on Cardiff - Holyhead runs too which is probably just as inappropriate. But again, better than nothing.

 

[trainophile]

Maybe the OP was travelling on an Advance ticket, so waiting for the next train wasn't an option.

I was at Piccadilly today and saw the offending train, my husband who had come to meet me and had been there most of the morning (he likes looking at trains and stations) told me all the hourly ATWs had been 2-coachers in the previous few hours. By a stroke of luck we were booked on the 1431, a 3-coach 175 with plenty of seats for everyone, and then some. I imagine a lot of the travelling public had headed home to watch the football or tennis by then, so it seemed a bit strange to put on more capacity just when it ceased to be needed.

As an aside, both mainline stations I used today (MAN and Liverpool South Parkway) were extremely busy, even for a sunny Saturday. On the 1220 which started from South Parkway to Man Picc people were having to stand even on departure from LPY. The 2-coach 175 that conveyed my husband up from Hereford was also rammed by Shrewsbury.

While waiting for the bus outside Hereford station just before 1700, we saw a train that appeared to be five or six coaches long but was presumably two sets coupled together, heading north. Wondered if this was to relieve problems tomorrow.

 

[Edgeley]

With their cramped legroom, lack of window views and noise 150s really are awful things. Hopefully they rapidly follow the pacers out of the door.

 

[PHILIPE]

Maybe the OP was travelling on an Advance ticket, so waiting for the next train wasn't an option.

I was at Piccadilly today and saw the offending train, my husband who had come to meet me and had been there most of the morning (he likes looking at trains and stations) told me all the hourly ATWs had been 2-coachers in the previous few hours. By a stroke of luck we were booked on the 1431, a 3-coach 175 with plenty of seats for everyone, and then some. I imagine a lot of the travelling public had headed home to watch the football or tennis by then, so it seemed a bit strange to put on more capacity just when it ceased to be needed.

As an aside, both mainline stations I used today (MAN and Liverpool South Parkway) were extremely busy, even for a sunny Saturday. On the 1220 which started from South Parkway to Man Picc people were having to stand even on departure from LPY. The 2-coach 175 that conveyed my husband up from Hereford was also rammed by Shrewsbury.

While waiting for the bus outside Hereford station just before 1700, we saw a train that appeared to be five or six coaches long but was presumably two sets coupled together, heading north. Wondered if this was to relieve problems tomorrow.

The rear 3 were locked out. I suspect they were being taken home to Chester for repairs. It could have been the 3 Car one that stopped the job at Ebbw Vale yesterday evening. A 175/0 had to be scrambled later to rescue.

 

[Parallel]

I actually was on a 5 car ATW operated 175 on the Wednesday just gone. I think a lot of services were disrupted due to the fatality on the line between Gobowen and Chirk earlier in the day. Clearly they'd been coupled together for pathing, and to help get units back in the right place. All 5 coaches were available for use, too.