Crewe to Birmingham fares and routes

[adrock1976]

I have had a quick look at the various fares between the above and have noticed that as well as the Any Permitted (set by LNWR), there are also 2 sets of Advance fares that are set by Arriva Trains Wales being "Via Shrewsbury" and "ATW Only".

My intended trip is in December, but I would like to travel via Shrewsbury on the outbound (with a break of journey at SHR) and return via Stafford. I have used the GWR website (Mixing Deck) and by inputting "Shrewsbury" in the Via field, the only journey that it shows is the 07:34 ATW direct train to Birmingham International via Shrewsbury. No other trains are shown at all.

I have tried the Virgin West Coast website (Trainline) and having input "Shrewsbury" in the Via field, this returns several trains (obviously with a change at Shrewsbury), however it is only the Advance fares that come up on the page.

I have also consulted the Routeing Guide for mapped routes and although I can see obvious routes between Birmingham and Crewe with the various map combinations that are listed (even trying Chester and Preston as well), none of the maps show either the link between Wolverhampton and Shrewsbury, or between Crewe and Shrewsbury via Nantwich. It is not the shortest route within 3 miles, as there is a 20 mile difference between the routes via Shrewsbury and via Stafford.

Have I interpreted this right in that for the flexible Any Permitted fare (SVR), I cannot go via Shrewsbury on the outward as I intend to do, but for the Advance fare I can? Also, back in the days of British Rail, I cannot remember if the route between Shrewsbury and Crewe via Nantwich was Regional Railways Wales and West, or if it was Central, as I knew that RRW&W were a bit strange regarding routes and fares (as can be evidenced from the West Midlands Day Ranger being unable to travel between Hereford and Shrewsbury via Craven Arms).

 

[ForTheLoveOf]

My intended trip is in December, but I would like to travel via Shrewsbury on the outbound (with a break of journey at SHR) and return via Stafford. I have used the GWR website (Mixing Deck) and by inputting "Shrewsbury" in the Via field, the only journey that it shows is the 07:34 ATW direct train to Birmingham International via Shrewsbury. No other trains are shown at all.

As far as I can tell, that 07:34 train is the only through train of the day (certainly in that direction) which goes from Crewe to Birmingham via Shrewsbury. Subject to any intervening negative easement(s) and/or ticket route restriction(s), through trains are always a permitted route - regardless of how circuitous their route. It is a little funny that MixingDeck doesn't show the ATW "via Shrewsbury" Advances but perhaps that is an issue of available quotas for that particular Advance.

I have tried the Virgin West Coast website (Trainline) and having input "Shrewsbury" in the Via field, this returns several trains (obviously with a change at Shrewsbury), however it is only the Advance fares that come up on the page.

That makes sense - other than the 07:34 service, there are no other through trains. It is not a mapped or shortest+3 route, thus it can only be a permitted route if the fare is routed "via Shrewsbury" - which only the ATW Advances are. The through walk-up tickets are not valid via Shrewsbury other than on the 07:34.

I have also consulted the Routeing Guide for mapped routes and although I can see obvious routes between Birmingham and Crewe with the various map combinations that are listed (even trying Chester and Preston as well), none of the maps show either the link between Wolverhampton and Shrewsbury, or between Crewe and Shrewsbury via Nantwich. It is not the shortest route within 3 miles, as there is a 20 mile difference between the routes via Shrewsbury and via Stafford.

You are quite right; this is one of the areas of the Routeing Guide that has been modified significantly since the original version, and where the number of valid routes has been significantly reduced. Via Shrewsbury is not an eminently circuitous route, but equally it does not make much sense from the perspective of a Crewe-Birmingham passenger who otherwise has the choice of one fast and two semi-fast direct trains an hour!

Have I interpreted this right in that for the flexible Any Permitted fare (SVR), I cannot go via Shrewsbury on the outward as I intend to do

Exactly, unless you use the 07:34.

but for the Advance fare I can?

Yes, if it is the "via Shrewsbury" routed one (I would definitely use this and not the "ATW only" one as the "via Shrewsbury" is priced just 50p higher and should have the same, or better, availability, but a route restriction is less onerous than a TOC restriction in this case).

 

[alistairlees]

I would have thought buying a Crewe to Telford day return and a Wolverhampton to Birmingham day return will give you all the flexibility you need at the same price as a Crewe to Birmingham return. I'm assuming Crewe to Telford is valid via both Shrewsbury and Wolverhampton, but haven't checked.

 

[ForTheLoveOf]

I would have thought buying a Crewe to Telford day return and a Wolverhampton to Birmingham day return will give you all the flexibility you need at the same price as a Crewe to Birmingham return. I'm assuming Crewe to Telford is valid via both Shrewsbury and Wolverhampton, but haven't checked.

Crewe to Telford has two Off-Peak Returns - the 8A "via Shrewsbury" and the CS "Any Permitted". CS isn't valid before 09:00 Monday-Friday, so if you're travelling before then you'd be well advised to go via Shrewsbury or obtain an Advance.

 

[adrock1976]

Crewe to Telford has two Off-Peak Returns - the 8A "via Shrewsbury" and the CS "Any Permitted". CS isn't valid before 09:00 Monday-Friday, so if you're travelling before then you'd be well advised to go via Shrewsbury or obtain an Advance.

Many thanks for that tip regarding Crewe - Telford.

I am rather surprised that ATW have not set their own flexible fares between Crewe and Wolverhampton/Birmingham, as it is possible to use ATW only between those points.

 

[krus_aragon]

Many thanks for that tip regarding Crewe - Telford.

I am rather surprised that ATW have not set their own flexible fares between Crewe and Wolverhampton/Birmingham, as it is possible to use ATW only between those points.

Other than the two services per day via Stafford they only offer a long detour via Shrewsbury. Plus, if they offered a cheaper/competitive ATW only fare for CRE-BHM (valid via SHR), it might undercut some Shrewsbury-Birmingham fares...