Do First Group own any HSTs or Pacers?

[D365]

Moderator note: Split from https://www.railforums.co.uk/threads/emr-class-153-future.202810

Rolling stock has been owned by TOCs from day 1: there are some 143s that are owned by GWR (and TfW own some 143s as well?) that have been passed along as franchise assets. Likewise some operators have owned Class 08s as franchise assets. More recently, SWT bought the Island Line fleet, ScotRail owned the 314s and GWR own 5 HST power cars.

First Group own the Class 43s and 143s, not GWR directly. Though I understand that First Group has purchased several more power cars?

 

[43096]

First Group own the Class 43s and 143s, not GWR directly. Though I understand that First Group has purchased several more power cars?

You fell into the trap....

That is not correct. The 143s are, as I stated, franchise assets and are not FirstGroup owned. Likewise GWR own five power cars: these are not the same as the 12 owned by FirstGroup (technically First Rail Holdings).

 

[D365]

You fell into the trap....

That is not correct. The 143s are, as I stated, franchise assets and are not FirstGroup owned. Likewise GWR own five power cars: these are not the same as the 12 owned by FirstGroup (technically First Rail Holdings).

Was it the Class 43s owned by First that DfT were unhappy about?

 

[43096]

Was it the Class 43s owned by First that DfT were unhappy about?

Probably - for obvious reasons. If First lost the franchise they could take their trains away and leave the franchise in the lurch. It hasn't stopped DfT agreeing to use the First-owned vehicles in the retained 2+4 sets, though - I wonder if First have guaranteed their availability beyond the end of the current franchise?

 

[Energy]

Probably - for obvious reasons. If First lost the franchise they could take their trains away and leave the franchise in the lurch. It hasn't stopped DfT agreeing to use the First-owned vehicles in the retained 2+4 sets, though - I wonder if First have guaranteed their availability beyond the end of the current franchise?

Not sure if the short HSTs will stay in the next non DA franchise.