France with bikes: routeing tips for avoiding Paris and TGVs?

[BRX]

Going to want to get from Amiens to somewhere south of Paris, along with (non-folding) bikes. Potentially anywhere on the 4 lines I've marked with stars in the map image below.



I'd quite like to avoid Paris (unless it's in & out from the same station) and probably TGVs (because of bike restrictions).

Are there any good avoiding routes for getting around the west (or even east) edge of Paris? Or is there a way of using the RER to get from the north to the south of Paris without stopping in the middle?

We'd be trying to do this on a Saturday or Sunday.

Also... are there any French ticket sites or journey planners that let me specify "avoid" points? It doesn't look possible on SNCF or Trainline.

 

[Doctor Fegg]

Cycling across Paris is blissful these days - cycle lanes everywhere, roads closed to motor traffic, and hordes of cyclists riding with you. Use a proper route planner (i.e. not Google Maps) and you’ll be fine.

 

[signed]

As most of the network is structured around Paris, avoiding it is hard. And as @Doctor Fegg mentioned, massive improvements have been made to the cycling infrastructure in Paris.

Do mind the Olympic Games restrictions, you will want to cross the Seine underground to limit the hassle.

You can transport a bike on most TER services for free or for something like 1€ for a bike reservation.

From Amiens you can take the TER Hauts-De-France service to Paris Nord, carrying a bike is free and doesn't require a reservation.

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If you want to limit Paris cycling, you can then hop with your bike on RER B to Denfert-Rochereau station.

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The Orléans and Le Mans lines originate from Paris Montparnasse, which you can cycle to very easily from Denfert-Rochereau (less than 15min), and then get onto a TER Rémi service in either those lines

You do need a reservation for your bicycle on weekends

https://www.ter.sncf.com/centre-val-de-loire/services-contacts/voyager-avec-velo/bike-reservation

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For the Montargis line, the service is the Transillien Line R from Gare de Lyon

To reach Gare de Lyon, you can take a RER D service direct from Gare du Nord

Those won't need bike reservations

 

[BRX]

Thanks.

Yes, I'm aware that Paris has made a lot of improvements for cycling, but wasn't sure how extensive this is. I'll look into the crossing Paris by bike option if there aren't really any sensible alternatives.

Is the RER fairly bike friendly? Can we rely on there being lifts at stations for example?

 

[signed]

Can we rely on there being lifts at stations for example?

There are lifts at all RER stations, whether they are big enough for a bike I can't tell you.

Is the RER fairly bike friendly?

You can only carry a bike all day on weekends, and how easy it is will depend on what the frequentation is, but there are cars made for bikes in the RER (identified by a bike symbol)

Note that carrying a bike between July 20 and August 8 will be prohibited on peak times on all RER lines even on weekends. It is non-advisable on the Transillien lines for that period.

 

[BRX]

Note that carrying a bike between July 20 and August 8 will be prohibited on peak times on all RER lines even on weekends. It is non-advisable on the Transillien lines for that period.

Thanks - it'll be after those dates so we should be ok.

 

[4COR]

The Orléans and Le Mans lines originate from Paris Montparnasse, which you can cycle to very easily from Denfert-Rochereau (less than 15min), and then get onto a TER Rémi service in either those lines

You do need a reservation for your bicycle on weekends

https://www.ter.sncf.com/centre-val-de-loire/services-contacts/voyager-avec-velo/bike-reservation

The Orléans line (TER intercités services onwards to Vierzon, Limoges, Brive, etc) originates from Gare d'Austerlitz, not Montparnasse

 

[BRX]

Looking into things in a bit more detail provides a reminder of how hopeless French railways are, away from the main lines. Rural routes with just 2 or 3 trains a day, and gaps plugged with bus services.

Anyway ... am now looking at the option of using RER D to get right across Paris. Amiens to Orry-la-ville - Voye and then from there all the way south on RER D to Malesherbes (changing once at Corbeil-Essones).

Then just start cycling from Malesherbes.

I guess it's a bit like getting Thameslink from St Albans to Brighton.

Are the trains on the RER D lines still the moderately ancient double-decker ones, or are they all getting replaced by new air-con type stock now?

 

[30907]

Are the trains on the RER D lines still the moderately ancient double-decker ones

Yes, as of last year

 

[BRX]

Yes, as of last year

Looks like they will start to get replaced at the end of this year.

New Alstom RER NG starts operation in Paris/ Île de France - Urban Transport Magazine

On Monday 13 November 2023, Ile-de-France Mobilités, SNCF Voyageurs and Alstom inaugurated the RER NG, the “New Generation RER”, at Haussmann Saint-Lazare station in Paris, in the presence of elected representatives and passengers. “It is with immense pride that we are today celebrating the...

www.urban-transport-magazine.com

The RER NG commuter train is gradually being introduced on the RER E line. This gradual arrival will ensure that the train becomes more reliable before being deployed on the whole RER E line, including the new extension to Nanterre. It will then be deployed on the RER D line at the end of 2024.

A ticketing question...

I want to travel from Saint-Aignan Noyers to Saint-Malo using TER trains only, via Tours, Nantes and Rennes.

This is possible, but if I ask the SNCF journey planner it only offers me an itinerary using a TGV and going via Le Mans. Even if try and specify TER only. This means I can't access a "Tarif Normal" fare for the whole journey.

Does this mean it's not possible to buy a single ticket for the route I want, or is there some way of doing so? Would it be offered on ticket vending machines at the station?

The best I can do online is two "Tarif Normal" tickets: one from Saint-Aignan to Tours and then another from Tours to St-Malo.

 

[signed]

Does this mean it's not possible to buy a single ticket for the route I want, or is there some way of doing so? Would it be offered on ticket vending machines at the station?

There are no concepts of through tickets in TER as the network is fundamentally split per-region (there are some interregional fares though in some cases), you will need to split somewhere.

 

[BRX]

There are no concepts of through tickets in TER as the network is fundamentally split per-region (there are some interregional fares though in some cases), you will need to split somewhere.

Yet I seem to be able to get a fare that crosses 3 TER regions - I just can't seem to extend that a few extra km within one of those same regions.

 

[Myb]

I think if you visit a ticket office with the itinerary they may be able to sell the ticket. But not the machines alas, the small blue ones will only sell a limited range of inter-regional tickets, and the big white ones will display the same journey options as on the website.

 

[nwales58]

Be grateful it's not Spain, it would be a separate ticket for each train.

 

[rvdborgt]

Be grateful it's not Spain, it would be a separate ticket for each train.

And a separate ticket office at the bigger stations...

 

[BRX]

I think if you visit a ticket office with the itinerary they may be able to sell the ticket.

I might end up doing this ... as I understand it, the "Tarif Normal" fares don't sell out or increase in price so there's no particular advantage in buying them in advance.

Does buying one ticket for an entire itinerary have any benefit in terms of how missed connections are dealt with, in the French system?

 

[Myb]

In case of missed connection, the "Tarif Normal" ticket is valid for any train during the day, so you can take the next train.
The risk is if the delay makes you miss the last train of the day. With a TER-only ticket (no TGV or IC segment), SNCF usually doesn't pay for the taxi or hotel.

The only benefit of having one ticket instead of two would be it is slightly cheaper.

 

[BRX]

Looks like they will start to get replaced at the end of this year.

New Alstom RER NG starts operation in Paris/ Île de France - Urban Transport Magazine

On Monday 13 November 2023, Ile-de-France Mobilités, SNCF Voyageurs and Alstom inaugurated the RER NG, the “New Generation RER”, at Haussmann Saint-Lazare station in Paris, in the presence of elected representatives and passengers. “It is with immense pride that we are today celebrating the...

www.urban-transport-magazine.com

A ticketing question...

I want to travel from Saint-Aignan Noyers to Saint-Malo using TER trains only, via Tours, Nantes and Rennes.

This is possible, but if I ask the SNCF journey planner it only offers me an itinerary using a TGV and going via Le Mans. Even if try and specify TER only. This means I can't access a "Tarif Normal" fare for the whole journey.

Does this mean it's not possible to buy a single ticket for the route I want, or is there some way of doing so? Would it be offered on ticket vending machines at the station?

The best I can do online is two "Tarif Normal" tickets: one from Saint-Aignan to Tours and then another from Tours to St-Malo.

So...it turned out that it is possible to buy a "tarif normal" through ticket from Saint-Aignan Noyers to St Malo, from the ticket machine at the station (the ticket office was closed).

Strangely it was actually cheaper than a ticket from Tours to St Malo, although, that's comparing it with Tours to St Malo via Nantes (buying that ticket gave me a choice of routings, whereas the St Aignan to St Malo one didn't).

Maybe the "via" choice is only relevant if you want to break your journey?

Anyway, the various bike reservations, although rather complex to buy, worked fine. On one train they had a very organised system with two people onboard just dealing with checking the bikes on and off (a portion of the seating areas had temporarily been designated as bike storage).