Good news on the heart of wales line

[Greenback]

The BR Manager who cut it from 5 trains to 4 admitted on more than one occasion he also lost 50% of the revenue!

The crux of the whole rural line thing is that if you have them they have to be used properly otherwise its a total drain on the taxpayer. As an occasional scenic ride its lovely but the HoW produces few real "outcomes" due to how its run. On many other rural lines the last couple of decades has seen the rise of the "city region" and commuting by rail from rural areas into provisional city centers has grown very strongly. Of course the HoW has been denied this by the truncation of the Central Wales line from Pontarddulais to Swansea Victoria. Going to Llanelli was a huge mistake (sorry Greenback), the largest town in Wales without a railway station- Gorseinion (pop c17,000) was on that stretch plus the western suburbs of Swansea, the University and ironically it terminated in where the city centre of Swansea has migrated to the SA1 redevelopment area.

It clearly cant be operated at the lowest possible cost as its part of the mainstream franchised railway over NR track. The Heart of Wales Line Forum have been campaigning for a number of years to be allowed to try and run a vertically integrated micro franchise over the line with stock stabled at Llandovery overnight producing a better timetable including commuter timed arrivals into Swansea.

The deep rural line debate will remain forever sterile unless something new like this is tried.

This may come as a shock, but I agree! Llanelli was always a 'branch' of the HoW, the original route did pass through many of the more affluent suburbs of Swansea, like Dunvant and Killay, before running along the foreshore of Swansea Bay alongside the old Mumbles Railway.

I have little doubt that there would be quite a bit of revenue from this section the line today had it survived. As you say, the old Swansea Victoria station was much closer to the modern city centre than High St station.

I will take issue with one point, though! The SA1 development is to the east of the Tawe river; Swansea Victoria is now the site of Swansea LC2 leisure centre, next to Swansea Marina on the west of the river. But that's a bit of nit picking! Sorry!

 

[mr williams]

I've always wondered why they ran via Llanelli rather than go "straight up". Is there track still in situ from Swansea via Pontardulais?

 

[Greenback]

No, it was removed in 1964/65, except for a section down from Pontardulais to Gorseinon with a connection tot eh Swansea District Line.

This part of the line served Brynlliw Colliery (closed around 1983 IIRC), and, initially, some works around Gorseinon. Eventually they all closed and there was no need for even that short section fo track to remain.

At Gowerton, you cna see the remains of the overbridge that took the line over the SWML, and the section southwards to the coast is now a nice path and cycleway down the Clyne Valley, passing by the renowned Railway Inn in Killay. This is well regarded locally for it's real ales, including those from the Swansea Brewery...it used to be the station building!

So, you can walk or cycle some of the old line, but not all of it!

 

[Gareth Marston]

This may come as a shock, but I agree! Llanelli was always a 'branch' of the HoW, the original route did pass through many of the more affluent suburbs of Swansea, like Dunvant and Killay, before running along the foreshore of Swansea Bay alongside the old Mumbles Railway.

I have little doubt that there would be quite a bit of revenue from this section the line today had it survived. As you say, the old Swansea Victoria station was much closer to the modern city centre than High St station.

I will take issue with one point, though! The SA1 development is to the east of the Tawe river; Swansea Victoria is now the site of Swansea LC2 leisure centre, next to Swansea Marina on the west of the river. But that's a bit of nit picking! Sorry!

I still wear my Scarlets shirt with pride even if I want the HoW to go elsewhere

 

[Greenback]

Good man!!!

There are lots of good books around about the history of the HoW - I've read a few at Swanse aLibrary, but I can't recall the titles off the top of my head. I found the sections on the south of the line very interesting, as there was so much industry and freight years ago. It was very different in character to the other parts of the line!

 

[merlodlliw]

As you two are having a banter about sport, we in Wrexham of course support Rugby League,we have a cracking team, about to be re named Wrexham Crusaders, also gates of 13K to watch them when the heathens from Lancs & Yorks arrive, to keep in the party spirit as the brand new WAG building at Junction opened to day at a cost of £20M plus, so as to bring Cardiff Bay to the
North any how a real WAG sent this e mail out today, to celebrate the opening I fell about laughing, here it is.


What is not mentioned is the WAG desire to not only continue with the WAG Express but to enhance the service with a sleeping car included in the early morning departure from Holyhead. The WAG think it is important for their members to be fresh for work on their arrival at Cardiff. The sleeping car will be specially fitted out, see picture, and be available for members from 22.00 the previous evening. Free travel to Holyhead the previous evening, for members of the WAG, to take advantage of this service it will start at the commencement of the winter timetable.

The sleeping car will have its own welsh speaking 'Hostess'. She is Ceri Davies from Beddgelert. ends

I dare not include the pictures, but so called Ceri Davies was pictured wearing some kind of motor cycle gear laying across a swastika with a w..p in her hand.

 

[The Planner]

Oh. My. God. I knew the sleeper idea was floating around, I didnt think they would actually go through with it....

 

[tbtc]

Can you imagine the Scottish Government starting a sleeper from Thurso/ Mallaig to Edinburgh

 

[Greenback]

There should be an overnight service from holyhead, conencting with the ferry from Dublin, through to Cardiff, then Llanelli and Fishguard, where it would arrive in time for the afternoon sailing to Rosslare!

It should have sleeping cars, couchettes, a restaurant car, full service buffet/lounge car, observation carriage, trolley, a luggage van for bikes, newspapers, parcels and mail and be marketed as the Traws Cambrian Express.

It wouldn't be much more pointless than WAGair.

 

[merlodlliw]

There should be an overnight service from holyhead, conencting with the ferry from Dublin, through to Cardiff, then Llanelli and Fishguard, where it would arrive in time for the afternoon sailing to Rosslare!

It should have sleeping cars, couchettes, a restaurant car, full service buffet/lounge car, observation carriage, trolley, a luggage van for bikes, newspapers, parcels and mail and be marketed as the Traws Cambrian Express.

It wouldn't be much more pointless than WAGair.

Now,now Greenback you forgot the Cinema coach anyhow we now find the actual amount spent on the light aircraft Anglesey to Cardiff up to date is £3.2M this was announced at Liverpool on Monday, the local daily is full of positive comments for the Wagair from Plaid North West Wales A.Ms as you would expect, even the daily (Daily Post) in an editorial is proactive for it,nothing to do with the four pages of WAG advertising in it today of course telling us about bringing Cardiff Bay to the North at a cost of £20M to revamp a building no one else in the real world wanted, I now expect a travalator from Junction Station to it, so they wont get wet
PS for our friends outside of Wales, a new WAG building was opened yesterday at Junction at a cost of £20M with a garage for Ministerial vehicles.

 

[krus_aragon]

I now expect a travalator from Junction Station to it, so they wont get wet

It's only slightly more than a decade since we asked for a footbridge over platform 4 and the sidings to get to the cinema/retail park...

 

[merlodlliw]

It's only slightly more than a decade since we asked for a footbridge over platform 4 and the sidings to get to the cinema/retail park...

But Krus a footbridge for real people, these are politicians draining every penny they can before next May, I wonder if they have a washing machine in the foyer as this was the old Hotpoint factory WAG have converted for themselves.

 

[krus_aragon]

My thrust was that perhaps a politician's travelator will provide the footbridge that locals have been asking for.

 

[Greenback]

I'm sorry I didn't mention the cinema coach! I must have assumed there would be TV's in every seat back!!!

One fact about WAGair is that the WAG and North West Wales AM's can defend the services because they can be used by 'normal people'. despite the fact that the timings mean they are only useful for the limited numbers of people whose working hours and location happen to correspond with those AM's! At least gerald can be used for intermediate journeys, provided the train stops there (sorry Wrexham and Hereford).

The politicians seem to be isolated from the real world. I don't know what happens to them when they get to the Assembly, but I know a local councillor who went to the PC convention in Aber and stayed in a student hall of residence with a shared bathroom. Do the AM's do that?

 

[merlodlliw]

My thrust was that perhaps a politician's travelator will provide the footbridge that locals have been asking for.

is this revamped washing machine factory not on the other side of the road Krus.
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The politicians seem to be isolated from the real world. I don't know what happens to them when they get to the Assembly, but I know a local councillor who went to the PC convention in Aber and stayed in a student hall of residence with a shared bathroom. Do the AM's do that?[/QUOTE] Greenback.

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A.Ms & M.Ps share a bathroom, only perhaps with the "extra pillow" as they say in the hotel trade.

 

[krus_aragon]

is this revamped washing machine factory not on the other side of the road Krus.

Ah, I was under the impression that their offices were adjacent to the cinema. Not paying attention, as per usual...

 

[merlodlliw]

Ah, I was under the impression that their offices were adjacent to the cinema. Not paying attention, as per usual...

No its the Conwy Borough Council business centre next door to Cineworld,WAG are on the other side of the tracks.

 

[Squaddie]

PS for our friends outside of Wales, a new WAG building was opened yesterday at Junction at a cost of £20M with a garage for Ministerial vehicles.

I'd have thought that would be a good thing. But it does appear, merlodlliw, that you have a bit of a negative agenda as far as the Welsh Assembly Government is concerned.

 

[Gareth Marston]

I'd have thought that would be a good thing. But it does appear, merlodlliw, that you have a bit of a negative agenda as far as the Welsh Assembly Government is concerned.

Theirs a lot of misunderstanding as to the new WAG offices that have appeared in Merthy Tydfil, Aberystwyth and Llandudno Junction (all walking distance of the stations in each town). Essentially they have resulted in a reduction of the number of offices that WAG staff are deployed in. Wales had a quango bonfire 4 years ago with a number of organisations all occupying different offices in the regions of Wales coming under the WAG roof. To a degree its integration but also some poor quality buildings have been got rid of with the long term facilities running costs coming down, also security in dispersed locations was a concern. The WAG Colwyn Bay office was in a collection of Nissan Huts.

 

[robert2000]

The heart of wales is cheaper to travel on from shrewsbury to swansea,

 

[Greenback]

I'd have thought that would be a good thing. But it does appear, merlodlliw, that you have a bit of a negative agenda as far as the Welsh Assembly Government is concerned.

Some people in Wales didn't want devolution in the first place. Some aren;t happy with the coalition governemnt. Some people feel that the WAG is too Cardiff centric. All of these people will have negative feelings towards the WAG for one reason or another.

It's also possible that people, like msyelf, may be opposed to one or two policies, while supporting many others. As ane xample, I was against the Iraq War, but supported the NMW, both of which came to pass during the Labour governemnt of the UK.

In short, it's quite natural to criticise decisions made by those in power, whether local, national or regional. In Merlodlliw's case, he appears to be questioning the amount of money spent on new offices, including the garaged parking, rather than criticising the relocation itself, or the economic effect on the Llandudno area.

 

[anthony263]

The heart of wales is cheaper to travel on from shrewsbury to swansea,

And i find it is a nicer route as well