If the GNR/LNER had been built on a slightly different alignment ...

[Harlesden]

... and Grantham, Newark and Retford (three very small towns) had not been on it, what type of rail services do you think these stations might have had in (a) 1950 (b) 1970 (c) Present Day

 

[ryan125hst]

Retford (c) Present Day

Well, it can't be much worse! Southbound isn't too bad as Hull Trains and East Coast tend to operate in alternate hours. The big problem is northbound, where an East Coast train to York will depart at, say, 10:48, and a Hull Trains service will depart at 11:11 to Hull (allowing connections to Leeds and the North at Doncaster). The next train north is then at 12:45!

If it wasn't for the ECML, I would say that Retford would have a very poor service. We might have still got the Sheffield to Lincoln line, but Northbound and Southbound journey's would probably be impossible by train today.

 

[tbtc]

Probably the same "east-west" service that they currently get (Sheffield - Retford - Lincoln every hour, Nottingham - Newark Castle - Lincoln every hour, Nottingham - Grantham - Skegness every hour), with an EMT 153/156 every hour or so between Peterborough and Doncaster via Grantham/ Newark/ Retford?

 

[Eagle]

It would depend of course on where the ECML was built instead. (Are we talking further east, through Lincolnshire, or further west, perhaps via Nottingham and Worksop?)

 

[Sidious]

If you were to pretend that the ECML doesn't and never did run on it's current alignment through Grantham, then it's entirely possible that Grantham might have been wiped off the railway map - The Lincoln to Grantham route was obviously closed under Beeching, however this never really reached Grantham anyway - only connecting into the Nottingham to Sleaford route near Honington.

It's plausible that the connection from that line to the current station between Allington Junc through Gonerby tunnel might have existed as some kind of spur, but with no southern connection, it would have been a 'dead end'.

In the 1960's and 1970's the size of the town, and it's strategic location are no more important than say Louth or Mansfield which both lost their railway, and it would have had none of the seasonal holiday traffic like Mablethorpe which also lost it's railway.

So it's probable that the spur into the town was closed, and perhaps in the BR station re-opening boom of the late 1980's it might have got a parkway station on the Nottingham to Sleaford line somewhere near Allington?

 

[edwin_m]

Sleaford or Stamford are probably most similar to the situation of Grantham, Newark or Retford if they hadn't been on the main line. Stamford was on the coach road but got only east-west links after the ECML ran via Peterborough instead, and Sleaford was on a north-south main line but only a relatively minor one. Both are much smaller today than Grantham, but the proportions could have been reversed with better rail links.

I'd therefore suggest the historic and current service at Sleaford or Stamford would be a good indicator of what might have been at Grantham, Newark and Retford. I think all three would retain some form of east-west service today, but with London journeys only by changing at wherever the east-west line met the ECML or other main line.

 

[Bevan Price]

Well if they had adopted the Direct Northern Railway proposal of 1844, the "ECML" would have run via Peterborough, Lincoln & Gainsborough., whilst the Eastern Counties Railway wanted to run from Wisbech to Lincoln & Doncaster. (David & Charles Regional History, East Midlands).

So , Retford, Newark & Grantham may never have developed to much more than large villages, very small towns and might have lost any stations in the Marples-Beeching era. Or, at most, they would be relatively minor stations on the Sheffield - Gainsborough/Lincoln, and Nottingham - Lincoln lines The Nottingham - Grantham line may never have been built, but Nottingham - Melton Mowbray - Stamford - Peterborough might have remained open as an important cross country route.

 

[edwin_m]

The company that built the Nottingham-Grantham line intended to go all the way to Boston (and Ambergate!) so their route would have intersected the ECML somewhere. The GNR would then probably have taken it over as they did, and for the same reason of accessing the Nottinghamshire coalfield and passenger markets. The ironstone deposits around Grantham are another reason why the area would almost certainly have been on some sort of secondary main line even without the ECML. And by the example of the Leicester-Peterborough route, that line could have survived down to the present day carrying very much the traffic it does now.