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Isle of Man Railways - public transport potential?

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Bletchleyite

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If a commuter service is to be viable (rather than a novelty as per the breakfast dining trains), it needs to use modern rolling stock running at a competitive speed to match the buses, continuing into town via the horse tramway.

Isn't the track gauge different between the horse tramway and electric railway?

If not, I suppose you could get a narrow gauge battery/DC OHLE FLIRT going on it if you had enough money for one, it is a bit like a Swiss narrow gauge railway in style.
 
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Railsigns

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Isn't the track gauge different between the horse tramway and electric railway?
Both are 3 foot gauge (as is the steam railway). I read that the horse tramway was relaid with rail that's suitable to form a future extension of the electric railway towards the sea terminal.
 

Tetchytyke

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The horse tramway was supposedly relaid between Broadway/War Memorial and Derby Castle to allow a future extension of the MER to the Sea Terminal/Victoria Clock.

Like with so much of the Douglas promenade 'enhancements', it's surprisingly difficult to work out what was actually constructed compared to what was promised. As the budget overrun got bigger and bigger the scope of the promenade work reduced. This is why we have a five-foot-wide weed-ridden verge down the side of the sunken gardens where the single-track horse tramway line should be; the money that was earmarked for that has been swallowed up by the budget black hole.

I'm sceptical- to put it mildly- that the MER could ever support a commuter railway service. Perhaps it could from Laxey, just about, but certainly not from Ramsey. From Ramsey the X3 Manx Express bus which goes non-stop over the Mountain Road* will always a) be quicker and b) be more convenient for those who live in the estates of Ramsey.

(*subject to weather and idiots driving too fast and parking their cars in a hedge)

I think a commuter service could be more successful on the IMR, especially if/when they ever get the diesel locomotive 'lovingly' referred to as "The Cabbage" to work properly. Or if they get a modern railbus. The A5 is pretty much a car park from Ballasalla all the way into Douglas in the morning, the IMR station is right in the city centre next to all the law and finance firms on Athol Street, and the 'south bus' remains the most (only) profitable route on the island.
 

30907

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I think a commuter service could be more successful on the IMR, especially if/when they ever get the diesel locomotive 'lovingly' referred to as "The Cabbage" to work properly. Or if they get a modern railbus. The A5 is pretty much a car park from Ballasalla all the way into Douglas in the morning, the IMR station is right in the city centre next to all the law and finance firms on Athol Street, and the 'south bus' remains the most (only) profitable route on the island.
I'd agree, on the basis of one visit, at least from Castletown.

I suppose a tram in from Laxey might work, but you've still got the problem of getting into the city centre. You'd need a new tram, though, so you might as well go battery-electric, ditto for the Castletown route.
 

Krokodil

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With a battery-electric low-floor tram you may as well extend to the steam railway and include a physical connection there. It would allow a common fleet for commuter services on both sides and you could even run through.
 

AlastairFraser

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The horse tramway was supposedly relaid between Broadway/War Memorial and Derby Castle to allow a future extension of the MER to the Sea Terminal/Victoria Clock.

Like with so much of the Douglas promenade 'enhancements', it's surprisingly difficult to work out what was actually constructed compared to what was promised. As the budget overrun got bigger and bigger the scope of the promenade work reduced. This is why we have a five-foot-wide weed-ridden verge down the side of the sunken gardens where the single-track horse tramway line should be; the money that was earmarked for that has been swallowed up by the budget black hole.

I'm sceptical- to put it mildly- that the MER could ever support a commuter railway service. Perhaps it could from Laxey, just about, but certainly not from Ramsey. From Ramsey the X3 Manx Express bus which goes non-stop over the Mountain Road* will always a) be quicker and b) be more convenient for those who live in the estates of Ramsey.

(*subject to weather and idiots driving too fast and parking their cars in a hedge)

I think a commuter service could be more successful on the IMR, especially if/when they ever get the diesel locomotive 'lovingly' referred to as "The Cabbage" to work properly. Or if they get a modern railbus. The A5 is pretty much a car park from Ballasalla all the way into Douglas in the morning, the IMR station is right in the city centre next to all the law and finance firms on Athol Street, and the 'south bus' remains the most (only) profitable route on the island.
What about the prospects of reopening the Peel branch as a tram line, and using similar tram-style rolling stock on the Steam Railway from Port Erin?
Most of the formation on the Peel line is intact up until Braddan, and then there is only 1 or 2 miles until Douglas station where you'd have to run on road.
 

Tetchytyke

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What about the prospects of reopening the Peel branch as a tram line, and using similar tram-style rolling stock on the Steam Railway from Port Erin?
More chance of finding cheese on the moon.

It's a long-standing crayonista fantasy, but it would cost a fortune and would serve no real benefit to anyone. If the government ever seriously suggested it I'd be properly chewing my MHKs' ears off to persuade them to stop it.

You have to remember the Isle of Man really is small. There's about 83,000 people here, of which almost half live in Douglas/Onchan. Peel's population is around about 6,000, although growing with the new estates on the edge of the town.


With a battery-electric low-floor tram you may as well extend to the steam railway and include a physical connection there.
Not without flattening most of North Quay you couldn't.
 
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AlastairFraser

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More chance of finding cheese on the moon.

It's a long-standing crayonista fantasy, but it would cost a fortune and would serve no real benefit to anyone. If the government ever seriously suggested it I'd be properly chewing my MHKs' ears off to persuade them to stop it.

You have to remember the Isle of Man really is small. There's about 83,000 people here, of which almost half live in Douglas/Onchan. Peel's population is around about 6,000, although growing with the new estates on the edge of the town.
Fair enough, if it's seen to be that far fetched, I'll accept it as I've never been.
 

Krokodil

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Not without flattening most of North Quay you couldn't.
Why would you need to flatten anything? Street run from the Sea Terminal, down North Quay and through Bank's Circus and the bus depot to access the station. Some traffic management will be needed to let trams run bidirectionally down what is currently a one way system but there are certainly no buildings in the way.
 

DarloRich

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the walking route from the steam station, via the bus interchange to the ferry terminal and promenade and then eventually to the tramway & MER needs tiding up imo - everything feels like individual concerns rather than one network imo. ( SMR & MER feel like one operator mind)

Timetabling needs looking at - when I was there last you couldn't get from the MER to the steam station in time to catch the last train of the day!
 

A0

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The biggest issue with suggesting either the MER or IoMSR should be used for public transport is both woul require *massive* amounts spending on them - both are effectively heritage operations with relatively low linespeeds, to make them attractive for public transport use that would need addressing.

However the population of the IoM outside Douglas is low and sparse - Port Erin 3.5k, Port St Mary 2k, Castletown 3k, Laxey 2k, Ramsey 8k. For a fraction of the money spent on upgrading both the MER and IoMSR, the whole bus fleet could be renewed and that offers a much better outcome. It's alot like the situation on the Isle of Wight where the bus is the better answer.
 
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