Legal Process of Vehicle Loans/Transfers

[TR673]

Something I've never seen explained before is how vehicle loans between operators are dealt with on a legal/official basis. Similarly, transfers within the same company (e.g. buses moving between different Stagecoach divisions). Due to the regulations regarding o-discs and such I'd imagine there's something more official in place than one manager phoning another and asking if they can borrow a bus for a month. So what's the general process when a bus moves from one operator/division to another?

The part that got me thinking about this however, is when one company is registered as more than one operator; in particular how TrentBarton uses both Trent Motor Traction and Barton Buses legal names despite sharing a common fleet of vehicles (some have Trent Motor Traction as the legal name on the side, others have Barton Buses). I'm surprised they're allowed to use them interchangeably. Also TrentBarton is under the Wellglade group, with buses often on loan between the Wellglade ops, so is there any difference when the different operators are under one umbrella company?


Although my main question is "what's the overall process", I have a curious mind so if anybody happens to know any of the following extra thoughts I've had, I'd be interested:
Which company is responsible for keeping tyres etc legal while a vehicle is on loan?
Can a preserved, PSVAR compliant, class 6 MOT'd bus be loaned to an operator and run in public service?
If a (for example) Stagecoach Midlands bus breaks down, can a Stagecoach East one take over on the same route?
Does a newly bought/loaned/transferred bus need to be officially registered with the operator somehow, or can it hit the road as soon as the o-disc is in the windscreen?
How were vehicle loans handled pre-deregulation?

 

[Murray J]

Can a preserved, PSVAR compliant, class 6 MOT'd bus be loaned to an operator and run in public service?

I believe this has actually happened before with Midland Classic, FD52GGV is owned by a preservationist who also works at Midland Classic and loaned the vehicle to them between March and October 2022, judging by photos on flickr it's also stored there and seemed to more help out when necessary, acquiring legals whenever needed.

 

[RhysHand]

it’s actually not as difficult as it sounds.

1) Simple sale of vehicle, change of V5 etc then an inspection by the nominated maintenance provider relevant to the operators licence it’s going to work on before you put the disc in the window also updating the operator self service portal with the vehicle details.

2) I could give you an example within our business. Example: Manchester Bus Tours Ltd loans a bus to Altonian Coaches Ltd for let’s say two weeks… MBT licence gets removed, ACL licence put in the window following an inspection by maintenance provider. ACL legal lettering applied.

3) Bus and driver is on loan therefore the o disc doesn’t change but instead an ‘on hire to’ in the window as it’s still controlled by the entity on the V5 document.

Defect cards still have to be completed and it’s best practice to have an internal hire agreement for things like speeding fines or incidents.

 

[Simon75]

I've see for example Arriva Midlands borrowing a Arriva North West bus, with a poster in the window , with words like 'on hire to Arriva Midlands' , and there legal address

 

[RJ]

There is provision in the regulations for operators to borrow buses, as long as their own O-disc is displayed in it and the legal lettering is on display. It also needs to be added to their O licence for the duration of the time it is being operated and comply with the terms of the licence with respect to upkeep and periodic maintenance inspections.

 

[bussnapperwm]

I know Diamond, when they took over First Redditch and Kidderminster had to "hire" buses to First Midlands becuase the service registrations hadn't gone through.

Also, during the Go North West strike, at one stage some of the GNW fleet were "on hire" to other ops to cover the "strikebuster" service.


With relation to internal loans within the same operating company, it depends on the company. National Express West Midlands usually try and loan between depots with similar fleets, so that's why you may see a Wolverhampton Volvo B7RLE on a Pensnett route, as the drivers would be type trained on them.

As an aside, Didn't one bus company (The Skiers Lodge/easycoach) get in hot water with the traffic commission because of their trying to hire to a subsidiary to run their Wrexham service (TSL Wales) as one of many things?