London - Copenhagen return

[cuccir]

Hello,
I teach urban geography in a university and run a field-trip to Copenhagen with our second year students. One of the students signed up for the course has developed a fear of flying and so we're looking at other options. The student needs to be in Copenhagen for 18th March, and will leave on the 23rd March.

We supplement the cost of the fare up to £200 so while this option isn't cheap, I reckon it will cost her ~£150.

The best option seems to be to book London-Hamburg and Hamburg-Copenhagen returns. A couple of questions:
* The student is under 25 so I'm thinking of suggesting a 5 in 15 day InterRail Pass as the best value - is there a way of checking the availability of Eurostar InterRail fares? Are there any alternative passes to consider?
* It's possible, in theory, to travel London to Copenhagen in a day, but there are several tight connections. Are the fares CIV protected? What happens if the journey is delayed en route?

Any advice is welcomed!

 

[WideRanger]

There's a good page on this on Seat61.

 

[eastwestdivide]

Try
https://www.b-europe.com/EN/Booking/Pass#TravelWish
for checking Eurostar Interrail supplement availability (€30 each way in 2nd class I think).
I've used it to buy the supplements, as well as just check availability.
Just tried it for London Brussels on 1 Feb and it's €30 on every service except the 1504, so I suspect March won't be a problem

 

[jeremyjh]

I've done all of the components of this journey a few times and there are some things I'd bear in mind.

Firstly, I would absolutely not recommend attempting the entire journey in a single day. It's numerically possible, perhaps, but not realistic with even the slightest disruption and also not compatible with your student being awake for the first day of the actual visit to Copenhagen. Follow the info on Seat61.
Secondly, book seat reservations on the Hamburg-Copenhagen train. It's only four cars long because it needs to fit onto the ferry, so it's not uncommon for it to get busy.
Thirdly, Generator Hostel in Copenhagen is cheap, efficient, secure and right next door to the station. Your student should also be made aware that the area immediately around the station in Hamburg is not great, and care should be taken.

 

[AlexNL]

I would strongly advise against taking the train from London to Copenhagen and back if time is of the essence. It's impossible to do the whole journey on a single day as it is incredibly long and involves several interchanges. Depending on timetabling, this might even mean overnight interchanges in cities like Flensburg. While splitting the journey over several days might sound interesting, this comes at a cost (hotels aren't free) and won't really benefit the student as they're just doing an incredibly long journey.

In my view the best approach is to talk the student about their fear of flying. Professional courses are available to help with the fear, such as the one offered by Virgin Atlantic. Many others are available.

 

[30907]

I would also advise against doing the trip in one day - it isnt even possible southbound owing to the Eurostar timetable.
Some thoughts:
1. The best splitting point for a Sparpreis is often somewhere like Oldenburg (Holstein) - with the bonus that you are not changing trains there. But Aachen or Cologne might also work too.
A spot check on the DB site is giving EUR120 single for the whole
CIV/SCIC rules apply, so splitting is no problem.
The overnight stop doesnt have to be at the split point, and Hamburg is expensive anyway.
I would suggest arranging the journey so that the student can reach Copenhagen around the same time as the main group; the return is less critical.

2. There is an alternative route via Padborg and the Great Belt, about an hour slower, and I would hope a geography student might wish to use one in each direction! Rendsburg may be the best split.

3. A way to avoid expensive single hotel rooms is to use Harwich-Hoek, but that gives a late arrival in Copenhagen. Split at Rotterdam or Hengelo.

I suspect the Interrail option is slightly more expensive, unless the 5th day is of use.

In answer to AlexNL I would hope that a geography student might benefit from overland travel and even consider the environmental advantages!

 

[AlexNL]

In answer to AlexNL I would hope that a geography student might benefit from overland travel and even consider the environmental advantages!

I agree, but practicalities have to be taken into account here. We're talking about a student, so I'm assuming that this is a one-week trip lodged between regular school weeks.

Spending two weekends on travel is very intensive, despite doing little more than sitting on a couple of trains. I did Copenhagen to Breda a couple of weeks ago (which took about 12 hrs, including the crossing by ferry) and while I loved every second of the trip, I needed the next day to "recover" from the experience.

Furthermore, a fear of flying is irrational and it's better to deal with it now. Sooner or later this fear will come back to bite them, so better to deal with it now. Flying is a safe mode of travel and for distances like London - Copenhagen it is pretty efficient as well.

 

[cuccir]

Thanks all for the replies and insight. Yes the Seat61 article is good: but I thought I'd get further insight here!

The course runs in the first week of the Easter break, so the travel is not quite so rushed on the way back at least.

I'll pass on the tips. Yes of course you're right that we can advise her to seek help for the fear but we can't make her!

 

[AlexNL]

Another alternative is to drive...

 

[daodao]

You might wish to read Peter Hitchens' blog in the Mail on Sunday about his recent trip from London to Copenhagen by train, available at
http://hitchensblog.mailonsunday.co...by-train-a-railway-voyage-to-copenhagen-.html

Sadly, the DFDS ferries to Esbjerg are no more. I remember travelling by boat from Esbjerg to Newcastle over 50 years ago.

 

[Gordon]

In answer to AlexNL I would hope that a geography student might benefit from overland travel and even consider the environmental advantages!

Indeed.

My dad cycled in the early 1950s from the UK to Clermont Ferrand for his Geography field trip...

.

 

[goblinuser]

Maybe tell her to relax and that everything will be fine?

 

[Birdbrain]

I enjoyed an overland trip to Copenhagen (and onwards to Helsinki via Bergen) last summer. We took the Hook ferry and overnighted in Hamburg before going via Puttgarden. An enjoyable trip if you have the time to spare.

 

[DenmarkRail]

Times like this you miss the ferry. You can actually help campaign for a return by searching 'reopen harwich to esbjerg ferry' on facebook or google

 

[DaiGog]

I would add a recommendation for a 'fear of flying' course. I did one with EasyJet last year and it helped me a great deal - they seem to be the cheapest.

On the subject of where to break the journey, Hannover is a good one as it's not too far short of Hamburg and there is an Ibis Budget outside the station.

 

[AY1975]

Another possibility might be to go by Eurostar to Paris, TGV to Basel, then the Zurich-Hamburg night train to Hamburg and EuroCity to Copenhagen. The seat61.com site doesn't mention this option under Denmark, but it is mentioned in the Switzerland section under international trains from Switzerland.

If you want to give this option a try, go to the seat61.com homepage and click on Switzerland to work out the London-Basel leg first, then go to https://www.seat61.com/international-trains/trains-from-Switzerland.htm#Switzerland-Copenhagen and scroll down to option 2: using the Zurich-Hamburg Nightjet sleeper.

For the return journey, go to https://www.seat61.com/international-trains/trains-from-Copenhagen.htm#Copenhagen-Switzerland

 

[Goldfish62]

You might wish to read Peter Hitchens' blog in the Mail on Sunday about his recent trip from London to Copenhagen by train, available at
http://hitchensblog.mailonsunday.co...by-train-a-railway-voyage-to-copenhagen-.html

Sadly, the DFDS ferries to Esbjerg are no more. I remember travelling by boat from Esbjerg to Newcastle over 50 years ago.

I'll usually avoid reading anything by Hitchens, but given that I've recently done said trip in the opposite direction I've read it. A rather good article. I also enjoyed reading about his Cold War journey to Berlin, a journey I've done several times far more recently. I had to chuckle about his ICE breaking down - all too common!

 

[30907]

On the subject of where to break the journey, Hannover is a good one as it's not too far short of Hamburg and there is an Ibis Budget outside the station.

And although it's off the direct route, DB will route you that way.
There's an Ibis by Bochum Hbf too, IIRC, but not stayed there.

Whereas AY1975's suggestion of heading for Basel and the sleeper is not likely to appeal to anyone on a budget - I would want to go via Berlin as well to make sure I got the double deck car.

 

[TorqueOfTheDevil]

Just leave her out. If she wants to go that much, she can suck it up and fly, and if she's not that keen, then why make all this effort? If she goes on the train alone, who will get blamed if she gets lost/mugged/attacked either on the train or while changing trains? And if someone else accompanies her, that involves extra cost (not to mention the nuisance of a lengthy rail journey - not everyone would enjoy it, especially chaperoning a feeble student) because you will still need staff to accompany the main party. And what happens if the train party have a faff and arrive late? Does the whole group lose up to a day of the field trip, or do you start anyway and accept that the train team end up doing over four days' travel for four days of study and miss 20% of the core activity? Personally I wouldn't even be asking, because if you appear to have arranged/facilitated a plan for this student and it goes wrong, you may be held liable. There's nothing stopping her coming on here and asking the questions herself!

Slightly harsh perhaps, but I would say there is a limit to how far we should go (and how much disturbance to the rest of the group we should accept) to accommodate an individual's idiosyncrasies.