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London Overground NLL closed due to signaller sickness 17/04/23

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The north London line has been completely closed since around 5pm and will remain shut until the close of service due to “signaller sickness”. How is there such a lack of resilience that one person calling in sick can shut the entire line for the rest of the day? Where is the NLL signalled from?
 
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Nicholas Lewis

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The north London line has been completely closed since around 5pm and will remain shut until the close of service due to “signaller sickness”. How is there such a lack of resilience that one person calling in sick can shut the entire line for the rest of the day? Where is the NLL signalled from?
Not good but I guess the SSM isn't passed out on that workstation.
 

All Line Rover

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Terrible. But not quite as terrible as the entire Met line also being closed a few weeks back due to "the signaller being ill".

Vowed never to buy a house served by a Met-only station, after realising that the line is farcically operated on a shoestring.
 

Wolfie

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The north London line has been completely closed since around 5pm and will remain shut until the close of service due to “signaller sickness”. How is there such a lack of resilience that one person calling in sick can shut the entire line for the rest of the day? Where is the NLL signalled from?
The same thing has happened outside London before. Trains were running Wellington to Wolverhampton as something similar happened in Shrewsbury a couple of weeks ago.
 

Horizon22

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The north London line has been completely closed since around 5pm and will remain shut until the close of service due to “signaller sickness”. How is there such a lack of resilience that one person calling in sick can shut the entire line for the rest of the day? Where is the NLL signalled from?

Has happened outside of London too.

Signallers work in blocks of route (I note Overground was showing the suspension only to Camden Road, not "the whole NLL") and also need relief and regular breaks. If this can't be met and there are gaps and nobody suitable trained and available to come in (such as a spare shift or manager) then that route will have to close. To do so for such a long time, normally means that the "lack of resilience" has already burnt through Plans A, B & C.

This happened a fair bit during Covid too and huge section of mainlines were maybe just hours away from being shut for considerable lengths of time before coverage could be begged, borrowed or stolen. In fact on a number of occasions, lines had to shut for meal breaks (essentially 30 minutes) as there were not enough signallers available.

At several locations the box/panel is single-staffed and a short-notice sickness can have a considerable impact.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: ==

Not good but I guess the SSM isn't passed out on that workstation.

You would presume so. Or the SSM was already covering elsewhere / also uncovered.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: ==

Terrible. But not quite as terrible as the entire Met line also being closed a few weeks back due to "the signaller being ill".

Vowed never to buy a house served by a Met-only station, after realising that the line is farcically operated on a shoestring.

London Underground lines are a little different as they do both of what would be considered separate service control and signalling jobs on Network Rail lines. There have also previously been disputes and shortages at the control centre in Hammersmith.
 

traingeek97

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The entire North London Line is still suspended this morning. Will the signallers work 7pm to 7am? If so, hopefully the service will be back up and running soon once the day shift arrives.
 

Surreytraveller

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The north London line has been completely closed since around 5pm and will remain shut until the close of service due to “signaller sickness”. How is there such a lack of resilience that one person calling in sick can shut the entire line for the rest of the day? Where is the NLL signalled from?
There's a lack of resilience on the whole of the rail network
 

greatkingrat

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Still a reduced service though, with 5 circuits out all day due to congestion with the backlog of freight services running through. It might be closed again this evening, although not yet confirmed.
 

Daniel

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London Underground lines are a little different as they do both of what would be considered separate service control and signalling jobs on Network Rail lines.

Not in the mentioned area - Harrow-on-the-Hill is still a signal cabin with a signaller in, and a separate Service Controller for the whole line back in the city
 

davetheguard

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This sort of thing must be costing Network Rail an absolute fortune in penalty payments to TfL; and rightly so.

NR need to sort out a better level of sickness cover than this - and it might even work out cheaper in the long run.
 

mrcheek

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It wont just be one signaller ill surely?
More like one guy got ill at the last minute, another guy who would normally cover is also ill, and the other guy they might normally call on in emergencies already booked the time off and has an appointment he cant cancel, while the only other guy trained already moved his shift to cover the previous 12 hours. something like that.
 

Daniel

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It wont just be one signaller ill surely?
More like one guy got ill at the last minute, another guy who would normally cover is also ill, and the other guy they might normally call on in emergencies already booked the time off and has an appointment he cant cancel, while the only other guy trained already moved his shift to cover the previous 12 hours. something like that.

It could be - or as simple as one person has gone sick and no one has taken the overtime. We could look into all the reasons in someone's personal life that they're not taking the overtime, but the root issue may well just be one person going sick, with no spare turn rostered.
 

Nicholas Lewis

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It could be - or as simple as one person has gone sick and no one has taken the overtime. We could look into all the reasons in someone's personal life that they're not taking the overtime, but the root issue may well just be one person going sick, with no spare turn rostered.
Indeed what we don't know is how much a wing and a prayer it runs on daily but the staff rally round generally but the other factor here is how goodwill is being extinguished from the industries DNA.
 

gazzaa2

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Indeed what we don't know is how much a wing and a prayer it runs on daily but the staff rally round generally but the other factor here is how goodwill is being extinguished from the industries DNA.

You see it with the TOC's all the time. Just in the last few days i've had trains both cancelled and short formed, as per announcement, due to staff sickness. It'll be partly a lack of goodwill, also inadequate staffing levels and ability to have contingencies in place. There's often no plan b anymore if something goes wrong.
 

Daniel

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Indeed what we don't know is how much a wing and a prayer it runs on daily but the staff rally round generally but the other factor here is how goodwill is being extinguished from the industries DNA.

The other issue (at least in certain areas.... from what I hear....) is that goodwill may still be there, and staff don't want services to close because of lack of staff in service control areas. However, staff can only do so much overtime. If you're on an early shift, and stay on to do the late shift, but the night shift goes sick, you can't stay on through to your early turn tomorrow... as much as some would like you to...
 

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It wont just be one signaller ill surely?
More like one guy got ill at the last minute, another guy who would normally cover is also ill, and the other guy they might normally call on in emergencies already booked the time off and has an appointment he cant cancel, while the only other guy trained already moved his shift to cover the previous 12 hours. something like that.

Yes probably more likely to be that; the contingency for the contingency is now unavailable.
 
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