london zone 2

[ess]

when you buy a ticket from a rail station to london zone 2 does that mean you can leave the tube at any tube station in zone 2? can you buy london zone 2 tickets at ticket offices, or TVMs or just online?

 

[Daniel]

You can leave the LU network at any Zone 2 station (obviously providing you don't travel through a zone you are not covered by - ie Z1)

 

[asylumxl]

Yes, any station. But beware that the barrier will take the ticket, preventing any further travel.

You should be able to buy them at all the places you listed, but personally, if you know someone with an Oyster card, I would ask to borrow it and use it for the Terminal -> Zone 2 portion.

If you intend to travel to multiple places, I'd get a Travelcard with the train ticket.

 

[ess]

You can leave the LU network at any Zone 2 station (obviously providing you don't travel through a zone you are not covered by - ie Z1)

really? didn't know that. so a ticket from hitchin to london zone 2 isn't valid from hitchin to kings cross then with onward travel to a zone 2 tube station?

BUT hitchin to london zone 1 is valid hitchin -> kings cross -> any zone 1 tube station?

 

[clagmonster]

Correct. With a Hitchin-Zone U2* London ticket you would have to change onto the Underground at Finsbury Park or Highbury. Changing at Kings Cross would not be valid as it is in zone 1, not zone 2.
There are no fare Hitchin-Zone U1* London, but there are fares to Zone U12* London. These would be valid to any Underground zone 1 or 2 station, changing onto the Underground at Finsbury Park, Kings Cross, Old St, Moorgate or Highbury.

 

[yorkie]

that doesn't seem right ! is this documented anywhere ?

 

[b0b]

that doesn't seem right ! is this documented anywhere ?

There's multiple tickets according to NFM05

Hitchin to Zone U2 LONDN 0793
SDS for 13.10, routed Finsbury Park

Then there is
Hitchin to Zone U12 LONDN 0790
SDS for 15.00, routed Any Permitted.

 

[A60K]

that doesn't seem right ! is this documented anywhere ?

It is right - the Routing Guide doesn't apply to the Underground, so you have to make reference to the zonal map to determine where to change. FWIW I agree with the policy - it means that generally you pay less for journeys where you avoid going into Zone 1.

 

[yorkie]

Shouldn't it be routed "Not London"? Otherwise people may assume it's a ticket to London with an add-on to Zone 2. If I wanted to go to a station in Zone 2 in South London, what is there to tell me that this ticket would not be appropriate?

 

[jon0844]

I can certainly see how you might see U2 as being Underground up to Zone 2, as against being London Zone 2 only.

Put next to a ticket saying U12, it's obvious - but nobody will have both tickets.

The current ticketing system doesn't have much room for disclaimers and clarification; perhaps the whole system needs a bit of an overhaul? Keep the same sized ticket, obviously, but change the layout - or even make use of the rear of the ticket.

Give it a particular explanation box with the option of advertising around it and you might even get more people advertising, given that people will have a reason to flip the ticket over, which generates a bit of extra cash.

 

[yorkie]

I think the person who entered the route didn't think very clearly. They put the interchange station as the route. But that makes no sense! By their logic you'd have to change at High Wycombe if using the cheaper tickets on the Chiltern route, for example. Someone has clearly messed up. As usual the customer is left confused!

 

[Daniel]

Surely the moment for clarification would be at the point of sale..?

If I was at Enfield Chase heading to Holloway Road, the ticket clerk should sell me a ticket to Zone 2 (U2).

If I was at Enfield Chase heading to Stockwell, the ticket clerk should sell me a ticket to Zones 1+2 (U12).

As for the passenger operated machines, customers don't select 'ticket to zone 2', they select the station they're going to, so they wouldn't accidently get a U2 when they've going via Z1. And as for travelcards, there isn't one for just Z2.

 

[ess]

the reason i originally asked the question was if you type london as a destination station when buying online, options that come up are all the london terminals stations, london zone 1 and london zone 2. so it really isn't clear as a customer that london zone 2 doesn't include london zone 1!
i suppose the question is whether they open the barriers??

 

[jon0844]

I'd assume the zones start at 1 and work out, so Z1 is cheaper than Z2. Clearly, it is actually the other way around in reality!

 

[transportphoto]

Not necessarily - the London Z1 covers central London - therefore a single within Z1 is more expensive than a single within Z2.


Z1 - Liverpool St -> Moorgate Cash £4 Oyster £1.8

Z2 - Elephant & Castle -> Kennington Cash £3.50 Oyster £1.3

 

[jon0844]

That's not relevant to this thread. It would mean to me that Z1 is zone 1 and Z2 (or U2) is Z1-2.

That isn't the case, and a Z2 ticket would not allow travel through Z1. All it needs to say is ZONE 2 ONLY and it's fine.

My point earlier was that there's too little room (lack of characters primarily) to add detailed notes, disclaimers and exceptions.

 

[yorkie]

Not necessarily - the London Z1 covers central London - therefore a single within Z1 is more expensive than a single within Z2.


Z1 - Liverpool St -> Moorgate Cash £4 Oyster £1.8

Z2 - Elephant & Castle -> Kennington Cash £3.50 Oyster £1.3

This thread is about travelling from outside London to a station in Zone 1 or 2, it is not about travelling wholly within a particular zone.

 

[transportphoto]

This thread is about travelling from outside London to a station in Zone 1 or 2, it is not about travelling wholly within a particular zone.

Sorry, I was just giving an example to the statement. To show that Z1 is more expensive than Z2. I was not relevant to the main subject but that is what I chose as my example.

I'd assume the zones start at 1 and work out, so Z1 is cheaper than Z2. Clearly, it is actually the other way around in reality!

Not necessarily - the London Z1 covers central London - therefore a single within Z1 is more expensive than a single within Z2.


Z1 - Liverpool St -> Moorgate Cash £4 Oyster £1.8

Z2 - Elephant & Castle -> Kennington Cash £3.50 Oyster £1.3

 

[yorkie]

Yes, but jonmorris0844 didn't mean it in that context.

If I buy a ticket from Peterborough to Zone 6 I assume it includes Zone 1. It would seem logical if I buy a ticket from further down (well, Up ) the line, to Zone 2 that it would include Zone 1. It is understandable that a cheaper ticket can be offered that doesn't include Zone 1 but it should be routed accordingly!

 

[jon0844]

Exactly. It's not wrong, but it's easy to misread - and could be clarified better if tickets could put more text on, perhaps with smaller writing.

Any modern ticket machine should be able to print a higher level of detail on a ticket than older ones.. and there's also the back for more details.

Anyone using a TVM could have restrictions quite clearly printed on the ticket, and you could even print in different languages if the user had purchased a ticket in another language on the screen.

Ticketing needs a bit of an upgrade - it's not just the track and rolling stock that needs modernisation!

 

[yorkie]

All it really needs to say is "Not Zone 1", existing technology can do it. It's not really technology that's the problem, it's incompetence, lack of common sense and red tape that is to blame. Oh, and letting ATOC have so much free reign and letting them act as regulators. Ultimately the Government is to blame for allowing ticketing to be so complicated. I can't see any way out of it though without making things worse for passengers.

 

[jon0844]

For this particular case that text would be fine, but I was thinking we need an overhaul for all tickets and how they're printed.

With so many complicated options and restrictions, a single line with a set number of characters and the need for careful shortening and abbreviating is just silly.

Mind you, I also think we need to be working quicker to come up with new ticketing options, like smartcard technology for one - and mobile ticketing to a lesser extent (early systems were too open to fraud, but that's getting better).

 

[Bedpan]

Surely the moment for clarification would be at the point of sale..?

If I was at Enfield Chase heading to Holloway Road, the ticket clerk should sell me a ticket to Zone 2 (U2).

If I was at Enfield Chase heading to Stockwell, the ticket clerk should sell me a ticket to Zones 1+2 (U12).

As for the passenger operated machines, customers don't select 'ticket to zone 2', they select the station they're going to, so they wouldn't accidently get a U2 when they've going via Z1. And as for travelcards, there isn't one for just Z2.

But the ticket machines on National Rail don't include London Underground stations as destination stations....or do they if you're within the London Zones?

 

[barrykas]

But the ticket machines on National Rail don't include London Underground stations as destination stations....or do they if you're within the London Zones?

Depends on the TVM...London Underground's "big" ticket machines let you enter your destination station or choose what zones you want.

With Shere FAST, if the destination isn't in the "Popular" destinations list, you have to type in "London Underground Zone" (yes, really) before it'll give you a list of zonal destinations for singles.

Cheers,

Barry