Middle staircase on Victoria line escalators

[thomalex]

Does anyone have any information on why at many Victoria line stations there is a middle staircase which appears to either have been or intended to be a middle escalator? It's not unusual to have a middle staircase but what is unusual on the Victoria line is the stairs seem to be set into an escalator with metal sides, curved ends with buttons and even rubber hand rails.

There are certainly a few locations where it would be useful to have them as escalators, in particular Highbury and Islington. And if they were removed I'm curious as to what the reason for this would be.

 

[Dstock7080]

Does anyone have any information on why at many Victoria line stations there is a middle staircase which appears to either have been or intended to be a middle escalator? It's not unusual to have a middle staircase but what is unusual on the Victoria line is the stairs seem to be set into an escalator with metal sides, curved ends with buttons and even rubber hand rails.

There are certainly a few locations where it would be useful to have them as escalators, in particular Highbury and Islington. And if they were removed I'm curious as to what the reason for this would be.

As you say intended for relatively easy conversion to escalators at at later date, none have been removed.
Marylebone Bakerloo was another example, although now having third escalator installed:

 

[stuu]

Does anyone have any information on why at many Victoria line stations there is a middle staircase which appears to either have been or intended to be a middle escalator? It's not unusual to have a middle staircase but what is unusual on the Victoria line is the stairs seem to be set into an escalator with metal sides, curved ends with buttons and even rubber hand rails.

There are certainly a few locations where it would be useful to have them as escalators, in particular Highbury and Islington. And if they were removed I'm curious as to what the reason for this would be.

It was done to save money, the Victoria Line was built on a very tight budget. They were originally planned to be escalators I believe, and were removed from the design later

 

[PG]

It was done to save money, the Victoria Line was built on a very tight budget. They were originally planned to be escalators I believe, and were removed from the design later

I assume then that the demand hasn't been sufficient to warrant their completion as surely the budget would have been found in the succeeding 50+ years?

 

[Bletchleyite]

As a related curiosity, in the late 1980s one of the down escalators at Liverpool Central was converted to a fixed staircase (never quite been sure why, as there is a lift as an alternative if you don't like escalators), and has similar appearance. Only reason I can think of is that it goes down onto a very narrow, dead-end bit of platform so a "pile-up" of people could be quite dangerous.

 

[stuu]

I assume then that the demand hasn't been sufficient to warrant their completion as surely the budget would have been found in the succeeding 50+ years?

I think at least one of them was, Brixton perhaps?

 

[D365]

I think at least one of them was, Brixton perhaps?

I don't remember which one, but there was an episode of "The Tube" (circa 2003) that featured Brixton during the installation of the third escalator.

 

[jamesst]

As a related curiosity, in the late 1980s one of the down escalators at Liverpool Central was converted to a fixed staircase (never quite been sure why, as there is a lift as an alternative if you don't like escalators), and has similar appearance. Only reason I can think of is that it goes down onto a very narrow, dead-end bit of platform so a "pile-up" of people could be quite dangerous.

Since converted to a normal staircase.
However a staircase with a similar 'escalator' appearance remains at Hamilton Square.

 

[Snow1964]

As built the northern stations had 2 escalators flanking a staircase.
Seven Sisters had a second entrance which had a double escalator without stairs. They also saved money by not cladding the tunnel ceilings at these. The bottom of these escalators are all at different parts of platform to spread passengers along the train.

Finsbury Park took over existing arrangement, Highbury and Islington kept the North City line arrangement (but added pair of tunnels), from memory the escalators that connected to North London Line (now Overground) were added with GLC funding later.

The middle stations Kings Cross, Green Park, Victoria were built with 3 escalators (Green Park also had an upper flight with 2 to ticket Hall)

Euston had pairs of two to a middle concourse that allowed connections to all the Northern line platforms, then bank of 3 to ticket Hall, I think there was only 2 to BR concourse (but a direct link to the suburban platforms at tube ticket hall level)

Warren Street had a middle level to connect to Northern, but to save money only 5 escalators plus stairway were installed.

Oxford Circus had new platforms outside the Bakerloo ones, there were additional single shaft up escalators to the old Central- Bakerloo ticket Hall (which became exit only). The new entrance Hall under the circus had 3 new pairs of escalators to each pair of platforms. Intermediate concourses exist so the down escalators are positioned away from the exiting part of platforms.

The Southern stations had 2 flanking a staircase, Brixton gained one later and I think Vauxhall also gained a third escalator around the time the bus station was rebuilt (not sure about this).

 

[Timmyd]

Brixton and Vauxhall both have third escalators now. Pimlico remains fixed, much less busy so not an issue. Stockwell has a different arrangement from memory with the two islands joint with the Northern.

The middle staircase that is desperately needs conversion to an escalator is Paddington Bakerloo, hope they turn their attention to that once Crossrail complete

 

[stuu]

Brixton and Vauxhall both have third escalators now. Pimlico remains fixed, much less busy so not an issue. Stockwell has a different arrangement from memory with the two islands joint with the Northern.

The middle staircase that is desperately needs conversion to an escalator is Paddington Bakerloo, hope they turn their attention to that once Crossrail complete

I know it can be pretty bad in the evening peak, but a big chunk of those passengers will shift to Crossrail so it will be less urgent

 

[swt_passenger]

Brixton and Vauxhall both have third escalators now. Pimlico remains fixed, much less busy so not an issue. Stockwell has a different arrangement from memory with the two islands joint with the Northern.

The middle staircase that is desperately needs conversion to an escalator is Paddington Bakerloo, hope they turn their attention to that once Crossrail complete

I don’t think there’s necessarily space for conversion of every set of central stairs on earlier lines. I’m sure it came up for discussion a while ago, and sometimes there’s just not enough space underneath.

 

[rebmcr]

I used to use the one at Warren Street as an 'express' bypass as it was quicker than the walking lane on the escalators. Up as well as down, though down was easier!

 

[PG]

I don’t think there’s necessarily space for conversion of every set of central stairs on earlier lines. I’m sure it came up for discussion a while ago, and sometimes there’s just not enough space underneath.

Odd. I'd have thought that when built all the excavations would be to a uniform depth and that the money was saved by not fitting an actual escalator in the middle position?

 

[swt_passenger]

Odd. I'd have thought that when built all the excavations would be to a uniform depth and that the money was saved by not fitting an actual escalator in the middle position?

I think it was said it was more to do with the positioning of the drive machinery, if it’s not all fitted vertically below the escalators. But I’m having difficulty finding the original discussion, it might have been somewhere else.

 

[rebmcr]

TfL are installing modern compact escalators now, with old machinery rooms already being retired.

 

[Gerald Fiennes]

And, whislt we are in Memory Lane, recall that Pimlico station was not initially authorised when the Brixton extension was built due to shortage of money and because its business case (as we would now say) was the weakest of the four new stations (and presumably still is, as it is always relatively quiet). But it was authorised later and I seem to recall opened about 9 months after the extension. So lucky it has escalators at all! Younger viewers: look at TV reruns of 'The Sweeney' to see what London looked like then...!

 

[rebmcr]

And, whislt we are in Memory Lane, recall that Pimlico station was not initially authorised when the Brixton extension was built due to shortage of money and because its business case (as we would now say) was the weakest of the four new stations (and presumably still is, as it is always relatively quiet). But it was authorised later and I seem to recall opened about 9 months after the extension. So lucky it has escalators at all! Younger viewers: look at TV reruns of 'The Sweeney' to see what London looked like then...!

It's also the only Victoria line station that's not an interchange with another rail route.

 

[PG]

Younger viewers: look at TV reruns of 'The Sweeney' to see what London looked like then...!

Also see 'Prospects' by the same production company for an idea of how gritty London, especially Docklands, looked in the early/mid 80's...

 

[WesternLancer]

Also see 'Prospects' by the same production company for an idea of how gritty London, especially Docklands, looked in the early/mid 80's...

Not forgetting early episodes of Minder...

 

[Cdd89]

Heathrow Central Station has one too. I wonder if this predates the decision to build dedicated stations at Terminal 4/5, with it imagined that usage of this station would grow.

 

[Dstock7080]

Heathrow Central Station has one too. I wonder if this predates the decision to build dedicated stations at Terminal 4/5, with it imagined that usage of this station would grow.

When opened in 1977 that flight was only a passive provision staircase, the two escalators were added later.