Must bridge height restriction signs be illuminated?

[burgesst]

Is there anything that says height restriction signs on railway bridges must be illuminated? Those on my local bridge were turned off when they refurbished the bridge early in the year, and have never been turned back on.

I contacted the rail company, who said it was the council's responsibility, who said it was UK Power Networks, who now say it needs a complete rewire and closure of the road. Months have now passed.

Thanks.

 

[alex17595]

There must be no end of height restrictions in the middle of nowhere that are unlit.

 

[burgesst]

There must be no end of height restrictions in the middle of nowhere that are unlit.

Good point. Presumably drivers in those areas would be using main beam? In the town, would the normal headlights show this sign up ?

 

[Llanigraham]

As far as I can see from the Highway Lighting Regulations there is no requirement for them to be illuminated.

 

[Devonian]

The signage guidelines recognise that high-level signs are above headlamp reach; there would often/usually be similar reflectorised signs on poles ahead of the bridge within the range of headlamp beams.

As for dedicated illumination, I thought that it was covered by The Traffic Signs Regulations and General Directions 2016, Schedule 2: Signs that warn of hazards and signs for bridges and other structures.

"...where the sign is placed on a road within 50 metres of any lamp which forms part of a system of street-lighting, the illumination requirements for the sign are ... the sign must be illuminated by internal or external lighting for so long as that system is illuminated and may also be reflectorised."

(https://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/2016/362/schedule/2/made#schedule-2-part-7)

 

[Llanigraham]

And those last 5 words explain why most are not illuminated.

 

[noddingdonkey]

Does it? I read that as reflectorisation in addition to being illuminated during the hours that street lighting is in operation, not a replacement.

 

[DelW]

The general principle is that where there is no street lighting, it is assumed that drivers will be using headlights, and reflective signs are adequate. Where there is street lighting, drivers may be using sidelights only, and signs should be illuminated.

Since the signs in the OP's photo were once lit, and are well above headlight level, it seems certain that they ought to be lit.

 

[edwin_m]

If a sign is retroreflective and also illuminated, then wouldn't it send most of the light back into the lamp?

 

[Sonik]

I contacted the rail company, who said it was the council's responsibility, who said it was UK Power Networks, who now say it needs a complete rewire and closure of the road. Months have now passed.

This kind of saga is not unusual when dealing with utilities. Often it's a case of things crawling out the woodwork and a seemingly simple job turning into something that takes ages.

 

[Ivan Winters]

The general principle is that where there is no street lighting, it is assumed that drivers will be using headlights, and reflective signs are adequate. Where there is street lighting, drivers may be using sidelights only, and signs should be illuminated.

Since the signs in the OP's photo were once lit, and are well above headlight level, it seems certain that they ought to be lit.

As I understand the rules for driving lights on a motor vehicle driving on sidelights only is now illegal. In hours of darkness the vehicle should be driven on headlights and the only differences depending on oncoming traffic, bends in road etc are whether the headlamps are full beam or dipped.

 

[Lemmy282]

From the original photo, there are light units above the signs, so obviously the council in the past decided that the signs should be lit. So it is up to the council to get that sorted, not the railway. I've no idea who UK power networks are, I suspect the local electricity supply company, so it may be the case that the supply has been lost. Again up to the council to push this.
On the other side of the problem, items fixed to railway bridges cause all sorts of issues. I had cause to replace bridge height signs a few years ago, negotiations with Network Rail took ages, they needed details of the fixings for the signs, how the electricity supply cable was to be fixed to the structure, safe systems of work, method statements, plans and service diagrams etc. etc. In all it took the best part of 6 months to sort it, and then we had to have an official road and rail closure to carry out the work, with NR on site to oversee the work which took the grand total of 3 hours! This was done on a Sunday morning. Oh, and the railway only had one train each way a day, and non on Sundays, the Stocksbridge steels branch in Sheffield.
So it could be that your council is trying to fix things, but bogged down in the never ending saga of paperwork.
Of course if there is a bridge bash at night and the defendant says the signs weren't lit, things will probably get sorted much quicker!

 

[MotCO]

As I understand the rules for driving lights on a motor vehicle driving on sidelights only is now illegal. In hours of darkness the vehicle should be driven on headlights and the only differences depending on oncoming traffic, bends in road etc are whether the headlamps are full beam or dipped.

The Highway Code says "You must use headlights when visibility is seriously reduced", with ‘seriously reduced’ defined as when you are able to see less than 100m in front of you. This means they should be turned on at night-time and during bad weather. https://www.rac.co.uk/drive/advice/...eadlights-what-they-are-and-when-to-use-them/

Presumably, if there is street lighting, visibility will be greater than 100m, then you can drive on sidelights. London taxi drivers used to drive on sidelights rather than headlights - if that is still the case, then presumably they are operating within the law.

 

[Lemmy282]

The problems of selecting bits of text out of context. In the above post the "use of headlights" comes from the section entitled "dipped headlights and when to use them". From the same page "Side lights also known as parking lights" are for use when the car is parked on an unlit road with a speed limit over 30mph.
So, in normal driving at night you should use dipped headlights, no matter whether the road is lit or unlit, side lights are not enough. Main beam headlights are for use when there is no oncoming traffic.
Street lighting is designed to provide a level of illumination which is suitable for pedestrians to see where they are going, headlights allow drivers to see and be seen.

 

[NorthernSpirit]

There must be no end of height restrictions in the middle of nowhere that are unlit.

There's one at Calstock which is unlit but reflective, its also 20 yards from the main Albaston to Calstock road which has the warning triangle, but further down into Calstock and there's another one (which is lit) and this has the red circle.

 

[DelW]

From the original photo, there are light units above the signs, so obviously the council in the past decided that the signs should be lit. So it is up to the council to get that sorted, not the railway. I've no idea who UK power networks are, I suspect the local electricity supply company, so it may be the case that the supply has been lost. Again up to the council to push this.

UK Power Networks are the Distribution Network Operator (DNO) for south east England and East Anglia. They operate the lower voltage power lines, i.e. those which fall below the National Grid HV routes.

 

[Lemmy282]

Thanks for that, I guessed as much, we have Northern Powergrid as our DNO.

 

[AM9]

The problems of selecting bits of text out of context. In the above post the "use of headlights" comes from the section entitled "dipped headlights and when to use them". From the same page "Side lights also known as parking lights" are for use when the car is parked on an unlit road with a speed limit over 30mph.
So, in normal driving at night you should use dipped headlights, no matter whether the road is lit or unlit, side lights are not enough. Main beam headlights are for use when there is no oncoming traffic.
Street lighting is designed to provide a level of illumination which is suitable for pedestrians to see where they are going, headlights allow drivers to see and be seen.

Therefore, if a moving vehicle has only parking lights switched on outside the official lighting up hours, it must be against the regulations as the visibilty is inadequate for no lights. It's quite inadequate to drive on a NSL road with juist parking lights showing. The argument is that the driver is acknowledging poor visibility by putting any lights on. Given that headlights are now lower power, typicallt 12W on dipped beam, the old (and totally irrelvant) excuse that running on parking lights "saves the battery" is neither true or even legally valid.

 

[Snow1964]

Without wishing to go off topic, in rural Wiltshire they are now not cutting hedges and many warning signs are now obscured, even those with red circles, not just triangular and direction signs.