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New Brent Cross West (Thameslink) station
- Thread starter Supercoss
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Possibly as going back some time it was once proposed Cricklewood closed when what is now Brent Cross West opened => almost certainly eliminated 12car platform rebuilding from TL2000 project (as it was then) if it was expected to close.
It is not the only one e.g. Hendon is 8car platforms (indeed 700s ASDO opens only 7cars) and does have the room to expand; Kentish Town on the other hand is 8car and short of some mammoth works and money has no real hope of ever being more than 8car.
Because it was only ever going to be served by 8 car trains, except for very occaisonal 12s late at night ir duing disruption.
ASDO is always in operation at Hendon, as only the first seven coaches open the doors there.
That being said, I definitely understand why they wouldn’t want to stop 12 coaches trains there all the time, you will inevitably have someone in the rear coaches unable to get off the train, especially at peak hours.
AlastairFraser
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Makes sense
Yet Mill Hill Broadway was 8car and extended to 12car but none of the TLP plans contemporary with that works seemed to show anything that would normally have been 12car to have called there. No normal base pattern service has had 12car calling there so far.
The original TL2000 plans were for all stations north of Thames to be all 12car platforms because way back then today's pattern of 8 / 12 car was not known, and, one iteration of TL2000 was all 12car anyway (and going to a somewhat different perm of destinations south of Thames than we have today, most/all of which were 10 if not 12car).
The fly in the ointment was - and still is - Kentish Town and TLP never had that one as 12car even though TL2000 did. Once that became impractical to extend, it opened the window for 8car platforms elsewhere, hence Hendon and Cricklewood, but (as posted already) Cricklewood 12car was almost certainly already knocked on the head with TL2000 when the Brent Cross idea came up as Cricklewood was then planned to have closed.
Back then, in TL2000 days, and even the early days of TLP, ASDO was never an answer to all this - as ASDO did not exist then.
They also counter-balance/counterpart a slew of 8 car (many 10) platforms on the Southern network, in terms of service pairs. So largely pointless.
Mill Hill used to be a semi-fast call. In the old days, over West Hampstead. And then a semi-call on the patterns which now run express to Elstree. So it's not a surprise it was planned to be 12 car at the time.
ASDO provides a safe way to manage short platforms, and regular users would soon learn to be in the right section.
The CIS on the platform will tell people as well as the train itself, as long as the PIS is set up. If a stop is added and the 700 just says 'check station screens' then it won't warn in advance, which can cause problems.
The CIS on the platform will tell people as well as the train itself, as long as the PIS is set up. If a stop is added and the 700 just says 'check station screens' then it won't warn in advance, which can cause problems.
Well theres a story about the Mill Hill Broadway Fast line platfrom 12 car extensions, but I’ll save that for another day.
The 189 will be rerouted to serve the station in a few weeks.
That double run will be in place for a good while as the works needed to deliver the Tempelhof Avenue connection & replacement bridge over the A406 (which would also enable the route 326 extension) haven't been applied for yet.
That double run will be in place for a good while as the works needed to deliver the Tempelhof Avenue connection & replacement bridge over the A406 (which would also enable the route 326 extension) haven't been applied for yet.
H&I
Member
I saw information at the gateline giving directions to Brent Cross Shopping Centre; many people arrive at the station thinking that the shopping centre is conveniently nearby. This rerouting should be helpful to them.
A nice digital clock now appears on the display panels.In this picture of Sunil's...
... you can see what greets you as you turn off the footbridge to the station. Times for the next dozen trains, but no indication of the current time. There is no clock visible on a side wall either. Is this a deliberate policy to stop people running, or just an oversight? I know most people have a watch or a phone, and when you get down to the platforms the next train indicators do tell you the current time, but to present encyclopaedic knowledge of train times at the entrance without presenting the current time seems bizarre. Maybe a nice physical clock was in the initial spec but it got value-engineered away without anyone rethinking the above displays.
Seven weeks later, still one escalator not working!
Mordac
Established Member
That bears Birmingham New Street.
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It would appear that Brent Cross West hasn’t yet been put into the Rail Miles mileage calculator’s parameters.
Has anyone got any mileage references to/from adjacent stations, please?
Has anyone got any mileage references to/from adjacent stations, please?
66 chains from Cricklewood, 1 mile 4 chains to Hendon.
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Fab, thanks.
They didn't... the entire escalator has been removed and is being replaced or fixed. Some staff went up on a cherry picker last week to look at or fix the roof.
I still can't see how the station has passive provision for extra platforms for the West London Orbital - there is no way that the existing station could have that added without removing major structural elements, so I can only imagine a separate Overground station on Geron Way.
swt_passenger
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I found a report:
The report is fairly detailed and includes a plan of an additional island platform, offset to the south compared to the other two platforms, and how it would connect into the paid side of the station concourse that’s already built:
Great, thanks. This would either require removal of the supports of the existing canopy, or squeezing a narrow corridor between them in a way that would look fairly incongruous with the existing station, so it's not quite what I would call passive provision!
Thanks for that, very helpful.
I can appreciate why they have gone for that option - it would keep construction away from the Hendon lines, (and doesn't interfere with the reception siding) but it would also preclude serving the station on a direct service between Hendon and West Hampstead on the Hendon lines, which might be operationally advantageous - i.e. WLO - Brent Cross West - Hendon - (reverse) - Brent Cross West - Cricklewood - West Hampstead - (Reverse) - Cricklewood - WLO.
Which all seems a shame, as having the access come down in the middle of the new platform would be much better, as would having the platforms on the Hendon lines by moving the junction to the south. Could anything be done about that reception siding to enable that?
I can appreciate why they have gone for that option - it would keep construction away from the Hendon lines, (and doesn't interfere with the reception siding) but it would also preclude serving the station on a direct service between Hendon and West Hampstead on the Hendon lines, which might be operationally advantageous - i.e. WLO - Brent Cross West - Hendon - (reverse) - Brent Cross West - Cricklewood - West Hampstead - (Reverse) - Cricklewood - WLO.
Which all seems a shame, as having the access come down in the middle of the new platform would be much better, as would having the platforms on the Hendon lines by moving the junction to the south. Could anything be done about that reception siding to enable that?
I've never seen anything like that. It's always been a split 4tph to each station, Brent Cross West and Cricklewood/West Hampstead.
I know that's the plan, but if you link that axis with a frequent LO service as part of the WLO service you could then start to reduce Thameslink calls to speed those services up. As planned, you will still need Thameslink serving Cricklewood and Hendon to link them otherwise passengers would need to travel all the way to Neasden (or doubling back) to get between the branches.
Apologies for the tangent, but in an ideal world I'd like to see something more like the arrangement on the WCML, with the Hendon lines extended to new terminal bays on the west side of Mill Hill Broadway, and Thameslink then only serving Mill Hill Broadway and West Hampstead, passengers using the very frequent LO services to get to West Hampstead or Mill Hill for interchange, possibly with one or two new stations added along that axis on the Hendon lines only. I can appreciate that the Brent Cross city developers might not like losing the sales pitch of direct trains, though!
Apologies for the tangent, but in an ideal world I'd like to see something more like the arrangement on the WCML, with the Hendon lines extended to new terminal bays on the west side of Mill Hill Broadway, and Thameslink then only serving Mill Hill Broadway and West Hampstead, passengers using the very frequent LO services to get to West Hampstead or Mill Hill for interchange, possibly with one or two new stations added along that axis on the Hendon lines only. I can appreciate that the Brent Cross city developers might not like losing the sales pitch of direct trains, though!