Nightmare scenario of hospitals reaching capacity.

[Tin Rocket]

At the saturday news briefing the three chaps were telling us that hospital capacity is in grave danger of being overwhelmed with COVID-19 patients,will anyone tell us what happens then or will we just be told on the day it happens that there is no more room?
Will it come to a point where a public announcement will be made that no more covid patients will be admitted?
The Government hasn't told us what happens in this scenario from what I recall so far this year.

 

[HSTEd]

There isn't really a hard line when hospitals are "full" and cannot accept any more patients.

What happens in reality is the staff patient ratio falls and the lines of patients being triaged get longer and longer.
Patients will end up diverted to extemporised wards etc.

But they won't just close the doors.

 

[Darandio]

What is interesting is the fact that first time around the Nightingale sites weren't needed. Now we're being told hospitals are potentially nearing levels seen first time around but i've not seen hardly a mention of Nightingale.

 

[james60059]

One of the Nightingales, may have been London only seen a couple of dozen patients, I believe it was 4000-bed capacity.

 

[Crossover]

What is interesting is the fact that first time around the Nightingale sites weren't needed. Now we're being told hospitals are potentially nearing levels seen first time around but i've not seen hardly a mention of Nightingale.

There was mention on the radio news this morning that the Nightingale hospitals aren't a panacea - that the beds may be there but the staff to run them isn't. Couldn't really make it up!

 

[birchesgreen]

The Nightengales were largely created to make it look like the government was doing something.

 

[DB]

There was mention on the radio news this morning that the Nightingale hospitals aren't a panacea - that the beds may be there but the staff to run them isn't. Couldn't really make it up!

So firstly why did they set them up in the first place, and secondly why have they not taken steps over the summer to get as many staff as possible on standby - e.g. retired doctors and nurses, part-trained new nurses, etc.

The Nightengales were largely created to make it look like the government was doing something.

Pretty much true of every aspect of their handling of this situation!

 

[Tin Rocket]

Hospital capacity is finite,I cannot find any government or NHS advice on what to expect or what to do when capacity is reached as it seems to be expected.

 

[MotCO]

I think one of the purposes of the Nightingale wards was to separate Covid cases from non-Covid cases to try to stop cross-contamination, but yes, the issue remains as to who will staff them.

In terms of whether hospitals will shut, sometimes hospitals do close A&E if they are over-whelmed, or, from personal knowledge, when a hospital boiler house was flooded or when there was a patient with suspected radiation contamination. In terms of 'patient priortising', either patients are transferred to neighbouring hospitals, or patients are assessed and the more acutely ill patients are prioritised.

 

[HSTEd]

There was mention on the radio news this morning that the Nightingale hospitals aren't a panacea - that the beds may be there but the staff to run them isn't. Couldn't really make it up!

Unfortunately this isn't really true.

Before this started the medical unions agreed a reduction in staff requirements for ICU by a factor of six.

They don't want to but they can.

 

[Trackman]

What is interesting is the fact that first time around the Nightingale sites weren't needed. Now we're being told hospitals are potentially nearing levels seen first time around but i've not seen hardly a mention of Nightingale.

Manchester Nightingale re-opened a few days ago, but it is only taking non-covid patients.

 

[DB]

Manchester Nightingale re-opened a few days ago, but it is only taking non-covid patients.

It doesn't really matter what they use them for - the important point is that they are exra capacity over and above the regular hospitals.

 

[Crossover]

Unfortunately this isn't really true.

Before this started the medical unions agreed a reduction in staff requirements for ICU by a factor of six.

They don't want to but they can.

Someone may wish to advise the media of such rather than them being made out as total white elephants!

 

[HSTEd]

Someone may wish to advise the media of such rather than them being made out as total white elephants!

Well they are total white elephants, but mainly because the government is not willing to allow infections to grow to a level where they are useful!
NHS management is also stubbornly unwilling to embrace an epidemic medicine mindset, hence the arguments between them and the Army Medical Corps.

Nightingales were essentially designed for final stage recovery and for hospice care. NHS management was unwilling to accept the latter for PR reasons

 

[BackOnTheTrain]

When they’re “at capacity” with Covid-19 patients then they’ll shut down elective surgery completely if they already haven’t — and that includes not-immediately-life-threatening cancer surgery too. Essentially if you’re not going to die from something else within two weeks then expect a Covid-19 patient to get priority for the bed you want for other reasons. Quite what happens when “urgent” elective surgery has been shut down I don’t know. Probably prioritise the youngest patients over the oldest, or more accurately the most likely to survive it over the least likely to survive.