Northern Revenue Staff At Manchester Piccadilly & Barrier Issues

[33117]

Morning All,

Has anybody had issues with the northern revenue staff at manchester piccadilly, the staff that stand at the end of platforms 10&11??

I frequently travel through piccadilly & was coming down the travelators from platform 13 & as I got near to the revenue staff checking tickets they let about 4 or 5 people walk past them & stopped me. However what I find mad is that after I'd had my ticket checked they then let at least 6 people walk straight by them again.

So I suppose my question is this:

Aren't they supposed to be checking everyone's tickets & not just seemingly doing random checks????

Seems very odd & alas a situation that's going to continue as according to the avanti staff I've talked to northern won't cough up the wonga to install ticket barriers at that end which would cause far less hassle.



Also with the barriers that avanti & transpennine have is it true that they can only hold a certain number of codes for tickets. I.E. routes etc etc? Avanti & transpennine staff told me that, plus if you've got a through ticket the barriers won't accept it so you have to get a member of gateline staff to let you through which can be annoying.


Sorry for the lengthy post.

Cheers
Luke

 

[Class800]

Morning All,

Has anybody had issues with the northern revenue staff at manchester piccadilly, the staff that stand at the end of platforms 10&11??

I frequently travel through piccadilly & was coming down the travelators from platform 13 & as I got near to the revenue staff checking tickets they let about 4 or 5 people walk past them & stopped me. However what I find mad is that after I'd had my ticket checked they then let at least 6 people walk straight by them again.

So I suppose my question is this:

Aren't they supposed to be checking everyone's tickets & not just seemingly doing random checks????

Seems very odd & alas a situation that's going to continue as according to the avanti staff I've talked to northern won't cough up the wonga to install ticket barriers at that end which would cause far less hassle.



Also with the barriers that avanti & transpennine have is it true that they can only hold a certain number of codes for tickets. I.E. routes etc etc? Avanti & transpennine staff told me that, plus if you've got a through ticket the barriers won't accept it so you have to get a member of gateline staff to let you through which can be annoying.


Sorry for the lengthy post.

Cheers
Luke

Agree - personally can't rule out some profiling, which is probably unfair. Anecdotally when I've been there more young men stopped. Gender is a protected characteristic as is age, but can't rule it out. I've found them a bit unpleasant but never had them make a ticketing error

 

[Watershed]

Morning All,

Has anybody had issues with the northern revenue staff at manchester piccadilly, the staff that stand at the end of platforms 10&11??

I frequently travel through piccadilly & was coming down the travelators from platform 13 & as I got near to the revenue staff checking tickets they let about 4 or 5 people walk past them & stopped me. However what I find mad is that after I'd had my ticket checked they then let at least 6 people walk straight by them again.

So I suppose my question is this:

Aren't they supposed to be checking everyone's tickets & not just seemingly doing random checks????

Seems very odd & alas a situation that's going to continue as according to the avanti staff I've talked to northern won't cough up the wonga to install ticket barriers at that end which would cause far less hassle.



Also with the barriers that avanti & transpennine have is it true that they can only hold a certain number of codes for tickets. I.E. routes etc etc? Avanti & transpennine staff told me that, plus if you've got a through ticket the barriers won't accept it so you have to get a member of gateline staff to let you through which can be annoying.


Sorry for the lengthy post.

Cheers
Luke

In my experience, the Northern staff have always checked all tickets, albeit not necessarily in 100% detail as queues often don't permit this.

It's correct that barriers must be manually programmed to accept any ticket that isn't issued to or from the station where they're located. Obviously the most popular journeys get programmed in, but for less popular ones, the barrier will reject your ticket and you'll have to get the staff to let you through manually.

Worth noting that the programming for e-tickets and smartcards is separate to that for paper tickets, so it's possible that the former might let you through but not the latter.

 

[33117]

In my experience, the Northern staff have always checked all tickets, albeit not necessarily in 100% detail as queues often don't permit this.

It's correct that barriers must be manually programmed to accept any ticket that isn't issued to or from the station where they're located. Obviously the most popular journeys get programmed in, but for less popular ones, the barrier will reject your ticket and you'll have to get the staff to let you through manually.

Worth noting that the programming for e-tickets and smartcards is separate to that for paper tickets, so it's possible that the former might let you through but not the latter.

Just really think northern should open their wallet & install ticket gates.

It'd save the massive queues you get waiting for the revenue staff to deal with people.

With regards the paper tickets they remind me a bit of the orange versions (not the card type) but the thin kinda business card 1s that a guard with a ticket machine printed out. What were the names of those?

 

[Bletchleyite]

At Piccadilly there needs to be a single set of gates across the whole station with a single company staffing them. The three sets are silly and easy to circumvent.

 

[scrapy]

Just really think northern should open their wallet & install ticket gates.

It'd save the massive queues you get waiting for the revenue staff to deal with people.

With regards the paper tickets they remind me a bit of the orange versions (not the card type) but the thin kinda business card 1s that a guard with a ticket machine printed out. What were the names of those?

Not as simple as this. Any money spent by Northern has to be authorised by the DFT, they are not really authorising any capital expenditure. The only reason Virgin (now Avanti) and TPE installed gates is because their franchise required them to.

At Piccadilly there needs to be a single set of gates across the whole station with a single company staffing them. The three sets are silly and easy to circumvent.

Agreed, and there should be a couple of gates at the top of the lift to Fairfield St

 

[L401CJF]

Not sure if we are talking about the same people or if things have changed here but I got stopped by one of the agency(?) ticket inspectors around a year ago and told my pass wasn't valid. I was wearing my TOCs uniform and showed my TOC pass, having just worked a train in and nipped to grab a Greggs before the return journey! It was the ones who had little phones to scan mobile tickets and i think they had typical green security viz vests etc.

His colleague quickly shouted oi he's staff let him through! Presumably the guy was new and hadn't seen many TFW staff yet ha ha. To be fair our uniform didn't really stand out as uniform if the black fleece was zipped right up, and our TOC cards don't say TFW on them, just the "T" logo and "active staff" "Class- STD"

 

[DanNCL]

I’ve had issues using PTE tickets with the manual ticket check at Piccadilly several times. Never encountered issues at the TPE or Avanti gatelines with exactly the same tickets.

 

[sonic2009]

I’ve had issues using PTE tickets with the manual ticket check at Piccadilly several times. Never encountered issues at the TPE or Avanti gatelines with exactly the same tickets.

Agreed on this one - I had one of the ticket checkers said that my bus ticket wasn't valid on the train - i had to point out that you can buy System One tickets onboard the bus - he shrugged his shoulders and let me through.

 

[33117]

Not as simple as this. Any money spent by Northern has to be authorised by the DFT, they are not really authorising any capital expenditure. The only reason Virgin (now Avanti) and TPE installed gates is because their franchise required them to.


Agreed, and there should be a couple of gates at the top of the lift to Fairfield St

Only issue with gates at the top of the fairfield st lift is that there's a disabled loo literally right next to it.

I know it's their job checking tickets but when they reach & touch someone's phone to zoom in & make the QR code larger (it doesn't scan if it's too small) without asking that's a bit too far as your talking about somebody's personal property.

Same with railcards, yes check it but don't touch, never know. The amount of people go to the bathroom then don't wash their hands, urgh no thanks I'd rather not have my railcard & the wallet I've got it in touched by anybody except me.

 

[Haywain]

Just really think northern should open their wallet & install ticket gates.

Barriers still have to be staffed, and wouldn't do much to improve revenue protection.

 

[33117]

Barriers still have to be staffed, and wouldn't do much to improve revenue protection.

How do yo work that out then?

Because if someone wanted to fare dodge & hadn't been gripped by the guard on a train coming into piccadilly then the only way out is via the fairfield st lift if it's working ,& there aren't staff near it which there can be.

Unless a person is willing to jump over the barriers then the staff will undoubtedly question why they hadn't got a ticket. If any suspicion arose of fare dodging they could escort somebody over to the ticket machine & remain with them until they've purchased a ticket which I have seen happen a couple of times.

 

[Haywain]

How do yo work that out then?

Because if someone wanted to fare dodge & hadn't been gripped by the guard on a train coming into piccadilly then the only way out is via the fairfield st lift if it's working ,& there aren't staff near it which there can be.

Unless a person is willing to jump over the barriers then the staff will undoubtedly question why they hadn't got a ticket. If any suspicion arose of fare dodging they could escort somebody over to the ticket machine & remain with them until they've purchased a ticket which I have seen happen a couple of times.

Barriers present an obstacle to those without tickets but can do little to stop those who are short faring or using discounts to which they are not entitled. And unless you are employing more than minimum staff levels at the barriers, they can't be escorting the ticketless to machines to supervise their purchases even if those ticketless people don't just run off instead. So you are essentially suggesting that you need the same number of staff as they use now, but with added barriers.

 

[33117]

Barriers present an obstacle to those without tickets but can do little to stop those who are short faring or using discounts to which they are not entitled. And unless you are employing more than minimum staff levels at the barriers, they can't be escorting the ticketless to machines to supervise their purchases even if those ticketless people don't just run off instead. So you are essentially suggesting that you need the same number of staff as they use now, but with added barriers.

Yes I see where you're coming from now totally.

 

[_toommm_]

I’ve had many an issue with the TPE staff manning the lower numbered platforms, coming from Hyde North or Flowery Field (the former only recently getting a ticket machine back). I’ve been shouted at, been told what I’m doing is illegal, been told by multiple staff that I should have bought before I’d boarded the train, even after showing them the NRE page that that is impossible from Flowery Field, been told that I have to seek out the guard.