Portsmouth - Havant - Hayling - Portsmouth Circle Line (1885)

[DerekC]

I will start with some extracts from a booklet called "Portsmouth Railways" by Edwin Course, published by Portsmouth City Council in 1969. A copy has kindly been given to me recently:

"In 1885 plans were deposited for a railway to link to link the Southsea Branch to the Hayling island Branch. Although the line would have been only 3 1/2 miles long the proposed capital of £84,000 reflected an unusually high cost because of the bridge over the entrance to Langstone Harbour……..On Hayling island the line was to run north of Sinah Common, to cross the road and to link up with the existing railway just north of its terminus. The company were required to open a station on the Hayling side of the bridge. On Portsea Island the new line was to branch off from the Southsea line short of the bridge under Goldsmith Ave. ………………. The bill received the royal assent on 25th September 1886. ………………. There is no doubt that if the line had been constructed it would have led to a rapid residential development in the West of Hayling Island. It would have been operated by the LBSCR who intended at least some of the trains to run on a circular route around Langstone Harbour. Starting from Portsmouth they would have run either clockwise or anti clockwise through Eastney, Hayling, Langstone, Havant and Bedhampton" (and presumably Hilsea).

I hadn't heard of this proposal before. It strikes me that if built it might have radically changed Hayling Island and possibly parts of Portsmouth too. What do others think? Would it still be running?

 

[Sun Chariot]

Northney still gives an inkling into how rural Hayling Island was. Apart from agriculture, there was little to drive a population growth on the island in the 19th century. The sheer cost of infrastructure build and upkeep, I'm certain would have forced line closure, well before the Marples / Beeching era.

 

[DerekC]

Northney still gives an inkling into how rural Hayling Island was. Apart from agriculture, there was little to drive a population growth on the island in the 19th century. The sheer cost of infrastructure build and upkeep, I'm certain would have forced line closure, well before the Marples / Beeching era.

Wasn't the idea in the 19th century that the railway itself would encourage development? It certainly worked around London - see "Metroland". South Hayling would have been about the same distance from the centre of Portsmouth as the north end of Portsea Island, and it seems very likely that it would have developed some commuter traffic into the city. Whether that would have been enough to maintain the line into modern times may be doubtful. The Hayling Billy lasted on its own until the 1960s, without a link into Portsmouth. I think a major problem in railway terms, if a circular commuter service had really been operated, would be timetabling it into the mix of services running from Portsmouth & Southsea via Portcreek Junction and Havant.

 

[DelW]

Presumably the maritime authorities would have required an opening span across the harbour entrance, so that sailing boats could still reach Langstone. That would have added to both construction and operating costs of the line. I suspect that it would have closed at about the same time as the Havant to Hayling line did.

 

[DerekC]

Presumably the maritime authorities would have required an opening span across the harbour entrance, so that sailing boats could still reach Langstone.

I am sure that's true.

That would have added to both construction and operating costs of the line. I suspect that it would have closed at about the same time as the Havant to Hayling line did.

You may be right. However South Hayling would have in effect become a suburb of Portsmouth and is likely to have expanded to several times its current size. I wonder if that would have generated enough traffic to keep it open.

 

[778]

Northney still gives an inkling into how rural Hayling Island was. Apart from agriculture, there was little to drive a population growth on the island in the 19th century. The sheer cost of infrastructure build and upkeep, I'm certain would have forced line closure, well before the Marples / Beeching era.

The line probably did well to survive as long as it did, when you consider that the West Sussex Railway, very similar to the Hayling Island branch closed 30 years earlier.

 

[DelW]

You may be right. However South Hayling would have in effect become a suburb of Portsmouth and is likely to have expanded to several times its current size. I wonder if that would have generated enough traffic to keep it open.

Yes, I suppose that if sufficient commuter business had built up over the years, it might have survived in the same way as the Gunnislake branch has, on the basis that the road alternative is impractically long in both distance and time.

 

[Gloster]

Yes, I suppose that if sufficient commuter business had built up over the years, it might have survived in the same way as the Gunnislake branch has, on the basis that the road alternative is impractically long in both distance and time.

More likely a road would have been built, possibly on the railway’s bridge structure if it was strong enough. If it wasn’t strong enough, then they would surely find the money for a new bridge: this would probably coincide with the Beeching closures, if the line had lasted so long.

 

[Sun Chariot]

More likely a road would have been built, possibly on the railway’s bridge structure if it was strong enough. If it wasn’t strong enough, then they would surely find the money for a new bridge: this would probably coincide with the Beeching closures, if the line had lasted so long.

Eastney (northeast Portsea Isle) still has a pedestrian chain ferry to west Hayling and, although water there is tidal, it's a very shallow draft.

Langstone (where the road bridge and the erstwhile Hayling Billy railway bridge are sited) are across slightly deeper tidal water; it's not deep enough to cater for the scale of seacraft currently using Portsmouth (HM Navy, Wightlink and Brittany Ferries).

Havant was, until post-WW2, a small provincial market town and a logistically-practical consumer of Hayling's farming / agriculture.
I do not believe Hayling would have experienced a residential growth in the 19th century, nor in the years before motor car ownership became accessible to the average citizen.

 

[cinders&ashes]

The line probably did well to survive as long as it did, when you consider that the West Sussex Railway, very similar to the Hayling Island branch closed 30 years earlier.

sorry to join the party late. Hayling Branch line was popular and profitable until the end - what killed it during Beeching was that the railway bridge needed renewing and, in the context of the ongoing cuts, such a cost was prohibitive.
So, it's a moot point whether the circle would've aided to worsened that choice. For starters, there's another bridge cost, it's possible that just one route would remain (Havant or Southsea) rather than a circle. Otherwise, if there'd be large scale development, the volumes might've justified bridge renewal and connections to both Pompey and Havant for commuters. It's a beast getting on/off the island, I actually avoid going there when the weather is nice because long traffic queues and parking nightmares are guaranteed.

 

[DerekC]

sorry to join the party late. Hayling Branch line was popular and profitable until the end - what killed it during Beeching was that the railway bridge needed renewing and, in the context of the ongoing cuts, such a cost was prohibitive.
So, it's a moot point whether the circle would've aided to worsened that choice. For starters, there's another bridge cost, it's possible that just one route would remain (Havant or Southsea) rather than a circle. Otherwise, if there'd be large scale development, the volumes might've justified bridge renewal and connections to both Pompey and Havant for commuters. It's a beast getting on/off the island, I actually avoid going there when the weather is nice because long traffic queues and parking nightmares are guaranteed.

I agree with you, in that it seems possible that the direct connection to Portsmouth might have generated sufficiently large scale development on Hayling to support the continued existence of one or both connections. Against the continuation of the railway is the fact that large scale development would also have also prompted a road bridge across the entrance to Langstone Harbour and probably road improvements at the north end of Hayling Island as well. A more interesting question from a railway perspective is how the existing network would have coped with two or three "Portsmouth Circle" trains per hour, which would have been needed for a suburban-type service.

 

[paul1609]

Eastney (northeast Portsea Isle) still has a pedestrian chain ferry to west Hayling and, although water there is tidal, it's a very shallow draft.

The Pride of Hayling isn't a chain ferry it's a 63 person workboat type launch: https://www.haylingferry.net/aboutus

 

[Sun Chariot]

The Pride of Hayling isn't a chain ferry it's a 63 person workboat type launch: https://www.haylingferry.net/aboutus

Thanks - I've watched it countless times and I always mis-assumed it was a chain

 

[cinders&ashes]

The Pride of Hayling isn't a chain ferry it's a 63 person workboat type launch: https://www.haylingferry.net/aboutus

Yeap. They've gone and been brought back a couple of times in the past several years. What would really help would be joined up bus service each side but the current routes Hayling side go nowhere near Ferry Point.

 

[Sun Chariot]

Yeap. They've gone and been brought back a couple of times in the past several years. What would really help would be joined up bus service each side but the current routes Hayling side go nowhere near Ferry Point.

When my wife first showed me the Eastney road - past the marina and RNLI shed - it felt more like a frontier-land than southeast Hampshire....