Post Integrated Rail Plan services in Yorkshire

[Glenn1969]

Just wondered what people think the Government will actually do to improve connectivity between the 7 major cities in Yorkshire and how they will ultimately connect Leeds and York to HS2?

 

[MattRat]

Three 'options' as I can see it:
- Via Manchester on the Western leg.
- Heavily upgraded MML.
- Connect HS2 to ECML.

 

[Glenn1969]

I get that

However some of the regional connections are currently poor with Sheffield-Leeds and Sheffield-Manchester connections currently worse than Manchester-Leeds. I think these need consideration and the lines between all 7 cities in Yorkshire need to be wired as soon as practical

 

[RochdalePioneers]

Just wondered what people think the Government will actually do to improve connectivity between the 7 major cities in Yorkshire and how they will ultimately connect Leeds and York to HS2?

Nothing.

 

[Purple Orange]

Just wondered what people think the Government will actually do to improve connectivity between the 7 major cities in Yorkshire and how they will ultimately connect Leeds and York to HS2?

There will be services to Birmingham via Manchester as that will be the fastest route from the north east.

 

[Glenn1969]

Surely any time savings will be marginal given how much of a long way round it is. And Sheffield- Leeds as a corridor is more in need of improvement than Manchester-Leeds (or is that just me?)

 

[Peterthegreat]

There will be services to Birmingham via Manchester as that will be the fastest route from the north east.

And how does that improve services between Yorkshire cities?

 

[Purple Orange]

And how does that improve services between Yorkshire cities?

I was answering how Leeds-York will be connected to HS2.

Surely any time savings will be marginal given how much of a long way round it is. And Sheffield- Leeds as a corridor is more in need of improvement than Manchester-Leeds (or is that just me?)

Leeds-Manc-Brum will be 89 mins according to the IRP, which is a time that Leeds-Sheffield-Brum won’t be anywhere close to achieving.

 

[Glenn1969]

I was answering how Leeds-York will be connected to HS2.



Leeds-Manc-Brum will be 89 mins according to the IRP, which is a time that Leeds-Sheffield-Brum won’t be anywhere close to achieving.

But in the IRP it's not clear that there will be direct services. Anything involving connection will add to the journey time.

 

[tbtc]

some of the regional connections are currently poor with Sheffield-Leeds and Sheffield-Manchester connections currently worse than Manchester-Leeds

Agreed - but the plans are for yet more money to be spent on Manchester - Leeds

Based on the main train station in each city, the "as the crow flies" distances are:

Leeds to Sheffield: 29:00mi
Manchester to Sheffield: 32.37mi
Manchester to Leeds: 35.58mi

...yet Manchester to Leeds is going to be significantly faster and more frequent than services from either of those cities to Sheffield. If you miss the one "fast" train per hour from Leeds to Sheffield then you could be in Birmingham in a similar time to the time a slow train takes from Leeds to Sheffield

We were meant to be getting a properly fast Leeds - Sheffield line as a "sop" for cancelling the eastern side of HS2, if the rumours were true, but electrifying a second route from Leeds to Bradford seems to have been more of a priority

We'll have a passing loop on the Hope Valley line between Sheffield and Manchester some time in the next twenty years, I guess, so we should be grateful for that!

the 7 major cities in Yorkshire

I think these need consideration and the lines between all 7 cities in Yorkshire need to be wired as soon as practical

I'm struggling with the "seven", unless you are including Ripon as a "major" city that needs electrifying?

Leeds, Bradford, Wakefield and York are clearly already electrified, Sheffield will be getting wires when HS2 comes (albeit at the southern end), so it's really Hull that would have an unnelectrified Yorkshire station (?)

 

[Purple Orange]

But in the IRP it's not clear that there will be direct services. Anything involving connection will add to the journey time.

It does. Look at page 12 on the IRP, where it states that there will be direct Birmingham-Leeds services in 79-89 minutes.

 

[Glenn1969]

It does. Look at page 12 on the IRP, where it states that there will be direct Birmingham-Leeds services in 79-89 minutes.

Yes it does having read it again

West Yorkshire actually comes out of this quite well- but only if WY Mass Transit is built in full. Which I hope it does.

 

[Purple Orange]

Yes it does having read it again

West Yorkshire actually comes out of this quite well- but only if WY Mass Transit is built in full. Which I hope it does.

There is also a line about NPR going as far as York, which would mean that the services to Newcastle would be the Birmingham trains and the services from Liverpool terminate at York. I’m a bit intrigued as to how Hull will be served if it is not being electrified, but I guess that’ll be the semi-fast services that continue using the existing line.

 

[Ploughman]

Just wondered what people think the Government will actually do to improve connectivity between the 7 major cities in Yorkshire and how they will ultimately connect Leeds and York to HS2?

Define the 7 Cities please.

 

[Jorge Da Silva]

Define the 7 Cities please.

I count 5: Sheffield, York, Leeds, Hull, Bradford

 

[Peterthegreat]

I count 5: Sheffield, York, Leeds, Hull, Bradford

The seven Yorkshire (historic boundaries) cities are those plus Wakefield and Ripon. The seven largest places are:-
Leeds
Sheffield
Bradford
Hull
York
Huddersfield
Middlesbrough

The seven busiest stations are:-
Leeds
Sheffield
York
Huddersfield
Doncaster
Bradford Int
Hull

 

[RochdalePioneers]

However you define them, IRP does nothing for Yorkshire. TRU was already happening and will be made less effective trying to ram HS services down it as and when the new tunnel opens in 2042. Leeds to Sheffield scrapped. Leeds to Bradford pie in the sky guess that NR now need to laugh at. No new Leeds station and approaches. Its a pretty raw deal.

 

[Glenn1969]

However you define them, IRP does nothing for Yorkshire. TRU was already happening and will be made less effective trying to ram HS services down it as and when the new tunnel opens in 2042. Leeds to Sheffield scrapped. Leeds to Bradford pie in the sky guess that NR now need to laugh at. No new Leeds station and approaches. Its a pretty raw deal.

That's kind of my thought as well. When I said 7 Cities I forgot Doncaster isn't a city