Prosecution for having a child ticket - Have now been summonsed

[SomeUser1468]

Back in 2021 I mistakingly purchased a child’s ticket when travelling from Swansea - Cardiff (thought someone of that age range was going to be travelling with me at the time but at last minute pulled and forgot to click off)

I got caught by one of the railway inspectors and and was questioned. I was not given the opportunity to buy a proper ticket from the enforcement officer (I even offered to buy one multiple times due to the mistake) and gave all correct information to the officer explaining how it was a mistake and how I was sorry. I was told that prosecution would be the very last resort as long as I did what TIL said and paid a fine (I was giving nothing at the time about paying a fine)

I was told I’d be in contact by TIL about sending a written piece explaining my side of the story which I was and I tried.

After I finished writing the letter, I couldn’t remember the address (didn’t have the official TIL letter on me at the time) and so I asked the TFW Twitter for the official address. Not knowing, I found out about a week later that the address that they gave me was incorrect and it was for another company called IRCAS. I only found out due to them sending me a letter saying it was for the wrong company and that they would forward the letter onto the correct company on my behalf (TIL).

I had/have had no correspondence after that from both TFW or TIL about the matter after that.

Now, fast forward to yesterday I had a letter from the Magistrates come through the post saying that I was being summoned to court on S5 RORA. I’m quite confused as it even says on the TFW website that they’d write to you first before a decision has been made regarding an incident which they did not. TIL did not send me a letter before this either about being prosecuted or a settlement.

Now, reading online, I realise that TFW say that prosecution is unavoidable in cases of fraud and the intent not to pay, but I offered multiple times to the officer to pay for a new ticket to help solve the issue.

Is there anything I can do? Can I try and settle it out of court or will I just be told to go to court anyway? This is the first time this has ever happened to be and I’m not really sure how to approach this.

I have ASD and anxiety so I’m not sure if the way I presented myself at the time helped as I struggle with social situations and scared of going to court due to these reasons.

Thank you!

 

[spag23]

I am sure others will address the apparent absence of prosecution warning letters; as an industry outsider I don't know the difference between TFW, TIL and IRCAS. But what puzzles me (and perhaps concerns the train company) is why you mistakenly bought an accompanying child ticket without buying an adult one for yourself at the same time.
As others would point out, multiple offers to pay after being challenged at the destination does not somehow demonstrate that - until that challenge - you hadn't been travelling with an intention to avoid full payment. It is that, earlier, intent that forms the basis of the company's case. I'm not saying you are one, but if every evader thought they could escape any penalty simply by offering to pay the proper fare when (and if) challenged, the resultant evasion would cripple the industry, with no-one ever buying a ticket until (and unless) obliged to do so by overwhelmed gate and revenue staff.

 

[Gloster]

Have you ever made the same error, or a similar one, when buying a ticket on line? Even if you were not stopped and your ticket was not checked during the journey on that occasion (or occasions).

 

[AlterEgo]

When in 2021 was this? There is a six month limitation on laying court papers from when the train company detected your offence.

 

[WesternLancer]

Would it help for the OP to get writing to the correct organization, at the correct address, apologising, making it clear you will never do this again, and asking to settle out of court? And doing this urgently in the hope the court action might then be dropped.

It might work to send the letter (or an edit of it) you previously wrote which may or may not have been passed on for you (you will never have any way of knowing if this was actually done so there is a risk it never was, which is bad luck).

Sadly (and I would urge you to look at it from the rail companies point of view to get a sense of where they are coming from) your mitigating points are not really worth very much to the railway as you travelled with a child rate ticket when you are not a child and only when questioned about this did you offer to pay for a correct ticket as I understand it:
"but I offered multiple times to the officer to pay for a new ticket to help solve the issue." ie would you have, after getting off the train, gone to a ticket office and offered to pay for a new ticket if you had not been questioned by the officer, but realised your own mistake?

I guess I mean your effort to resolve it seems to me a bit like shoplifting but offering to pay for the goods only when the shop staff stop and challenge you a few hundred meters down the street, and expecting them not to take any other action

So I don't think worth focusing much on that line of argument.

Anyway - I think better to focus on the apology and request to settle. We have heard of cases where this has been agreed with the prosecutor from the railway at the court before the case, so you may also wish to prepare to make that request there too (ie be ready to go along to the Court on the day), if you have had no luck before the court date with letters.

Hope others can correct any errors in my suggestion.

 

[Wethebest838]

Would it help for the OP to get writing to the correct organization, at the correct address, apologising, making it clear you will never do this again, and asking to settle out of court? And doing this urgently in the hope the court action might then be dropped.

Might be worth doing. Would it be worth including the reply back from the other company saying they will pass it on?

But wouldn’t TIL just see this as the OP should have checked it was the right address? If it was me, I would be like “okay, it was a mistake” but they will see it different.

To the OP - If you reply back then send it with tracking and signature.

My guess is the other company never gave it to TIL or did but after the 21 days to reply thus failing to meet the deadline and I imagine they don’t really care about it. I agree with @AlterEgo, the mitigating circumstances may not be looked at too well.

I do think you still have a chance, might be slimmer but I think it’s possible.

 

[WesternLancer]

My guess is the other company never gave it to TIL or did but after the 21 days to reply thus failing to meet the deadline and I imagine they don’t really care about it.

That's my hunch too.

 

[AlterEgo]

Ultimately the OP purchased a child ticket and does not qualify for one. I advise the OP not to use the defence of “I thought a child would be with me” because there is no corresponding adult ticket.

 

[some bloke]

I mistakingly purchased a child’s ticket when travelling from Swansea - Cardiff (thought someone of that age range was going to be travelling with me at the time but at last minute pulled and forgot to click off)

People on here may be better able to advise if you explain exactly how you ended up choosing/using the ticket and didn't realise, or whatever happened. Train company staff or agents may read posts on this forum. While writing, it may help to imagine the company's point of view, which involves having routinely encountered people who are not telling the truth.

If you post the letter/draft here, people can comment on it.

When is the court date?

Can I try and settle it out of court or will I just be told to go to court anyway?

You can keep asking them (within reason). If it comes to it, you can arrive at the court early, ask staff where the prosecutor is and try to persuade them in person before the case is called.

I’m not sure if the way I presented myself at the time helped as I struggle with social situations

Is there anything specific which you think might be relevant?

 

[Bluejays]

If you'd bought a child ticket for a child you thought would be travelling with you, then I don't see the problem. You could have realised your mistake and shown the correct ticket you'd bought for yourself. If you didn't have a correct ticket for yourself (it seems like you didn't), then I'd strongly suggest you drop this line of defence.

My advice would be to engage with the court papers. Explain any mitigating factors there may be. Also explain the issue with the wrong address being given to you. I'd also contact tfw, ask them to take it in house as a way to rectify the mistake made by their twitter team.

 

[Wethebest838]

If you'd bought a child ticket for a child you thought would be travelling with you, then I don't see the problem. You could have realised your mistake and shown the correct ticket you'd bought for yourself. If you didn't have a correct ticket for yourself (it seems like you didn't), then I'd strongly suggest you drop this line of defence.

I agree with this.