Reserved seats: at what point does a no show make them available?

[peteb]

I mostly travel on day return and open return tickets. I'm often offered a seat reservation which I will take to ensure I actually get a seat, if I travel on my proposed train. But sometimes the seat is not to my liking and I sit somewhere else, or I may catch a different train. So when will that seat reservation become available for someone else to use? And how do you "keep" your reserved seat if you decide to eat in a GWR restaurant car before returning to that seat later in the journey?

I've seen folks told not to occupy vacant reserved seats, but equally I've seen folks told to sit in vacant reserved seats almost as soon as a train has left the station!

 

[Bletchleyite]

I mostly travel on day return and open return tickets. I'm often offered a seat reservation which I will take to ensure I actually get a seat, if I travel on my proposed train. But sometimes the seat is not to my liking and I sit somewhere else, or I may catch a different train. So when will that seat reservation become available for someone else to use? And how do you "keep" your reserved seat if you decide to eat in a GWR restaurant car before returning to that seat later in the journey?

I don't think there is a UK rule as such. In Germany there is one, it's a certain time period from departure, after which it disappears off the screen.

 

[HST274]

Is there an actual rule for that? Personally if I get on say at Cardiff and the I see a seat that should be filled but isn't ill sit on it no matter whether it's reserved from Cardiff or a previous station

 

[Ianno87]

My rule of thumb is around 10 minutes after departure from the station where the reservation starts. If not claimed by then, it's fair game.

 

[Grumpy Git]

My rule of thumb is around 10 minutes after departure from the station where the reservation starts. If not claimed by then, it's fair game.

Too late, as I'll have my backside in it before you.

 

[Bald Rick]

My rule of thumb is actual doors closed time time plus the amount of time it takes to get to that seat from any carriage door of the relevant class (first, standard) , less time for any special factor related to the station you have departed. E.g., if your reserved seat is at the rear of first class on the stops at Euston, you’ll have about 15 seconds after door closure before I’m in it. If it’s at the front of Standard, you’ve got about 3 minutes.

The 1700 / 1800 off KX was always fun for this - about a dozen railway staff in suits standing next to empty but reserved seats in first class, casually reading the paper but actually waiting for the wheels to roll....

 

[trainophile]

I think the Avanti overhead displays change to "Available if Unoccupied" about ten minutes after departure from the station where the reserver would have boarded. Don't think it's a hard and fast rule though.

 

[peteb]

Recently I've travelled a few times on both XC and Avanti with 2 others. Despite booking all 3 seats at the same time and paid for by a single credit card, the seat reservations have been scattered randomly a la Ryanair! But on the train there have been dozens of unoccupied unreserved seats available after departure from the originating station (Manchester Piccadilly) so we all sat together round tables. But why didn't the system book us together, or us that for another thread? It makes it difficult for on train staff when the phone app is held by one passenger but it contains two other tickets of randomly scattered passengers!!

 

[Horizon22]

It's good on the 80x fleet operated by GWR and LNER as it will show the red/amber/green warning. So you'll know if its free if its red, and its vacant.

 

[riceuten]

I don't think there is a UK rule as such. In Germany there is one, it's a certain time period from departure, after which it disappears off the screen.

It's 15 minutes, though if the person turns up a bit later with the reservation, I'll move.

 

[185143]

I think the Avanti overhead displays change to "Available if Unoccupied" about ten minutes after departure from the station where the reserver would have boarded. Don't think it's a hard and fast rule though.

Do they still do that?

I lost a good window table seat to that not long after it was first introduced on a trip to Glasgow, which I wasn't impressed by! They announced that the shop was open so I went and there was a bit of a queue. Opted to wait in it and the train stopped at Preston.

There was certainly no way I was asking a group of already drinking (at 06:41...) Rangers supporters off to watch the Derby to shift out of my seat! Especially not given it wasn't even marked as reserved anymore.

 

[py_megapixel]

It's 15 minutes,

That seems a little arbitrary to me! Have you just made that up or is it stated officially somewhere?

 

[Falcon1200]

I joined an Avanti service at origin (Glasgow Central) and sat in a (vacant !) 'Available if Unoccupied' seat, only for another passenger to claim it 2 minutes later. So clearly the seat was actually reserved, from origin. Are these seats which are reservable at any time up to and after departure, and if so, how does a passenger sat there without a reservation know when it becomes reserved (the display did not change) ?

 

[trainophile]

I joined an Avanti service at origin (Glasgow Central) and sat in a (vacant !) 'Available if Unoccupied' seat, only for another passenger to claim it 2 minutes later. So clearly the seat was actually reserved, from origin. Are these seats which are reservable at any time up to and after departure, and if so, how does a passenger sat there without a reservation know when it becomes reserved (the display did not change) ?

That’s strange. Are you sure it was “if unoccupied”? Sometimes they don’t activate the reservations until after departure if there’s a problem with the system, but then they all come on at once. But then it just shows Available throughout.

The other day the whole train was showing Available and remained so throughout. I was booted (not literally!) from a seat by someone waving a reservation ticket, and when I mentioned it to the TM he said that due to earlier cancelled services they weren’t using reservations. A recipe for mass confusion as it turned out.

 

[Mcr Warrior]

Once had another passenger try to move me out of a seat which was showing as "available if unoccupied", waving a reservation ticket as "proof" of his entitlement. On closer inspection, it turned out that, although it was indeed for the right seat, the reservation was actually for the previous service, which he'd obviously missed.

 

[AlterEgo]

And how do you "keep" your reserved seat if you decide to eat in a GWR restaurant car before returning to that seat later in the journey?

I leave a few things at my seat of low value to make clear it is "occupied".

 

[Bletchleyite]

I leave a few things at my seat of low value to make clear it is "occupied".

I left my jumper on one once and somebody moved it! He was apologetic when I returned, though, said he thought it was lost property.

 

[cornishjohn]

I'm sure I have a 70's timetable that said reservations had to be taken up immediately on departure. So if its now 15 minutes it has definitely changed.

I use the jumper trick. Do that on cruise ships too.

 

[Bletchleyite]

I'm sure I have a 70's timetable that said reservations had to be taken up immediately on departure. So if its now 15 minutes it has definitely changed.

I use the jumper trick. Do that on cruise ships too.

15 minutes was for Deutsche Bahn, not the UK. Yes, I would usually leave my jumper on the seat, or possibly my bag having removed any valuables from it and taken them with me.

 

[Mcr Warrior]

I left my jumper on one once and somebody moved it! He was apologetic when I returned, though, said he thought it was lost property.

Eight out of ten for quick thinking, that!

 

[Kite159]

The worst are those who have a seat reserved but decided to sit elsewhere only to return to their originally reserved seat after getting booted out of the seat they were sat in and expect whoever is sitting there to move.

For example an airline seat marked as reserved from "Southampton to Birmingham" being empty on arrival into Basingstoke but the person who had reserved it returns after Oxford as they were using a table seat and got booted out.

 

[gg1]

Once had another passenger try to move me out of a seat which was showing as "available if unoccupied", waving a reservation ticket as "proof" of his entitlement. On closer inspection, it turned out that, although it was indeed for the right seat, the reservation was actually for the previous service, which he'd obviously missed.

I've had that happen to me a couple of times.

Far more bizarre, on a Virgin service a number of years ago my seat was double booked. Both me and another passenger had valid reservations for the same seat on the same service.

 

[Bletchleyite]

I've had that happen to me a couple of times.

I've had it happen loads of times, to the point that I'd usually ask for a glance at the ticket/reservation slip before moving.

Also common "way back when" was people thinking 19A meant Coach A Seat 19 etc (also F and B) when those were seat directions. Those are no longer printed, but when they were I had to send people to different coaches on most journeys.

Far more bizarre, on a Virgin service a number of years ago my seat was double booked. Both me and another passenger had valid reservations for the same seat on the same service.

The old CRS didn't handle transactions well, and so that was entirely possible if two people booked at the same time.

 

[HST274]

Recently I've travelled a few times on both XC and Avanti with 2 others. Despite booking all 3 seats at the same time and paid for by a single credit card, the seat reservations have been scattered randomly a la Ryanair! But on the train there have been dozens of unoccupied unreserved seats available after departure from the originating station (Manchester Piccadilly) so we all sat together round tables. But why didn't the system book us together, or us that for another thread? It makes it difficult for on train staff when the phone app is held by one passenger but it contains two other tickets of randomly scattered passengers!!

Also had this, I feel like it may be to do with the booking in window seats only (which was the case for me) then 19th of July happened and now all seats are available. I'm still on opposite ends of the carriage but hopefully it isn't too busy so I can move.

 

[andythebrave]

Also had this, I feel like it may be to do with the booking in window seats only (which was the case for me) then 19th of July happened and now all seats are available. I'm still on opposite ends of the carriage but hopefully it isn't too busy so I can move.

 

[Master29]

It's good on the 80x fleet operated by GWR and LNER as it will show the red/amber/green warning. So you'll know if its free if its red, and its vacant.

Unless of course the occupier is facing a call of nature.

 

[XAM2175]

A few years ago now, when I first moved to the UK, I naively booked a London-Glasgow advance with VT for around noon the Friday before the end-of-May bank holiday. The train was absolutely rammed and it wasn't until Preston that I was physically able to get to my reserved seat, so once again I'd like to thank the occupier of said seat for his good grace

 

[Wolfie]

I've had that happen to me a couple of times.

Far more bizarre, on a Virgin service a number of years ago my seat was double booked. Both me and another passenger had valid reservations for the same seat on the same service.

Re your last para l had that happen to me once, also on Virgin.

 

[Bald Rick]

Far more bizarre, on a Virgin service a number of years ago my seat was double booked. Both me and another passenger had valid reservations for the same seat on the same service.

Re your last para l had that happen to me once, also on Virgin.

Was it the same occasion ?

 

[Wolfie]

Was it the same occasion ?

Unless gg1 and l were to meet how could we possibly know? lol