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Skipping Lancaster
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Bletchleyite
Veteran Member
It was because of pathing issues because 90mph units were being used. However, now it has gone over to 195s I don't see why the stop can't be reinstated.
PHILIPE
Veteran Member
There is some reading on it here:-
https://www.railforums.co.uk/thread...ervice-stop-at-lancaster.193893/#post-4255853
https://www.railforums.co.uk/thread...ervice-stop-at-lancaster.193893/#post-4255853
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Esker-pades
Established Member
The first part of what @Bletchleyite said is correct. But, it is being re-instated from the May 2020 timetable change.
Bletchleyite
Veteran Member
Good stuff.
There's a good connection for Windermere at Lancaster off the 0453 ex-Barrow, if you were to be up that early. Other than that the best option is changing at Preston, which is another forty minutes travelling, but I can't see that changing twice would ever help. Ex-Leeds, yes, you would have to change twice.
The above applies to Mondays to Fridays, and I haven't checked the opposite direction.
When the WCML platforms at Carnforth were removed, BR's advice for travelling between Carnforth and Windermere was to go by bus!
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Glenn1969
Established Member
Presume from Leeds and Bradford you can take the Calder Valley train and change at Preston for Windermere/
yes, or via Manchester https://www.fastjp.com/#journeys?orig=LDS&dest=WDM&odate=20200408&otime=1100&maxres=9&maxch=5
It can be done, though it is quicker to change twice https://www.fastjp.com/#journeys?orig=BIF&dest=WDM&odate=20200408&otime=1400&maxres=9&maxch=5
Mitchell Hurd
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I'm baffled here - I caught the 13:45 from Lancaster to Manchester Oxford Road on the 30/09/19 and it was a 195. I'm guessing this was a 156 before then.
However I'm assuming this was one of a few paths available for the 195's?
However I'm assuming this was one of a few paths available for the 195's?
Yes, this was mentioned in the other thread:
I'd imagine they will have been able to slot calls at Lancaster into some paths but not others; it'll depend on what other services are running around that time; don't forget there are freight trains to fit in as well as passenger trains.
Bletchleyite
Veteran Member
Mostly 158s, I think they were 90mph paths. They are all 195s now so as noted upthread the issue will be resolved in May.
tbtc
Veteran Member
I think its a case of them pathing the service for the slowest stock that might be used - i.e. you can path it for a 75mph DMU (156) or a 90mph DMU (158), and if a 100mph DMU (195) is used then that's great (and it might have longer dwell times, or not be pushed that hard), but that's a lot better than pathing it for a 195 and then finding that the (much overhyped IMHO) "Random Unit Generator" has allocated something else - it's much better to path a train for the worst case scenario (and then run a "faster" unit gently) than path it in the hope that a 100mph unit will always be used, and then in the event of one not being available having to either cancel the service or hit trouble when your "slower" DMU has a 390 breathing down its neck (and then having to pay to compensate the delayed Avanti passengers).
That's why RTT often shows a path is timed for something that is slower than the units that regularly work it (which causes people to wonder why something is timed for e.g. a Pacer when it's normally run by a 158)
Generally speaking, a 195 will be able to run a path timed for a 158 but a 158 can't deputise for a 195 (there are quirks though, like 100mph 170s not being able to cope with 75mph paths because they aren't as good at accelerating!)
You're right, of course. Contrary to what I said in post #6, above, there's never any time benefit in changing at Preston. I'd overlooked the Oxenholme - Windermere shorts.
Jamesrob637
Established Member
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Isn't there a significant student flow between Manchester and Lancaster too?
Just had a quick look between 0600 and 2000 over 20 trains from Manchester stop at Lancaster.
A good number of students also travel from Leeds, in the same time span only 7 trains run.
Getting back to Windermere, in the same time span 4 trains run from Manchester with none stopping at Lancaster. Going south its a bit better with 4 trains going to Manchester and two stopping. This could be due to having platform 5 to run them into?
Bletchleyite
Veteran Member
One of them sits in P5 for about 20 minutes, if I recall.
Rolling stock with a top speed of 100miles/hour, which had worked these services for more than a decade,
was replaced with Sprinter stock that had a prevailing top speed of 75 miles/hour, and slower acceleration than a Desiro.
The consequences were fairly significant, and unsurprising.
Of course, the line was intended to have been worked by EMUs by now. Instead, more 100mph fast DMUs have been ordered.
In the current working timetable there appear to be 27 services one way and 30 the other, on weekdays, and a further 4 which do not call.
I am sure all will go back to calling, though.
At least according to NRE you can do Leeds to Windemere with one change at preston.
You can, but it will generally be quicker to change in Manchester.
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