TFW restaurant services

[metrail]

Ok I know its discussed often, but it also changes often and I am not a rail expert or enthusiast but I am enthusiastic about rail travel.. Maybe an enthusiast with an identity crisis.

1. What times does Gerald run or any TFW with restaurant meals? (I know its hit and miss but I can check on the day as I am doing a railrover first class for 14 days in March, if no strikes).
2. Do any restaurant services go to Man pic to Cardiff or is it just Holyhead to Cardiff and vice versa?

Addendum:
Looking at realtimetrains I see that the services:

Cardiff d 17:14
Holyhead a 21:40

Holyhead d 05:30
Cardiff a 10:08

had diesel locos yesterday
Why oh why do they have 150 on Man pic to carmarthen?

Thankyou kindly.

 

[SuperLuke2334]

Ok I know its discussed often, but it also changes often and I am not a rail expert or enthusiast but I am enthusiastic about rail travel.. Maybe an enthusiast with an identity crisis.

1. What times does Gerald run or any TFW with restaurant meals? (I know its hit and miss but I can check on the day as I am doing a railrover first class for 14 days in March, if no strikes).
2. Do any restaurant services go to Man pic to Cardiff or is it just Holyhead to Cardiff and vice versa?

Addendum:
Looking at realtimetrains I see that the services:

Cardiff d 17:14
Holyhead a 21:40

Holyhead d 05:30
Cardiff a 10:08

had diesel locos yesterday

Thankyou kindly.

The following services are also booked Mk4.

Cardiff to Manchester: 0435 0635 0849 1052 1249 1449 1649 1855

Manchester to Cardiff: 0627 0830 1030 1230 1430 1630 1830

 

[TT-ONR-NRN]

The following services are also booked Mk4.

Cardiff to Manchester: 0435 0635 0849 1052 1249 1449 1649 1855

Manchester to Cardiff: 0627 0830 1030 1230 1430 1630 1830

Mind you, I took the 04:35 as far as Shrewsbury last Friday and there was no chef available at all. Nor did one get on when I boarded. I can't say it's completely surprising at that time though.

 

[Spartacus]

Still drives me mad that the weekend offering is so poor by comparison, not even prepacked sandwiches on such a long service with the facilities to carry them. I've known far better trolleys.

 

[metrail]

Mind you, I took the 04:35 as far as Shrewsbury last Friday and there was no chef available at all. Nor did one get on when I boarded. I can't say it's completely surprising at that time though.

Wonder if anyone knows which one is the most reliable.. These services seem to switch from worse trains to the best trains

 

[Iskra]

I did it between Manchester and Shrewsbury on the 1430 Wednesday. It was nice Although an LNER evening Dine service out of Kings Cross may work out better value as on TFW you have to buy a first class ticket and then pay for the food separately too.

Iskra's Odysseys

Coast and Peaks 4 in 8 Rover, Day 1 As noted by @Techniquest in this thread last year, Wales has been a bit of a gap for me in terms of route coverage. I improved the situation last year by travelling the Cambrian Coast, and my aim this year was to deal with the remainder of North Wales...

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[A S Leib]

I did it between Manchester and Shrewsbury on the 1430 Wednesday. It was nice Although an LNER evening Dine service out of Kings Cross may work out better value as on TFW you have to buy a first class ticket and then pay for the food separately too.

If value's the main concern, I'd recommend at least a few Avanti journeys with a first class rover as well; first class with them seems a lot more expensive (or First advances harder to find) than LNER equivalents, at least since standard premium launched.

 

[Iskra]

If value's the main concern, I'd recommend at least a few Avanti journeys with a first class rover as well; first class with them seems a lot more expensive (or First advances harder to find) than LNER equivalents, at least since standard premium launched.

Avanti's catering isn't done by an on-board chef though, so not really in the same league as GWR, LNER Dine services or TfW.

 

[GWVillager]

Mind you, I took the 04:35 as far as Shrewsbury last Friday and there was no chef available at all. Nor did one get on when I boarded. I can't say it's completely surprising at that time though.

This is probably rarer than not, though. I find they quite reliably have a chef, particularly at reasonable times of day!

Ok I know its discussed often, but it also changes often and I am not a rail expert or enthusiast but I am enthusiastic about rail travel.. Maybe an enthusiast with an identity crisis.

1. What times does Gerald run or any TFW with restaurant meals? (I know its hit and miss but I can check on the day as I am doing a railrover first class for 14 days in March, if no strikes).
2. Do any restaurant services go to Man pic to Cardiff or is it just Holyhead to Cardiff and vice versa?

Addendum:
Looking at realtimetrains I see that the services:

Cardiff d 17:14
Holyhead a 21:40

Holyhead d 05:30
Cardiff a 10:08

had diesel locos yesterday
Why oh why do they have 150 on Man pic to carmarthen?

Thankyou kindly.

Those times you listed are indeed "The Gerald", and they are usually the most reliable workings to produce Mk4s. However, as @SuperLuke2334 provides, they are also booked to run every other (or almost every other!) service between Manchester and Cardiff, with the same catering offer as the Holyheads. Unfortunately, they have been plagued with reliability issues (though it is improving), and it's never entirely certain that your chosen train will be a loco hauled set.

With regards to Realtime Trains, not just the services with the little drawings are Mk4 operated. They can also appear as just an allocation in the train information section of detailed mode (see the attached image). Sets HD01-03 are still in Virgin colours and interiors, whereas HD04-07 are the refurbished ex-Grand Central rakes. I prefer the former, but I think I may well be alone in that regard! Either way, the service is excellent, and it certainly rivals the heavyweights of Avanti, LNER etc.

This thread is good to keep an eye on for information about sets and their likely operations: https://www.railforums.co.uk/threads/ex-lner-and-grand-central-mark-4-sets-for-tfw.182406/

As for the 150, it's a very long story which is rather different depending on who you ask, but it's not going to remain the case for long - the class 197s are coming in thick and fast.

 

[MP393]

Still drives me mad that the weekend offering is so poor by comparison, not even prepacked sandwiches on such a long service with the facilities to carry them. I've known far better trolleys.

There are some chefs on a Saturday, today 1V34 06:27 from Manchester, 1W52 10:52 from Cardiff & 1V46 14:30 Manchester - Cardiff have a chef onboard HD04. It’s less likely than during the week though and there are currently no chefs on Sunday I believe.

 

[Western 52]

There are some chefs on a Saturday, today 1V34 06:27 from Manchester, 1W52 10:52 from Cardiff & 1V46 14:30 Manchester - Cardiff have a chef onboard HD04. It’s less likely than during the week though and there are currently no chefs on Sunday I believe.

A few weeks ago when I used the 1032 Sunday Swansea to Manchester, although it was a Mk4 set, there was no catering at all as far as Newport, where I got off. Even a cup of coffee would have been nice!

 

[RHolmes]

Still drives me mad that the weekend offering is so poor by comparison, not even prepacked sandwiches on such a long service with the facilities to carry them. I've known far better trolleys.

At my TOC sandwiches can only be carried on units without refrigeration for a maximum of four hours, anything after that has to be discarded.

With most sandwiches having either mayonnaise, dairy or processed meat there’s no surprise why.

I’m assuming the TFW catering crews are not permitted to use the fridges on the few units that have them. I can’t say I’ve ever seen the 197 catering cupboard being opened.

 

[Western 52]

Do the catering cupboards on the 197s contain a fridge? The kitchens on the Mk4s surely do.

 

[metrail]

Thanks everyone. You have ALL been very helpful . Althugh limitations to the service, it is much better than I anticipated and so looking forward to using the services several times in March.

 

[Spartacus]

At my TOC sandwiches can only be carried on units without refrigeration for a maximum of four hours, anything after that has to be discarded.

With most sandwiches having either mayonnaise, dairy or processed meat there’s no surprise why.

I’m assuming the TFW catering crews are not permitted to use the fridges on the few units that have them. I can’t say I’ve ever seen the 197 catering cupboard being opened.

I can understand on stock which doesn't have fridges, but the Mk4s do have them. A good selection of pasties from such as The Little Welsh Deli in Llanelli would go down a treat, and wouldn't suffer as badly as sandwiches from either prolonged refrigeration or a prolonged lack of it. Tempted to make a suggestion to TfW actually

 

[driverd]

Tenuous link to the topic, but why is it called Gerald? I can understand WAG or WAG train, but I can't readily figure out Gerald.

 

[GWVillager]

Tenuous link to the topic, but why is it called Gerald? I can understand WAG or WAG train, but I can't readily figure out Gerald.

It’s named after the Middle Ages priest Gerald of Wales, who documented his travels around Wales and elsewhere, becoming quite a significant historical figure.

 

[driverd]

It’s named after the Middle Ages priest Gerald of Wales, who documented his travels around Wales and elsewhere, becoming quite a significant historical figure.

Ah, tenuous link to the topic, tenuous link to a train name!

Thanks for the info, though

 

[Iskra]

Tenuous link to the topic, but why is it called Gerald? I can understand WAG or WAG train, but I can't readily figure out Gerald.

Is it actually called Gerald anymore? TfW seem to refer to these dining trains as the Premier Service on their marketing material.

 

[lokiavivson]

This is probably rarer than not, though. I find they quite reliably have a chef, particularly at reasonable times of day!


Those times you listed are indeed "The Gerald", and they are usually the most reliable workings to produce Mk4s. However, as @SuperLuke2334 provides, they are also booked to run every other (or almost every other!) service between Manchester and Cardiff, with the same catering offer as the Holyheads. Unfortunately, they have been plagued with reliability issues (though it is improving), and it's never entirely certain that your chosen train will be a loco hauled set.

With regards to Realtime Trains, not just the services with the little drawings are Mk4 operated. They can also appear as just an allocation in the train information section of detailed mode (see the attached image). Sets HD01-03 are still in Virgin colours and interiors, whereas HD04-07 are the refurbished ex-Grand Central rakes. I prefer the former, but I think I may well be alone in that regard! Either way, the service is excellent, and it certainly rivals the heavyweights of Avanti, LNER etc.

This thread is good to keep an eye on for information about sets and their likely operations: https://www.railforums.co.uk/threads/ex-lner-and-grand-central-mark-4-sets-for-tfw.182406/

As for the 150, it's a very long story which is rather different depending on who you ask, but it's not going to remain the case for long - the class 197s are coming in thick and fast.

here is a full list of TfW services that use Intercity 225 sets and whether they have first class dining or not. on services with no dining, there are hot and cold drinks and light refreshments available in the buffet car. if its downgraded to a 197 or 15x (which happens almost very frequently) then it'll either have a trolley service or no catering at all:
southbound:
1V31 0454 CRE to CDF - no dining
1V33 0627 MAN to CDF - breakfast
1V91 0530 HHD to CDF - no dining HHD to SHR, breakfast available SHR to CDF only
1V37 0830 MAN to CDF - breakfast
1V42 1230 MAN to CDF - lunch/dinner
1V46 1430 MAN to CDF - lunch/dinner
1V50 1630 MAN to SWA - lunch/dinner MAN to NWP, no dining NWP to SWA
northbound:
1W11 0435 CDF to MAN - no dining
1W55 0849 CDF to MAN - breakfast
1W57 1052 CDF to MAN - lunch/dinner
1W19 1249 CDF to MAN - lunch/dinner
1W23 1649 CDF to MAN - lunch/dinner
1W96 1714 CDF to HHD - lunch/dinner
1W65 1855 CDF to MAN - lunch/dinner

 

[metrail]

here is a full list of TfW services that use Intercity 225 sets and whether they have first class dining or not. on services with no dining, there are hot and cold drinks and light refreshments available in the buffet car. if its downgraded to a 197 or 15x (which happens almost very frequently) then it'll either have a trolley service or no catering at all:
southbound:
1V31 0454 CRE to CDF - no dining
1V33 0627 MAN to CDF - breakfast
1V91 0530 HHD to CDF - no dining HHD to SHR, breakfast available SHR to CDF only
1V37 0830 MAN to CDF - breakfast
1V42 1230 MAN to CDF - lunch/dinner
1V46 1430 MAN to CDF - lunch/dinner
1V50 1630 MAN to SWA - lunch/dinner MAN to NWP, no dining NWP to SWA
northbound:
1W11 0435 CDF to MAN - no dining
1W55 0849 CDF to MAN - breakfast
1W57 1052 CDF to MAN - lunch/dinner
1W19 1249 CDF to MAN - lunch/dinner
1W23 1649 CDF to MAN - lunch/dinner
1W96 1714 CDF to HHD - lunch/dinner
1W65 1855 CDF to MAN - lunch/dinner

Great info. Starting a first class railrover 14 day tomorrow. Currently at Fort William waiting for the sleeper

 

[MP393]

on services with no dining, there are hot and cold drinks and light refreshments available in the buffet car.

southbound:
1V31 0454 CRE to CDF - no dining

A minor point, 1V31 does not have the buffet open, the hosts that work Mk4s are based at Manchester & Newport so neither are there in place to work on 1V31.

 

[MP393]

A minor point, 1V31 does not have the buffet open, the hosts that work Mk4s are based at Manchester & Newport so neither are there in place to work on 1V31

 

[Krokodil]

A minor point, 1V31 does not have the buffet open, the hosts that work Mk4s are based at Manchester & Newport so neither are there in place to work on 1V31.

Plus hosts based at Holyhead for 1V91/1W96

 

[metrail]

I am on the 0849 loco pushed. Not sure if any food service yet but going to man pic and back. Are there any on the Holyhead run still as could not see any on timetable today.... Lovely seats anyway, so will enjoy even if hungry

Update - Yes Welsh breakfast for me. The coffee is best I have had on the railways in two weeks doing this rover.. Hapy me

 

[metrail]

I found the journey back not so good as only offered one drink and was very thirsty. Yes, I know I should ask but I felt awkward .. Anyway on for the last time today on the 0635 and just ordered avocado and poached egg as still digesting yesterdays big breakfast. LOL
My hotel was next to station and noticed the only Holyhead ones being early and late. Means if in Cardiff its hard to get back..

Rover ends today so going straight home. Are there any special fares for this route?

 

[[email protected].]

Are 1st class tickets for these services pre-bookable or do you have to upgrade a on the day on board.
I've just look at TFW website but can't get it to offer me 1st class tickets.
I'm trying to plan Shrewsbury to Manchester 10:53 any Wed, Thurs or Friday in June.

 

[30907]

Are 1st class tickets for these services pre-bookable or do you have to upgrade a on the day on board.
I've just look at TFW website but can't get it to offer me 1st class tickets.
I'm trying to plan Shrewsbury to Manchester 10:53 any Wed, Thurs or Friday in June.

Only Anytime fares available on NRE planner for June. Advances not loaded yet seemingly.

 

[Krokodil]

I think that TfW is releasing Advances six weeks ahead so try a little later.

 

[GWVillager]

Are 1st class tickets for these services pre-bookable or do you have to upgrade a on the day on board.
I've just look at TFW website but can't get it to offer me 1st class tickets.
I'm trying to plan Shrewsbury to Manchester 10:53 any Wed, Thurs or Friday in June.

As others have said, the tickets may not have appeared yet, but the short answer is that yes, you can pre-book first.