Tickets from Appleby via Carlisle

[neilmc]

I have been looking at the options for travelling from either Penrith or Appleby to stations in the Midlands and have found to my surprise that the National Rail guide suggests journeys via Carlisle, using the bus connection from Appleby to Carlisle whilst the northern part of the S&C is closed.

As these options from Appleby all involve Anytime tickets, which are substantially cheaper than Anytime tickets, or even Off-Peak tickets, from Penrith, have I discovered a huge loophole here i.e. to purchase tickets from Appleby to travel short from Penrith/Carlisle down the WCML. And, if so, is this a temporary easement whilst the S&C is not fully open?

 

[yorkie]

And, if so, is this a temporary easement whilst the S&C is not fully open?

You are asking if a ticket from Appleby to somewhere like Leicester, Nuneaton or Birmingham is valid via Carlisle (under normal circumstances)?

A quick look at the routeing point calculator, shows that Carlisle is not an appropriate routeing point for these fares, so it would not normally be permitted to commence a journey from Penrith/Carlisle on an Appleby ticket.

 

[Paul Kelly]

Temporary. Non-rail links at the start/end of a journey aren't counted (at least by booking engines) for routeing check purposes, so the origin station that matters for a routeing check is Carlisle.

 

[kieron]

You are asking if a ticket from Appleby to somewhere like Leicester, Nuneaton or Birmingham is valid via Carlisle (under normal circumstances)?

A quick look at the routeing point calculator, shows that Carlisle is not an appropriate routeing point for these fares, so it would not normally be permitted to commence a journey from Penrith/Carlisle on an Appleby ticket.

When I tried Appleby-Nuneaton, the section for Carlisle included a copy of easement 300234, which lists some situations in which tickets from Appleby or Kirkby Stephen are valid via Carlisle.

I admit that I have had trouble finding journeys for which an unrestricted Appleby-X return costs less than Carlisle-X.

 

[yorkie]

When I tried Appleby-Nuneaton, the section for Carlisle included a copy of easement 300234, which lists some situations in which tickets from Appleby or Kirkby Stephen are valid via Carlisle..

Note my carefully worded reply

(Pricing managers must love these sort of threads!)

 

[neilmc]

The destination station I had in mind was Chesterfield which brings up:

Anytime return from Appleby - £47.00
Off-peak return from Carlisle - £78.90
Off-peak return from Penrith - £61.40

I think you can see the way my devious mind is working, to travel "short" from Penrith (or Carlisle) on an Appleby Anytime ticket without ever going to Appleby.

Only doubt for me is that on the NRE journey planner only a few itineraries appear to show travel from Appleby via Carlisle (e.g. the 07:42 from Appleby) and fewer still for the return journey (e.g. 14:20 from Chesterfield - far too early) which precludes using an Appleby Anytime for the day trip from Penrith I had in mind, as I fear I'd get grief from a Virgin conductor without being able to show a printed itinerary from NRE for the exact suggested trains to be used on the whole journey.

 

[kieron]

The destination station I had in mind was Chesterfield which brings up:

That may not be due to that easement then (not to say that there couldn't be other easements involved).

Only doubt for me is that on the NRE journey planner only a few itineraries appear to show travel from Appleby via Carlisle

What I'd usually do in situations like that is to look through an itinerary it says is valid on a single ticket and one it says isn't, and try to tweak the via/avoid/change at/operator settings to make the invalid itinerary follow a route which is closer to the route the valid one takes.

I don't think it's the case here, but if you find that the only difference is that one involves a rail replacement 'bus and the other doesn't, there may not be anything you can do.