Victorian continental excursion ticket to France

[Nutmeg]

Hello,
I hope somebody here can help me create a prop for a TV drama set in 1890 London.
A character has bought another 'A ticket to the continent'! What could this be?
Presuming a train, then a ferry to France. But what would the ticket look like?
Perhaps the reality is that somebody would take a train to the coast, then purchase a ferry ticket to France. But I need to provide something for use in the scene to tell the story.

I've found an excursion ticket on ebay which is slightly later: https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/20283092...entrq:e5f9aecc1800a4999f84b6e1fffe2354|iid:14

A recreation of this perhaps?
Any help would be gratefully received.

Thanks,
Mary

 

[WesternLancer]

Hello,
I hope somebody here can help me create a prop for a TV drama set in 1890 London.
A character has bought another 'A ticket to the continent'! What could this be?
Presuming a train, then a ferry to France. But what would the ticket look like?
Perhaps the reality is that somebody would take a train to the coast, then purchase a ferry ticket to France. But I need to provide something for use in the scene to tell the story.

I've found an excursion ticket on ebay which is slightly later: https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/202830923179?_trkparms=amclksrc=ITM&aid=111001&algo=REC.SEED&ao=1&asc=20160908105057&meid=15bc09ff525d4ac7bce5321e9296c010&pid=100675&rk=1&rkt=15&sd=202830923179&itm=202830923179&pmt=0&noa=1&pg=2380057&_trksid=p2380057.c100675.m4236&_trkparms=pageci:7cc816de-d8e9-11ec-86f3-befc64a27237|parentrq:e5f9aecc1800a4999f84b6e1fffe2354|iid:14

A recreation of this perhaps?
Any help would be gratefully received.

Thanks,
Mary

ref that ebay link Mary - that's going to be from after 1923 (Southern Railway was created then in what is known as 'The Grouping of the railways') - and it also looks like it is issued by Thomas Cook, who would have issued tickets for rail travel certainly, and I think for a group excursion (so assume a group of people) so I think probably not quite what you are looking for.

1890 - you would need something from the following railways:

SER or LCDR (for Kent ports from Victoria or Charing Cross or Blackfriars for example)
or
LBSCR (for Newhaven to Dieppe - from Victoria or maybe London Bridge)

I think there are dedicated old ticket collectors - wonder if any on here - maybe amending the title of your thread might catch their eye - eg 'victorian continental excursion ticket to France'

I think it would be plausible that it could be one ticket* from the British point of origin to France - as the railway companies owned the ferry boats / cross channel steamers IIRC so it was 'integrated transport' (as was the case until BR's sealink was privatised in the early 1980s) - tho there may also have been shipping companies that took passengers that were not railway owned.

* edit: just seen @Gloster post - good point - could have been bought as 'one ticket' but with several bits of paper or card for each leg maybe - that does sound plausible, contrary to my point.

 

[Gloster]

From various bits of reading, mostly covering a slightly later period, I would reckon that the tickets would probably be separate ones for each leg: one to the channel port, one for the ferry, etc. These would probably have been bits of paper (say 4” by 3” ) with a certain amount printed on them, but with a lot of details (date, places, route, etc. ) filled in by hand. Whether the were put in a wallet or in an envelope, or clipped together I know not.

I know that in the thirties they had small books which included a ticket for each railway administration, which was given up once the passenger passed on to the lines of the next company. The ticket should then find its way back to London.

Note: I am a non-expert and most of my knowledge comes from the works of Freeman Wills Crofts, but it is an area that he should have been well-informed about.

There is the Transport Ticket Society, which has a website.

 

[Rescars]

ref that link - that's going to be after 1923 (Southern railway created then) - and it also looks like it is issued by Thomas Cook and I think for a group excursion (so assume a group of people) so I think probably not what you are looking for.
As
1890 - you would need something from the following railways:

SER or LCDR (for Kent ports from Victoria or Charing Cross for example)
LBSCR (for Newhaven - from Victoria or maybe London Bridge)

I think there are dedicated old ticket collectors - wonder if any on here - maybe amending the title of your thread might catch their eye - eg 'victorian continental excursion ticket to France'

I think it would be plausible that it could be one ticket* from the British point of origin to France - as the railway companies owned the ferry boats / cross channel steamers IIRC so it was 'integrated transport' (as was the case until BR's sealink was privatised in the early 1980s) - tho there may also have been shipping companies that took passengers that were not railway owned.

* edit: just seen @Gloster post - good point - could have been bought as 'one ticket' but with several bits for each leg maybe - that does sound plausible contrary to my point.

If you are looking for some possible destinations via LCDR, check out the carved and gilded locations now preserved at Blackfriars.

 

[WesternLancer]

This 1862 timetable cover, at the top of this link, for the SER advertises monthly rtn tickets and through tickets to the contient.

Inside is a wealth of info on fares / travel details etc via Folkestone or Dover that the OP may find of use for context info.

Documents & Maps

Documents & Maps

www.southeasternandchathamrailway.org.uk

Not sure how much would have changed by 1890 but no doubt some developments such as perhaps faster service if shipping technology had moved on.

Meanwhile this specialist auctioneer

Home | Paddington Ticket Auctions - The Specialist Ticket Auctions

Ticket Auctions - Specialist ticket auctions selling all transport related tickets

www.paddingtonticketauctions.co.uk

Has large numbers of images of previously sold tickets (see the catalogues) - you need 'pre grouping' as that means pre 1923. I'm just not sure how you can easily search the vast numbers of tickets they have scanned for their catalogs to find a cross channel ticket! But there is a phone number on the site and e-mail link- it maybe that if you contacted them they might know what one looked like since a good chance that over time they have sold examples.

PADDINGTON TICKET AUCTIONS,
Great Central Railwayana Limited,
14 School Street, Woodford Halse, Daventry, NN11 3RL, UK
Normal Office Hours: 10.00 a.m. to 5.00 p.m., Monday to Friday.
Telephone in UK: 01327 262193.
Telephone from outside UK: +44 1327 262193.
Website: Great Central Railwayana Auctions
Email

See the catalogues - but it would involve a lot of scrolling through pages I think

Catalogues | Paddington Ticket Auctions - The Specialist Ticket Auctions

Ticket Auctions - Specialist ticket auctions selling all transport related tickets

www.paddingtonticketauctions.co.uk

 

[Andy873]

I was surprised when I bought a copy of a postcard print of Great Harwood station (East Lancashire circa 1900) to see two posters.

One is for trips to the Isle of Man, and the other advertising sailings from Hull to Zeebrugge. Not sure about the Isle of Man but I would have thought a trip to Zeebrugge would have been beyond the means of most people living in East Lancs.

Here is a link to the postcard.

rp00458 - Great Harwood Railway Station , Lancashire - print 6x4 | eBay

Woody-iow note is not on the print. Condition is Very Good.

www.ebay.co.uk

You can see the two posters under the words "Great Harwood" in the foreground.

 

[30907]

Hello,
I hope somebody here can help me create a prop for a TV drama set in 1890 London.
A character has bought another 'A ticket to the continent'! What could this be?
Presuming a train, then a ferry to France. But what would the ticket look like?
Perhaps the reality is that somebody would take a train to the coast, then purchase a ferry ticket to France. But I need to provide something for use in the scene to tell the story.

I've found an excursion ticket on ebay which is slightly later: https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/202830923179?_trkparms=amclksrc=ITM&aid=111001&algo=REC.SEED&ao=1&asc=20160908105057&meid=15bc09ff525d4ac7bce5321e9296c010&pid=100675&rk=1&rkt=15&sd=202830923179&itm=202830923179&pmt=0&noa=1&pg=2380057&_trksid=p2380057.c100675.m4236&_trkparms=pageci:7cc816de-d8e9-11ec-86f3-befc64a27237|parentrq:e5f9aecc1800a4999f84b6e1fffe2354|iid:14

A recreation of this perhaps?
Any help would be gratefully received.

Thanks,
Mary

While the particular ticket isn't quite right, the "cover plus coupon" style as mentioned by Gloster might well be - I don't know how far back in time it goes - and a cover with the correct railway name and a plausible text might look the part (of those who would notice at all, I reckon very few indeed would know what a Victorian international ticket might look like!).

 

[Gloster]

A lot on depends on what needs to be visible to the viewer: the character’s name, the destination, the date, the fact that it is a ticket, etc. As 30907 says, few people are going to notice any inaccuracies that there may be unless you make a serious and obvious historical error. (I read a book set in the 1890s where someone travelled with ‘British Rail’ and, if I remember correctly, a well-respected author of historical novels had a Victorian-era character make a journey over a railway that had not yet been built.)

 

[WesternLancer]

While the particular ticket isn't quite right, the "cover plus coupon" style as mentioned by Gloster might well be - I don't know how far back in time it goes - and a cover with the correct railway name and a plausible text might look the part (of those who would notice at all, I reckon very few indeed would know what a Victorian international ticket might look like!).

Points very well made. Yes decorate the coupon cover in the style of that South Eastern Railway link I found and it might well be plausible and convincing - get the name of the railway and the ports its ships served on both side of the channel correct and you are probably well on the way.

 

[Nutmeg]

Thank you all for your help. I really appreciate it.