Window Hanging

[Huntergreed]

I was waiting for the next service to London Liverpool Street at platform 9 and was pleasantly astonished when we were permitted to board the Class 90 + MK3 set (which was advertised on the boards!!). This was the first time I had travelled on a train with opening windows, so I would have been able to have practically a "drivers eye view" from Stratford into Liverpool Street (I didn't personally partake in this, but there were a few passengers who seemed to grasp this opportunity). My question is - is this actually permitted onboard trains or is it strictly not allowed (They were not stopped by anyone) and do staff actively try to prevent people from doing this?

PS - Have AGA got rid of the set down/pick up only rule at Stratford for Class 90/MK3 express trains?

 

[Bletchleyite]

No, it's not allowed (and can be quite dangerous), and there is clear signage saying so. You'll get a tap on the shoulder if a member of staff sees you doing it, though obviously they won't necessarily see it.

 

[Geezertronic]

Plus you risk losing your head...

 

[CosherB]

This fool also thought he could get away with it. RIP.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2016/08/07/man-killed-after-leaning-out-of-a-carriage-window-on-the-gatwick/

A man has died after he reportedly leaned out of a train window and was hit by another engine. The Gatwick Express passenger in his 20s was pronounced dead at the scene at Wandsworth Common station, south London, on Sunday.

 

[Mag_seven]

PS - Have AGA got rid of the set down/pick up only rule at Stratford for Class 90/MK3 express trains?

Not in the timetable but in the up direction the services are actually advertised on the departure board as Liverpool St services rather than as "set down only". I can only assume this is to avoid arguments with people boarding and blocking the busy up main line.

 

[Temple Meads]

You'll get a tap on the shoulder if a member of staff sees you doing it

Not always true, perhaps surprisingly!

There have been a couple of major incidents in the past year involving droplight windows, one of them fatal, so I really can't condone it or defend it, although I still do it very occasionally at slow speeds.

 

[GW43125]

Officially- verboten
Unofficially- many staff members will give you a bollocking, though there are a select few who join in with you...

 

[Bletchleyite]

I remember door hanging in Thailand and getting a tap on the shoulder by a member of staff...who wanted to flog me a can of Coke.

 

[BR60062]

Not recommended on the mainline unless you know what you are doing. On the HST's in the past. A couple of times I have rested my camera on the sill of the window in the open position. But I have never been stupid enough to stick my head out and risk losing my life.

It reminds me of the days when all the 4CIG and the 4VEP units had the openings barred up to prevent this kind of thing from happening. A good move in my opinion because how many idiots I have seen lean out too far and nearly fall out is alarming! :roll:.

I suppose it could be okay to flail on preserved railways where the max speed is a nominal 25mph as long as there is no danger of getting your arm or head ripped off. But on the mainline, its just suicidal .

 

[ainsworth74]

Unofficially- many staff members will give you a bollocking, though there are a select few who join in with you...

Can't recall the last time I came across any staff member that took issue with it! Occasionally been asked to move so a guard could access a panel mind you

 

[bramling]

I was waiting for the next service to London Liverpool Street at platform 9 and was pleasantly astonished when we were permitted to board the Class 90 + MK3 set (which was advertised on the boards!!). This was the first time I had travelled on a train with opening windows, so I would have been able to have practically a "drivers eye view" from Stratford into Liverpool Street (I didn't personally partake in this, but there were a few passengers who seemed to grasp this opportunity). My question is - is this actually permitted onboard trains or is it strictly not allowed (They were not stopped by anyone) and do staff actively try to prevent people from doing this?

PS - Have AGA got rid of the set down/pick up only rule at Stratford for Class 90/MK3 express trains?

There certainly should be a sign saying something to the effect of "Danger - do not lean out of the window", as could be found on the likes of the old SR slam-door trains.

The issue has come to fore in recent months due to the Balham fatality, therefore there is less chance at the moment of staff turning a blind eye. The difficulty for staff is that if they are seen to turn a blind eye, should an incident happen then someone may well ask them why the didn't attempt to do something about it.

Like many activities in life, it's hazardous, however the risk can be minimised if one is careful. In order words don't lean out too far, and *never* look anywhere other than forwards.

 

[Kryten2340]

This should serve as a warning to us all:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vcoWdrerLdU

 

[xotGD]

I saw 67022 depart Oxford Road this evening on the Llandudno. Most disappointing to see no one flailing from the front window.

 

[Tim R-T-C]

This should serve as a warning to us all:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vcoWdrerLdU

OT, but that "train" set is hilarious. World's tallest coach window and no windows apparently in the entire rest of the car. Seems like it was designed by someone who was aware of what a train was, but had never actually seen or travelled on one...

 

[Bertie the bus]

I saw 67022 depart Oxford Road this evening on the Llandudno. Most disappointing to see no one flailing from the front window.

If you want to see apes mindlessly flinging their arms about go to Chester Zoo. Meanwhile most of us would rather not see this on the railway, and not for safety reasons either.

 

[ainsworth74]

Meanwhile most of us would rather not see this on the railway, and not for safety reasons either.

Yes indeed. Flailing behind a 67, very gauche!

 

[BR60062]

There certainly should be a sign saying something to the effect of "Danger - do not lean out of the window", as could be found on the likes of the old SR slam-door trains.

The issue has come to fore in recent months due to the Balham fatality, therefore there is less chance at the moment of staff turning a blind eye. The difficulty for staff is that if they are seen to turn a blind eye, should an incident happen then someone may well ask them why the didn't attempt to do something about it.

Like many activities in life, it's hazardous, however the risk can be minimised if one is careful. In order words don't lean out too far, and *never* look anywhere other than forwards.

I thought that all carriages had these warning signs as a safety requirement that look like this one I took last year on a HST .

HST Warning Sign. by BritishRail60062, on Flickr

Its risky to lean out when the train is moving but I limit myself to 6 inches maximum and pull back in when a signal or a wall comes up. Always better to be safe than sorry I think .

 

[306024]

Its risky to lean out when the train is moving but I limit myself to 6 inches maximum and pull back in when a signal or a wall comes up. Always better to be safe than sorry I think .

And that is your definition of 'safe'? :roll:

There have been signs on trains that say 'do not lean out of the window' for as many years as I can remember. I wonder what they mean?

 

[bramling]

And that is your definition of 'safe'? :roll:

There have been signs on trains that say 'do not lean out of the window' for as many years as I can remember. I wonder what they mean?

Yes and people have disregarded them for years too. To be fair I can't think of that many incidents over the years, although there have certainly been some.

 

[BR60062]

And that is your definition of 'safe'? :roll:

There have been signs on trains that say 'do not lean out of the window' for as many years as I can remember. I wonder what they mean?

Well I am still here and in one piece, but I use my brain and common sense . Not my fault if some people ignore the warning signs and they lean right out and come off the worse is it? :roll:.

I enjoy my hobby of flailing and I always look in the direction of travel and I am always prepared to move back as needed. Besides that. I only window hang on preserved railways these days as its not as fast as mainline, so I have a bit longer to react .

 

[PudseyBearHST]

I travel on the HST frequently and I often do stand by the door with window down and put my arm against it (but never stick my head out unless at the station to open the door). Many TMs walk past me and don't seem to be bothered about it.

 

[PudseyBearHST]

I thought that all carriages had these warning signs as a safety requirement that look like this one I took last year on a HST .

HST Warning Sign. by BritishRail60062, on Flickr

Its risky to lean out when the train is moving but I limit myself to 6 inches maximum and pull back in when a signal or a wall comes up. Always better to be safe than sorry I think .

Yup same ones on GWR. On GWR HSTs, there is also a sign on the other side of the door saying something along the line of "Keep the windows closed as it is beneficial for the environment"

 

[PudseyBearHST]

Besides that. I only window hang on preserved railways these days as its not as fast as mainline, so I have a bit longer to react .

Interesting point. I never put my head out but even when I stand/lean against the door with the window open, I'll try to always stand on the side with the relief running along side it (so that would be the left hand-side in direction of travel from Reading to Paddington which is my usual routine). I have seen some people try doing the same thing on the side next to the mainline and it always makes them jump lol when a train goes past. A few months ago, I saw someone's hat blow off but when a train went past but luckily it remained on the right side of the door .

 

[Johnnie2Sheds]

<rant>
I did it when I was young. Not like some of em today, out as far as their knees, just enough to see forward, and feel the heat coming off the loco. I didn't do it all the time, mainly standing starts from stations until 30 or 40 mph was passed. I'm not an idiot, I have common sense, its got me this far in a time before the entire planet was covered in safety notices. Start taking responsibity for your own actions. If you get out of a train with no platform, its not the railways fault, its yours. You are a cabbage, wake the Chuff up and look what you are doing, instead of putting a compo face on and holding your damn hands out.
</rant>

 

[CosherB]

Well I am still here and in one piece, but I use my brain and common sense . Not my fault if some people ignore the warning signs and they lean right out and come off the worse is it? :roll:.

I enjoy my hobby of flailing and I always look in the direction of travel and I am always prepared to move back as needed. Besides that. I only window hang on preserved railways these days as its not as fast as mainline, so I have a bit longer to react .

Like you? Hypocrite. :roll:

 

[ash39]

I saw 67022 depart Oxford Road this evening on the Llandudno. Most disappointing to see no one flailing from the front window.

Funnily enough I was in the front vestibule on this service!

Head fully inside the window though

 

[satisnek]

Leaning out of windows, yes, definitely not a recommended practice, never has been, but in recent years it has turned into a ready-made subject for self-righteous virtue signallers to bang their drums. The truth is that, considering everybody (enthusiast or otherwise) who has ever leaned out of a carriage window in the entire history of railways, the fatality rate is almost infinitessimally low. The risk involved is directly proportional to one's own stupidity.

Last time I did it was as recently as last year on a late evening service from Sheffield to Derby which happened to be an HST. For the final leg of the journey I couldn't resist going into the vestibule and standing by an open droplight as we rolled down through Ambergate, Belper and Duffield. But I didn't actually lean out until the train had slowed considerably on the approach to Derby. Magic

 

[GusB]

Yes, there is a certain amount of "personal responsibility" involved here, and if you are daft enough to lean out too far and get hit by a bit of trackside kit it is largely your own fault. The problem is that someone else has to clean up the mess.

Investigations have to take place, and even on preserved railways where speeds are low, the situation could arise where bars are required on all windows to prevent other idiots doing the same thing in future. How much is this going to cost in the long run?

Am I completely alone in being baffled by this "window flailing" concept?

 

[cambsy]

I have window flailed or stuck head out of window loads of times, even at 125mph, though wearing goggles or very briefly if not, not had as much as a scratch, use common sense and caution, always put head slowly out, and not on side of vegetation or line side equipment, know it risky and careful doing it.

 

[BR60062]

Like you? Hypocrite. :roll:

Not even worth a reply.

Interesting point. I never put my head out but even when I stand/lean against the door with the window open, I'll try to always stand on the side with the relief running along side it (so that would be the left hand-side in direction of travel from Reading to Paddington which is my usual routine). I have seen some people try doing the same thing on the side next to the mainline and it always makes them jump lol when a train goes past. A few months ago, I saw someone's hat blow off but when a train went past but luckily it remained on the right side of the door .

I always put my cap in my bag before I open the window to have a look at the train as it goes around the curve. Although I have lost a couple of hats in the past from an open top bus but I never wear a hat when window hanging on a train as a flying hat could be a hazard to other trains .

Yes, there is a certain amount of "personal responsibility" involved here, and if you are daft enough to lean out too far and get hit by a bit of trackside kit it is largely your own fault. The problem is that someone else has to clean up the mess.

Investigations have to take place, and even on preserved railways where speeds are low, the situation could arise where bars are required on all windows to prevent other idiots doing the same thing in future. How much is this going to cost in the long run?

Am I completely alone in being baffled by this "window flailing" concept?

To be honest. I think the last time I flailed on a train on the mainline was back in 2007/8 when Class 37's was still being used in Wales.

As for the preserved lines. I only window hang behind worthy locomotives like a Class 37, Class 40, Class 56 and a Class 60 as these are my favourite locomotives and its nice to film the ride out of the window and hear the raw sounds externally .

In regards to how far people lean out and I have seen those that lean a bit too far out from what I would call the 3 inch "safe" boundary and some do not even face the direction of travel when the train is moving . Having volunteered at some preserved heritage railways in the past before a bereavement a few years ago. I have insight into the railway industry and some of my family have worked on the railway over the years.

In regards to putting bars on the door windows. I think a better option would be perhaps to install internal door handles and limit the movement of the windows on the opening doors to 50/50. That way, the integrity of the rolling stock will still be intact and perhaps made safer without looking like a prison train .