Great Northern Fleet - 379s

[JonathanH]

Southerns own map of services shows Southampton/Brighton being 387s

Southern already have access to 387s though. It wouldn't be difficult to switch the red ones in use on the east side of Brighton to use them on the west side, and supplement that with the three green ones.

 

[TrainBoy98]

Southern already have access to 387s though. It wouldn't be difficult to switch the red ones in use on the east side of Brighton to use them on the west side, and supplement that with the three green ones.

Yes that's true. I'm sure it'll confuse some pax with different colour schemes though!

 

[D365]

Yes that's true. I'm sure it'll confuse some pax with different colour schemes though!

Not for the first time.

 

[MCR247]

and a very odd question here. With GN's 387s having speed of 110 and 379 only having 100. How is this going to cope with timetable? Unless its the timetable allowing the 379 to make time. Any plans of upgrading the speed of 379s to match upcoming timetable changes?
And is it still unconfirm how many 387/1s is going to southern?

Class 387s don’t go above 100mph on Great Northern

EDIT: wasn’t reading the latest page(s)!

 

[LudwigTails]

Class 387s don’t go above 100mph on Great Northern

EDIT: wasn’t reading the latest page(s)!

oh i see, thats really odd that they didnt make use of their full 110 mph capabilities.

 

[JonathanH]

oh i see, thats really odd that they didnt make use of their full 110 mph capabilities.

It isn't. If you read previous postings, the time saving which could be made by running at 110mph where possible is less than a minute.
https://www.railforums.co.uk/threads/class-387.92831/page-108#post-2593864

 

[Trainbike46]

It isn't. If you read previous postings, the time saving which could be made by running at 110mph where possible is less than a minute.
https://www.railforums.co.uk/threads/class-387.92831/page-108#post-2593864

If you have trains that can run 110mph and track which allows it too, why wouldn't you, even if timesavings are minimal?

in addition, there is the impact on paths to consider, especially for trains that run on the fasts

 

[MCR247]

If you have trains that can run 110mph and track which allows it too, why wouldn't you, even if timesavings are minimal?

in addition, there is the impact on paths to consider, especially for trains that run on the fasts

You might have the train and the track, but can the wires take it?

 

[gabrielhj07]

You might have the train and the track, but can the wires take it?

The same wires that take trains at 125?

 

[MCR247]

The same wires that take trains at 125?

Yes but can the wires take 387s at 110mph? Different trains have different pantographs

 

[bramling]

Yes but can the wires take 387s at 110mph? Different trains have different pantographs

ISTR the issue isn’t with the GN, but to do with the Kings Lynn side. There were some posts on here at the time explaining things if anyone has time to dig them out.

 

[swt_passenger]

Yes but can the wires take 387s at 110mph? Different trains have different pantographs

Also, EMUs running in multiple have 2 or 3 pantographs in use at once. That‘s the significant problem compared to a 125 mph 800 etc. As seen with the 110 mph 350 project initially on the WCML.

 

[Edvid]

The same wires that take trains at 125?

Assuming modern high-speed Brecknell Willis pantographs are used - a third pan at 110mph, 160/80 metres behind the first/second induces greater contact wire oscillation than a second pan at 125mph, 200 metres behind the first. ECML OLE (Mk3b) can handle the latter as is, but a re-tensioning of wire runs from 11/11kN to 15/12kN (contact/catenary) would be required to handle the former.

All that aside, I'm just glad the 379s will be returning to passenger service in due course.

 

[Baji]

What is interesting is why southern’s 5 car units are classed as 377/6 and 377/7. Surely shouldn’t they be classed as 387/6 or 387/7 because they are literally the same as Gatwick express units except 4 cars and gatwick express colours.

 

[physics34]

What is interesting is why southern’s 5 car units are classed as 377/6 and 377/7. Surely shouldn’t they be classed as 387/6 or 387/7 because they are literally the same as Gatwick express units except 4 cars and gatwick express colours.

In theory all members of a class should be compatable with each other. 377/6s and /7s although are mechanically compatible with 387s, some onboard systems arent. Therefore they are not 387s.

 

[jon0844]

For operational convenience, can the 379s be made software compatible with 387s so that it won't cause issues as and when the fleet will split and join for 4/8/12 car workings? Isn't one Linux based and the other Windows?

 

[LA50041]

If you have trains that can run 110mph and track which allows it too, why wouldn't you, even if timesavings are minimal?

in addition, there is the impact on paths to consider, especially for trains that run on the fasts

The 377/5 and 377/6 can work with all other 377’s on southern but 377 cannot work in passenger service with 387/2 due to PIS issues so much better to class units that can work together

 

[aleggatta]

For operational convenience, can the 379s be made software compatible with 387s so that it won't cause issues as and when the fleet will split and join for 4/8/12 car workings? Isn't one Linux based and the other Windows?

IMO the Linux/windows thing is more a training thing for drivers, than a class compatibilty limitation. The way all the systems communicate on a train are the same, only the computer plugged onto the end to interface with the train is different.

 

[43096]

In theory all members of a class should be compatable with each other.

There's examples where that's not the case. Class 31, for one, says "hello".

 

[TT-ONR-NRN]

There's examples where that's not the case. Class 31, for one, says "hello".

Class 165 too, I believe? I don't think /0 and /1 can couple since the former had modifications to work with Clubmen, but I could be wrong.

 

[physics34]

There's examples where that's not the case. Class 31, for one, says "hello".

Yep but it was the theory... lol.

also class 73/0 and 73/1...

 

[43096]

Class 165 too, I believe? I don't think /0 and /1 can couple since the former had modifications to work with Clubmen, but I could be wrong.

The /1s had the ride height mod when they “went west” so that may also preclude them working together.

 

[brad465]

The 379s to GN, via their acquisition by Porterbrook, is in the latest RAIL edition. No mention of any subsequent cascades, although I'd expect such details haven't yet been disclosed to them or anyone publicly.

 

[fgwrich]

The /1s had the ride height mod when they “went west” so that may also preclude them working together.

Thankfully easily reversible if ever needed - it pretty much comes down to a few additional spacers in the bogie mount and the foot boards.

 

[D365]

In theory all members of a class should be compatable with each other. 377/6s and /7s although are mechanically compatible with 387s, some onboard systems arent. Therefore they are not 387s.

There's examples where that's not the case. Class 31, for one, says "hello".

Indeed. I have colleagues with many such stories to tell.

 

[Nicholas Lewis]

There won't be as many 387s moving south as there are 379s coming in as a few of the 387s are staying with Great Northern to increase capacity there.

I'd bet on something like 12, if not a few more, 387s staying at Hornsey.

They could increase capacity by improving utilisation of the 717's and 700/0 but really could do with a couple of 700/1's to cover the additional Peterborough to eliminate all the 387's.

 

[AirRail]

Apologies if already mentioned, do you think / anyone know if the 379s will actually get the Great Northern livery when they re-enter service? I.e the Thameslink livery with the Great Northern logo.

 

[Hadders]

Apologies if already mentioned, do you think / anyone know if the 379s will actually get the Great Northern livery when they re-enter service? I.e the Thameslink livery with the Great Northern logo.

It's not really a livery, probably just a Great Northern sticker on every carriage.

 

[AirRail]

It's not really a livery, probably just a Great Northern sticker on every carriage.

I get what you're saying, but it is atleast some uniform branding.

The 365s looked much smarter in the livery with the blue doors. The current green doors on the 387s, just looks like a temporary borrowed mess..... Oh wait

 

[westcoaster]

The 379s to GN, via their acquisition by Porterbrook, is in the latest RAIL edition. No mention of any subsequent cascades, although I'd expect such details haven't yet been disclosed to them or anyone publicly.

I was wondering what service group they would use the 387's on that are self contained, as to not cause unit incompatibility & Crewing issues.

East Croydon to Watford junction
London Victoria to East grinstead

A 387 made it to Portsmouth on a test run the other day, maybe Brighton to Portsmouth/ Southampton central west coast routes.