Single Lines That Should Be Doubled

[Andyjs247]

I probably should have said more clearly in the earlier post, but I am basing my guess at the cost (ie, prohibitive) on the doubling of the line also seeing a significant increase in line speed which would mean a lot of the foot crossings would need to be replaced by overbridges. Those things are surprisingly expensive.

Or, if you increase the line speed enough, by removing foot crossings or providing over bridges (if necessary merging / diverting some footpaths) you can increase capacity so perhaps you then don't need to double. Aylesbury to Princes Risborough is not far - I doubt if doubling is necessary.

I can oblige if you want. Face facts, if any proposed growth anywhere on the network can be met with a loop or a partial enhancement then that's all you are going to get....

Agreed

 

[Cherry_Picker]

Or, if you increase the line speed enough, by removing foot crossings or providing over bridges (if necessary merging / diverting some footpaths) you can increase capacity so perhaps you then don't need to double. Aylesbury to Princes Risborough is not far - I doubt if doubling is necessary.

It's about seven miles, give or take. Again I think I need to stress this is something that I dont feel needs doing any time soon, but it would be nice to have one day if and when the East - West railway is complete so that Buckinghamshire is much more connected by rail, with High Wycombe & Aylesbury having a link to Milton Keynes (and the WCML) and Milton Keynes having an alternative route to London. That route will exist even if it stays as a low speed single branch line of course, but all of a sudden it will stand out like a sore thumb.

 

[Lrd]

Eastleigh - Romsey via Chandlers Ford to enable the Salisbury - Romsey 6 to be increased to 2tph.

 

[RichmondCommu]

I probably should have said more clearly in the earlier post, but I am basing my guess at the cost (ie, prohibitive) on the doubling of the line also seeing a significant increase in line speed which would mean a lot of the foot crossings would need to be replaced by overbridges. Those things are surprisingly expensive.

That's fair enough. I experienced something similar whilst staying at Dent station during the summer. A slow for the platform crossing is quickly followed by an accelerating class 66! Not so good on a mild summer's evening! Fantastic location though!

 

[The Ham]

Eastleigh - Romsey via Chandlers Ford to enable the Salisbury - Romsey 6 to be increased to 2tph.

...and electrify the lot to free up the few DMU's on the route.

 

[Francis]

The old Glasgow and South Western main line is single from Barrhead to Lugton, and then from Stewarton to Kilmarnock. It's a bit surprising to have come up from Carlisle, all now on double track via Dumfries and Cumnock, and suddenly to find youself on single line as you approach Glasgow! Isn't it proposed to double these sections to allow a half-hourly Glasgow-Kilmarnock service throughout the day? Come back the Thames-Clyde Express, all is forgiven!

 

[172212]

That already is double track (unless I've missed something, it is late after all...)

Part of the line, coming up to Droitwich, is indeed single track

 

[Eagle]

Part of the line, coming up to Droitwich, is indeed single track

That's not the Lickey Incline :P The incline is between Barnt Green and Bromsgrove.

 

[MattRobinson]

Another vote for the Holmes Curve near Rotherham. Plus electrification of said curve as part of the Midland Mainline electrification from Sheffield to Leeds.

ETA: are there any plans to electrify Sheffield to Doncaster/Leeds when the mml is electrified?

Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk 2

 

[MidnightFlyer]

The old Glasgow and South Western main line is single from Barrhead to Lugton, and then from Stewarton to Kilmarnock. It's a bit surprising to have come up from Carlisle, all now on double track via Dumfries and Cumnock, and suddenly to find youself on single line as you approach Glasgow! Isn't it proposed to double these sections to allow a half-hourly Glasgow-Kilmarnock service throughout the day? Come back the Thames-Clyde Express, all is forgiven!

Lugton-Stewarton was redoubled in 2008 and that is all that was needed to allow Glasgow Central-Kilmarnock to go half-hourly in Dec 2008 I believe.

 

[tbtc]

Another vote for the Holmes Curve near Rotherham. Plus electrification of said curve as part of the Midland Mainline electrification from Sheffield to Leeds.

ETA: are there any plans to electrify Sheffield to Doncaster/Leeds when the mml is electrified?

Nothing official yet, but it's an obvious "next step" for CP6. I don't think that they have time to do much more in CP5 than they have announced, so we'll have to wait until 2017 when they announce the 2019-2024 plans (that will hopefully continue from the good work that is done in CP5).

The Holmes Chord is a real bottleneck (at least three passenger trains each hour over the single track, plus the flat junction at the end).

 

[matchmaker]

As has been said, the Highland Main Line. I understand it is at capacity now. However, the cost would be enormous, as only Inverness - Daviot was built as double.

 

[Francis]

The Highland main is double from Perth to Stanley junction, double from Blair Athol to Dalwhinnie (over Druimuachdar summit), and then just from Culloden Moor down to Milburn Jc (Inverness). You could never double through the Pass of Killicrankie, for example, but Newtonmore to Carrbridge looks more possible (no viaducts). Over Slochd you have both the Slochd viaduct and the Findhorn viaduct - I don't know if they were originally single track or not. Presumably so if double track only ever extended as far south as Daviot.

 

[james60059]

What about the section between Swansea and Llanelli that goes through Gowerton Station?

 

[lancastrian]

Roll Up Roll Roll Up

Here is a small list of lines that " Would " benefit from a section of line or the line itself been doubled

Barnsley - Penistone - Huddersfield
Gainsborough Central - Brigg
Kirkham - Blackpool South
Dore Station Junction and Dore West Junction

I'm sure you can add to the list, these can include lines that are in the pipeline for improvements as well, plus what extra services would you have on these lines or would they remain the same, these could include both passenger and freight traffic

I have a simple answer, rather than listing many lines that should be and need to be doubled AGAIN due to the crazy decision to single them in the first place.

It is this:

ALL OF THEM.

 

[Eagle]

I have a simple answer, rather than listing many lines that should be and need to be doubled AGAIN due to the crazy decision to single them in the first place.

It is this:

ALL OF THEM.

Will you be financing this yourself?

 

[MidnightFlyer]

I have a simple answer, rather than listing many lines that should be and need to be doubled AGAIN due to the crazy decision to single them in the first place.

It is this:

ALL OF THEM.

Why on earth would you want to do that?

 

[Eagle]

What about the section between Swansea and Llanelli that goes through Gowerton Station?

You'd need a new bridge across the Loughor estuary.

 

[Buttsy]

You'd need a new bridge across the Loughor estuary.

I think one is being built as we speak...

 

[MattRobinson]

I have a simple answer, rather than listing many lines that should be and need to be doubled AGAIN due to the crazy decision to single them in the first place.

It is this:

ALL OF THEM.

We should also reopen the lines Beeching destroyed and return to the days of steam locomotives.

Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk 2

 

[Oswyntail]

Why on earth would you want to do that?

There are many good reasons for and against. But the main point for me coming out of this, and innumerable other threads, is that we could do with a proper analysis of all transport needs in the UK and look at this question in that context.
Transport provision has grown organically, which is sensible, but it does lead to the assumption that what we now have is what we need. For instance, earlier in the thread an upgrade to the Brigg line was given the traditional snort of derision, on the grounds that it only sees a limited number of services. But, if we did an analysis of flows from production to export, or import to consumption, without confining ourselves to current routing, it may be possible to make a case for such an upgrade, especially if there is an opportunity for relocation of some of the nodes. IMHO, the electric spine idea is an example of such an approach, and we need more such thinking.

 

[AndyLandy]

Why on earth would you want to do that?

At the risk of sparking more controversy, which line(s) would people not see re-doubled?

 

[tbtc]

earlier in the thread an upgrade to the Brigg line was given the traditional snort of derision, on the grounds that it only sees a limited number of services. But, if we did an analysis of flows from production to export, or import to consumption, without confining ourselves to current routing, it may be possible to make a case for such an upgrade

You could analyse it, but I think you'd be clutching at straws. It's a railway through a fairly empty part of the country, where the main flows are already served (Sheffield - Meadowhall - Rotherham - Doncaster - Scunthorpe - Grimsby - Cleethorpes is hourly, Lincoln - Grimsby - Cleethorpes is every other hour or so, Meadowhall - Sheffield - Worksop - Retford - Gainsborough - Lincoln is hourly).

You could argue for an increase in frequency in/around Lincolnshire (like extending some Northern services beyond Scunthorpe to serve Grimsby, or improving the Sheffield - Lincoln service beyond the current Pacer each hour), but I can't see any need to upgrade the infrastructure. About the only thing that may be justified in my eyes would be one station for Gainsborough (serving Sheffield/ Doncaster/ Grimsby and Lincoln), rather than the two that it currently has, but that's really not a priority compared to some other things in the UK.

The Holmes Chord sees almost as many passenger trains over it in an hour that the Brigg line sees in a week - put it that way.

At the risk of sparking more controversy, which line(s) would people not see re-doubled?

The Brigg line

 

[Buttsy]

You could analyse it, but I think you'd be clutching at straws. It's a railway through a fairly empty part of the country, where the main flows are already served (Sheffield - Meadowhall - Rotherham - Doncaster - Scunthorpe - Grimsby - Cleethorpes is hourly, Lincoln - Grimsby - Cleethorpes is every other hour or so, Meadowhall - Sheffield - Worksop - Retford - Gainsborough - Lincoln is hourly).

You could argue for an increase in frequency in/around Lincolnshire (like extending some Northern services beyond Scunthorpe to serve Grimsby, or improving the Sheffield - Lincoln service beyond the current Pacer each hour), but I can't see any need to upgrade the infrastructure. About the only thing that may be justified in my eyes would be one station for Gainsborough (serving Sheffield/ Doncaster/ Grimsby and Lincoln), rather than the two that it currently has, but that's really not a priority compared to some other things in the UK.

The Holmes Chord sees almost as many passenger trains over it in an hour that the Brigg line sees in a week - put it that way.



The Brigg line

I would say that the Brigg line should be re-doubled if the freight over the route would justify it, not the passenger service. With suitable links in certain places, it could be used as the main freight route from Immingham to the south.

 

[tbtc]

I would say that the Brigg line should be re-doubled if the freight over the route would justify it, not the passenger service. With suitable links in certain places, it could be used as the main freight route from Immingham to the south.

How many freight trains are currently using the route each day?

 

[The Ham]

At the risk of sparking more controversy, which line(s) would people not see re-doubled?

There may well be some, but even those would probably benefit at some point with improved passing loops.

 

[Buttsy]

How many freight trains are currently using the route each day?

It is a very busy diversionary route now for freight traffic

I don't know for certain and currently I would say that it doesn't justify redoubling. My point was more aimed at those on the thread who just look at the passenger service and assume it wouldn't be worthwhile on that basis, totally ignoring any freight moves.

 

[DarloRich]

Bletchley - Fenny Stratford & Kempston - Bedford

+1

but it is only single from 16m.67ch to Midland Station not from Kempston Hardwicke, although there is a double track section from just after St Johns, over the river and towards the station i am not sure if both are in use to Bletchley bound trains or if one is a run round loop/depot access.

We might get our second platform back at downtown Fenny. It will come in useful when the flyover is electirifed.

 

[D6975]

I don't know for certain and currently I would say that it doesn't justify redoubling. My point was more aimed at those on the thread who just look at the passenger service and assume it wouldn't be worthwhile on that basis, totally ignoring any freight moves.

The last time I spent an afternoon at Barnetby (weekday) absolutely nothing used the Brigg line. It think it really only gets used when there are engineering works on the Lincoln or Scunthorpe lines.

 

[AndyLandy]

There may well be some, but even those would probably benefit at some point with improved passing loops.

True. I'd suspect that just about any single-track line could provide additional benefits by being redoubled. I suspect that some are very far down the list, however.

For example, I don't think there's a great deal to be gained in redoubling the MCR between Altrincham and Stockport, since remodelling Navigation Road to accommodate bidirectional trams and trains is likely to be prohibitively expensive.

Equally, I'm not convinced there's enough of a business case to redouble Salisbury-Exeter. More passing loops might be a big win, however. Personally, I think there needs to be an acceptance that no major infrastructure changes will happen along that route any time soon, and therefore procuring new DMUs for that route is not an unreasonable goal.