Rolf Harris

[Minilad]

Quite surprised that there hasn't been a thread about this before now.
Lots of debate about the sentence and his age on other forums.
This is a man who showed no shame for what he had done.
These were, apparently, what would now count as serious sexual assaults. He didn't plead guilty; he instructed his defence to go for the angle that his victims were liars, fantasists or 'gravely mistaken'. Imprisonment for someone found guilty of his crimes is how this county should react to sexual abuse of the young.
Good riddance

 

[ValleyLines142]

He did the crime, he gets the punishment.

Age is just a number unfortunately, regardless of the fact that he's 84.

 

[Tim R-T-C]

No matter what the prison sentence, he will face a lifetime of revulsion and hatred. With such a famous face he will never be able to escape it or live like a normal person again.

 

[Squaddie]

Quite surprised that there hasn't been a thread about this before now.

There is nothing useful or constructive to be said.

 

[radamfi]

Crime happens. It has been happening for as long as anyone can remember. The offender sometimes gets caught and sent to prison. Nothing to see here.

 

[ATW Alex 101]

I've heard that Rolf Harris is dyslexic.

Rofl.

 

[Heinz57]

I really don't know what to say. I find it hard to believe, but the evidence is right there in front of me.

I mean its Rolf Harris, the one who's always smiling and cheerful. Who seemed like such a kind heated gentleman.

It just goes to show really doesn't it?

 

[Leylandlad]

From my childhood, Rolf Harris was often on the TV, as was Jimmy Savile.

Stuart Hall was on the local news every night...and on 5 Live sports in recent years ridiculing my team as "the Peoples Republic of Wigan"...tosser

DLT was acquitted as was Stuart Hall's big mate William Roache.

Makes you wonder who will be next.

 

[starrymarkb]

Is he a British Citizen or would he be looking at Deportation back to Austrailia after finishing his sentence?

 

[generalvegitable]

I thought it was quite light on him, after all he was effectively caught playing his didgeridoo in A minor.

 

[cjp]

I am disappointed an icon of my youth has been shown to have clay feet.
I suppose I will have to stop liking his songs and thinking how clever he was drawing live with a 2" paintbrush
There again other famous people or characters acted in ways that, nowdays, would cause raised eyebrows eg Romeo & young Juliette

 

[meridian2]

Surprised at this revelation: Yes and no.

Surprised at the jail sentence: Yes. Should have been at least 10 years.

A lot of people have tried to discredit Operation Yewtree by calling it a 'celebrity witch-hunt'. And the same people are now keeping quiet.

Surprised?

No.

 

[muddythefish]

I thought it was quite light on him, after all he was effectively caught playing his didgeridoo in A minor.

Very good

 

[swj99]

I really don't know what to say. I find it hard to believe, but the evidence is right there in front of me.

I'm interested to know what the actual evidence was, especially after all these years.
I looked into the accuracy of jury verdicts and it appears that statistically they only get it right 87% of the time. If the figures are correct, there's room for improvement. There's an interesting article here about discrepancies in the evidence.

http://www.libertarianview.co.uk/current-affairs/rolf-harris-beyond-reasonable-doubt

I would also question how, if at all, someone such as Rolf Harris could have had a fair trial, given that he is so well known.

in about 6 per cent of convictions doubts are expressed by two or more of the other main participants (including the police), indicating that certain juries were too easily convinced of the defendant’s guilt. (The study by Kalven and Zeisel, 1966, which contains evidence of major judge—jury divergence, was described above.) .......................

..............Even when ordered to do so, jurors do not ignore evidence presented which is then ruled as inadmissible. They are affected by pre-trial publicity, and they do not give a reduced weight to witnesses who qualify their testimony under cross-examination (Monahan and Loftus 1982)..........

..........Baldwin and McConville (1980) conclude that the jury trial is an unpredictable method for discriminating between the guilty and the innocent, and that the reverence accorded the system is misplaced and excessive.............

http://homepage.ntlworld.com/gary.sturt/crime/jury.htm

 

[DownSouth]

Is he a British Citizen or …

Yes, you get to keep him. He was born in 1930, well before the concept of Australian citizenship was first established in 1948.

An extradition order to face similar allegations in Australia will be more of a problem than an (invalid) deportation order.

 

[Strathclyder]

Is he a British Citizen or would he be looking at Deportation back to Australia after finishing his sentence?

In any case, I don't think Australia is that keen on having him back:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-28173294

 

[DownSouth]

In any case, I don't think Australia is that keen on having him back:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-28173294

Agreed. There are similar allegations in Australia, but with his high profile it would be an extremely brave prosecutor that tried to get an extradition and then a conviction.

There is likely to be pressure on the Federal Government to cancel his Australian (issued as a convenience) passport so he cannot come to Australia even if he wants to. With the exception of Indigenous Australians, people born here before 1948 are all British citizens.

 

[kylemore]

From my childhood, Rolf Harris was often on the TV, as was Jimmy Savile.

Stuart Hall was on the local news every night...and on 5 Live sports in recent years ridiculing my team as "the Peoples Republic of Wigan"...tosser

DLT was acquitted as was Stuart Hall's big mate William Roache.

Makes you wonder who will be next.

Well it certainly won't be a Politician or anyone close to the Heart of the British Establishment anytime soon

Expect more aged "B listers" - all "good fun" for the viewing punters but keeping the searchlight well away from those that matter.

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

Well, that is his kangaroo "well and truly tied down".

 

[ExRes]

With the possibility that he could be out in a miserably short 3 years, if he's still alive by then, it's good to know that more charges are likely to be brought

 

[Peter Mugridge]

Interesting that the court said it could not impose a longer sentence because he had to be sentenced according to how the law stood for the relevant offences at the time they were committed.

In that light, what would happen, I wonder, if we were to now try and convice someone who committed a premediated murder back in the 1950s...? Somehow I suspect they wouldn't apply the same reasoning would they?

 

[yorksrob]

Interesting that the court said it could not impose a longer sentence because he had to be sentenced according to how the law stood for the relevant offences at the time they were committed.

In that light, what would happen, I wonder, if we were to now try and convice someone who committed a premediated murder back in the 1950s...? Somehow I suspect they wouldn't apply the same reasoning would they?

I believe we ceased maintaining and testing a working gallows in 1998.

 

[Leylandlad]

I believe we ceased maintaining and testing a working gallows in 1998.

Excellent pub quiz question that...

Capital punishment in the UK was indeed abolished in 1998, not the 1960's as the Daily Mail would have you believe

The last death sentence in the British Isles was handed down in 1992 (commuted)

Did anyone else see that drama/doc about 4 years ago where Gary Glitter was hanged?

13th August will be the 50th anniversary of the last hanging in Uk...

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

I believe we ceased maintaining and testing a working gallows in 1998.

If you go back in time, we had a number of methods of execution that were used in this country.

 

[yorksrob]

If you go back in time, we had a number of methods of execution that were used in this country.

This is true. There are quite a few crop up in Simon Schama's excellent "History of Britain" which is currently being repeated on BBC4.

 

[DownSouth]

With the possibility that he could be out in a miserably short 3 years, if he's still alive by then, it's good to know that more charges are likely to be brought

The prison food chain will make it hard enough that three years will feel like a lifetime, even if celebrities didn't get a hard time he'll still have the problem that only offenders more despised by the "ordinary decent criminals" are traitors.

It's by no means likely that charges will be laid in any Australian state even though allegations have been made, the huge media exposure of the trial in London would make it almost impossible to select a jury now and it would be unlikely to be thought in the public interest to spend tens of millions of dollars on an extradition and then a prosecution with a slim chance of success. A civil suit for compensation might be possible, and it would have the significant advantage of being decided by a judge on balance of probabilities rather than by a jury requiring proof beyond reasonable doubt, but I doubt that Rolf Harris has any wealth within the reach of Australian bailiffs or that the UK would agree to extradite a UK citizen just so he could be sued.

 

[ExRes]

The prison food chain will make it hard enough that three years will feel like a lifetime, even if celebrities didn't get a hard time he'll still have the problem that only offenders more despised by the "ordinary decent criminals" are traitors.

It's by no means likely that charges will be laid in any Australian state even though allegations have been made, the huge media exposure of the trial in London would make it almost impossible to select a jury now and it would be unlikely to be thought in the public interest to spend tens of millions of dollars on an extradition and then a prosecution with a slim chance of success. A civil suit for compensation might be possible, and it would have the significant advantage of being decided by a judge on balance of probabilities rather than by a jury requiring proof beyond reasonable doubt, but I doubt that Rolf Harris has any wealth within the reach of Australian bailiffs or that the UK would agree to extradite a UK citizen just so he could be sued.

It would be nice if he was charged in Australia as well but I'm referring to the UK where there are, supposedly, more charges waiting patiently in the queue

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

Yes, you get to keep him. He was born in 1930, well before the concept of Australian citizenship was first established in 1948.

I have often wondered about the gap of nearly 50 years that elapsed between the enactment of the Commonwealth of Australia Constitution Act on 5th July 1900 and the passing of the Statute of Australian Nationality and Citizenship Act that came into force on 26th January 1949.

 

[Daz28]

In all of these cases the evidence consists of the victims testimony only, and there is a gap of between 20 and 40 years since the events are alleged to have taken place.

I do wonder why some juries have found the defendants not guilty, and others guilty. It seems to boil down to how much sympathy the jury has respectively for the defendant vs the victim.

It makes me wonder what the outcome would have been if Bill Roache had the Rolf Harris jury and vice versa.

 

[Tim R-T-C]

I do wonder why some juries have found the defendants not guilty, and others guilty. It seems to boil down to how much sympathy the jury has respectively for the defendant vs the victim.

It makes me wonder what the outcome would have been if Bill Roache had the Rolf Harris jury and vice versa.

From what I understand the media have been rather coy on reporting the often very graphic details of the cases.

I think a lot of it has come down to the believability of the witnesses, something that obviously the reporters are not going to make judgement calls on.