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Most powerful UK traction

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notadriver

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Leading on from the 2 Class 90s coupled in multiple, what is most powerful traction combination in scheduled service in the UK at the moment (excluding Eurostar)? Multiple unit formations up to the standard 12 car are included in this one.
 
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Deepgreen

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Leading on from the 2 Class 90s coupled in multiple, what is most powerful traction combination in scheduled service in the UK at the moment (excluding Eurostar)? Multiple unit formations up to the standard 12 car are included in this one.

I'm guessing the pairs of Eurotunnel Bo-Bo-Bos at 2 x 9400hp = 18,800hp, unless you intended to exclude Eurotunnel as well as Eurostar workings.
 

notadriver

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Yes exclude those because they can't operate on normal UK infrastructure.
 

Philip Phlopp

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Leading on from the 2 Class 90s coupled in multiple, what is most powerful traction combination in scheduled service in the UK at the moment (excluding Eurostar)? Multiple unit formations up to the standard 12 car are included in this one.

In light of the above, for passenger services, it's a pair of Class 395 at 6.7MW. Pendolino in 11 car comes in at 5.95MW, everything else, even 12 car varieties, draws less as they're 100mph or 110mph only, so don't need the same grunt for higher top end speeds.
 
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PHILIPE

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When the Margam to Llanwern Iron Ore trains from the Docks at Port Talbot ran during the eighties they were hauled by 3 x Class 56s.
 

Marklund

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When the Margam to Llanwern Iron Ore trains from the Docks at Port Talbot ran during the eighties they were hauled by 3 x Class 56s.

Thought it was 3x37 or 2x56?
Could well be wrong mind you.

91+43 DVT must be in the running.
 

TheEdge

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I thought 60s and 92s were the most powerful locos to be built in the UK
 

HSTEd

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What about the regularly scheduled Class 67 + Class 91 [for a couple of weekends a year?] workings?

Although I doubt they even run both locos at once.
Plenty of room for expansion though - a modern 25kV only Co-Co freight hauler should be able to easily manage 10,000hp. And might even be able to manage 10,000kW.

10,000kW and 530kN has some rather interesting effects on freight timings - certainly would provide impetus for freight electrification.
 
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RepTCTC

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Plenty of room for expansion though - a modern 25kV only Co-Co freight hauler should be able to easily manage 10,000hp.
The Germans got there in the early 70s with these puppies ...

Class 103

Well, I say puppies. More like Himalayan Mountain Dog / Greyhound / Godzilla crosses after an ungodly amount of Chappie.
 

Deepgreen

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Probably not in the same league. Most kettles Max out around 2500hp but their reactive effort can be up near freight diesel or electric stock.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

What is "reactive effort"? I've not heard the term before.
 

trainmania100

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For power engine output i would say 59s are quite strong for iindividual locos but the other day I saw 59203 struggle to move about 13 JYA wagons from standstill its wheels were slipping like mad
 

Deepgreen

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For power engine output i would say 59s are quite strong for iindividual locos but the other day I saw 59203 struggle to move about 13 JYA wagons from standstill its wheels were slipping like mad

Would that be 1300 tons? The 59s have one of the highest tractive effort ratings of any UK class, and anti-slip control, so this must have been quite unusual. Was it on a significant gradient?
 

GRALISTAIR

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Ash Bridge

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For power engine output i would say 59s are quite strong for iindividual locos but the other day I saw 59203 struggle to move about 13 JYA wagons from standstill its wheels were slipping like mad

I don't know if it still holds today, but back in 1991 59005 set the European single locomotive haulage record for a freight train that weighed not far short of 12,000 Tonnes with a lenth of 1650m!
 

Bevan Price

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Originally Posted by GrimsbyPacer View Post
Does Class 9F and other steam locos count?[


QUOTE=AM9;2460188]Probably not in the same league. Most kettles Max out around 2500hp but their reactive effort can be up near freight diesel or electric stock.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

[/QUOTE]

The limiting factor on steam locos (hand fired) was the ability of the fireman to supply enough coal to maintain adequate steam supplies. Some UK Pacifics have been reported to have exceeded 3000 hp - but not for very long. It would have needed mechanical firing ( or oil firing) for steam locos to sustain high hp for long periods.

The USA Union Pacific "Big Boy" 4-8-8-4 steam locos were rated at 8290 hp according to Wikipedia, but anything that big was far too large for the UK loading guage.
 

Deepgreen

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The answer (as has been explored before in other threads) depends on the definition of 'most powerful' in this context. I still don't know what "reactive effort" is, but tractive effort (TE) is essentially the ability to move a load without loss of adhesion/traction. Modern freight locos such as 59s, 66s, etc, have enormous TEs compared with their steam predessors. For example, a 9F had a starting TE of about 40,000lb, whereas a 59 has not far off 115,000lb. However, a 9F could probably produce 2,500hp - 3,000hp for relatively short durations, not much less than the continuous 3,300hp from a 59. The hp output indicates its ability to haul a certain load at a certain speed on a certain gradient, but does not indicate how 'sure-footed' it would be, so to speak. Large 'pacifics', such as 'West Countries' or 'Merchant Navies', for example, could produce between 2000hp and 2500hp, and thus haul a substantial train at high speed, but would not have been suitable for heavy freight work where their low to mid-30,000s lb TE would be insufficient.

By the way, don't forget that the thread is about modern scheduled motive power combinations.
 
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