Great Western Electrification Progress

[snowball]

^^^ Thanks for the link to the Rail Engineer article. Do I understand it correctly that Bristol's power box blocking the old station beyond platform 1 is to be retained, just to control the line between south of Parsons St and south of Bridgwater, with presumably a full 24 shift working just for that?

Presumably it's only a temporary stay of execution as the whole Bristol area will eventually be controlled by Didcot?

 

[edwin_m]

That article was presumably before deferment of electrification to Temple Meads. Does anyone know what the current plan is for the phasing of the signalling? I rather suspect the extra platforms in the Digby Wyatt will be another casualty of this situation.

 

[D1009]

That article was presumably before deferment of electrification to Temple Meads. Does anyone know what the current plan is for the phasing of the signalling? I rather suspect the extra platforms in the Digby Wyatt will be another casualty of this situation.

AIUI the electtrification was deferred because of the delay to the remodelling of the track layout and resignalling, not the other way round.

 

[Chris125]

The wires are indeed now live - credit to Dan Warman for this of 800002 with it's pan up:

 

[jyte]

How long before the IET/Ps start running on electric all the way to Didcot? January with the class 387s?

 

[TwistedMentat]

How long before the IET/Ps start running on electric all the way to Didcot? January with the class 387s?

That's my understanding from what's been said in the Class 800 thread.

 

[jyte]

Shame they won't be using them earlier, but I guess that makes a lot of sense.

What's the state of wiring between Didcot and Swindon? I was under the impression it was now mostly complete.

 

[D1009]

Shame they won't be using them earlier, but I guess that makes a lot of sense.

What's the state of wiring between Didcot and Swindon? I was under the impression it was now mostly complete.

Post #5849 on page 195 gives the most recent position. Still quite a lot to do.

 

[MarkyT]

That article was presumably before deferment of electrification to Temple Meads. Does anyone know what the current plan is for the phasing of the signalling? I rather suspect the extra platforms in the Digby Wyatt will be another casualty of this situation.

Like Reading, the first stage at Bristol TM will be to resignal the existing layout using new processor based interlocking and trackside equipment, transferring control of the station area to Didcot. With the local relay interlocking out of use, that strategy could have allowed the early closure and removal of the PSB, but that will require work to recontrol the existing remote relay interlockings west of Parson Street from Didcot and is not considered a priority for electrification now. After this initial stage at BTM, the track and signalling layout will be modified in multiple stages to achieve the final arrangement, just as it was at Reading. Some electrification could be introduced theoretically as soon as the new compatible trackside equipment is installed, but with bimodes available and to avoid too much rework to the knitting through the stages I think it's a good bet that final wiring and energisation will await the end game layout, with the exception of the two terminal roads intended for the Digby Wyatt shed, which will be fairly easy to add at some currently undefined future phase when the PSB is finally abolished.

AIUI the electtrification was deferred because of the delay to the remodelling of the track layout and resignalling, not the other way round.

Agreed. The whole signalling project was then rejigged to prioritise wiring to Cardiff. Things are not happening in the order planned originally.

 

[Dai Corner]

Like Reading, the first stage at Bristol TM will be to resignal the existing layout using new processor based interlocking and trackside equipment, transferring control of the station area to Didcot. With the local relay interlocking out of use, that strategy could have allowed the early closure and removal of the PSB, but that will require work to recontrol the existing remote relay interlockings west of Parson Street from Didcot and is not considered a priority for electrification now. After this initial stage at BTM, the track and signalling layout will be modified in multiple stages to achieve the final arrangement, just as it was at Reading. Some electrification could be introduced theoretically as soon as the new compatible trackside equipment is installed, but with bimodes available and to avoid too much rework to the knitting through the stages I think it's a good bet that final wiring and energisation will await the end game layout, with the exception of the two terminal roads intended for the Digby Wyatt shed, which will be fairly easy to add at some currently undefined future phase when the PSB is finally abolished.



Agreed. The whole signalling project was then rejigged to prioritise wiring to Cardiff. Things are not happening in the order planned originally.

Very interesting. Thanks.

Are we saying Temple Meads could have been remodelled, resignalled and electrified before Cardiff if somebody had decided to do so? I'm not criticising the decision, just wondering.

 

[HowardGWR]

MarkyT Yes I think you are right about that. Yesterday, arriving at T.M. I walked through the side entrance (in many ways now perhaps the main entrance*) and pondered the fate of the lone figure at 0300, say, in that huge nearly empty building, when all that is to be controlled is a straight line between south of Parsons St and south of Bridgwater. One wonders whether the stretch could just be 'switched out' in the night hours.

*It would be interesting to monitor the footfall. Of course, once the platforms in the Digby Watt / Brunel building are reinstated, it won't be so handy, as one will have to walk under a rebuilt subway, which, IIRC, was halfway down the 'Midland' platform.

Edit: Having looked up a few details, it seems that Sir Francis Fox was the architect responsible for the extension of the Brunel building in 1878, when some of it was replaced. I've got a book so will look into that further. The building is in three distinct sections, the most southerly is the Brunel GWR Head Offices, then the 'Passenger Shed' which is of the same design, but has a wider overall roof, then the brick built extension, which is what I always knew as the 'Midland side'.

 

[Thatcham Xing]

There have been night-time possesions on the B&H this week - this morning in daylight, quite a lot of metal dangly bits have appeared in the last few days at various points between Aldermaston and Thatcham. Also, some more uprights near to the M4 at Theale, which was one of the remaining gaps with no metalwork at all.

 

[3973EXL]

Taking advantage of the B&H maintenance possessions this week, there have been a number of MPV workings from Swindon to Thatcham/Midgham and Theale areas.

Nice sunny day, so I walked Aldermaston to Thatcham to have a closer look today. First a summary from Southcote Jn to Aldermaston.

There are no masts at any of the stations to Newbury.

Southcote Jn is MP37.62, first masts start after MP38 1/4 and run until just before MP40. From there until MP41 just east of Theale there are some masts by Calcot Mill crossing and on the down side between there and the M4 bridge. After the M4 there are a number of masts in the down side cess.
From MP41 to MP43 3/4 (part way along Ufton Loop) the masts look pretty much complete.
There is a gap of about 1/4 mile before the masts start again by Towney crossing. There are then some gaps with masts missing to Aldermaston.

After Aldermaston there is only the odd mast missing to Thatcham. From Frouds Lane (by the works compound) a lot of the SPS is up to Thatcham. Thatcham to Newbury Racecourse is the most complete section with masts and SPS.

First 2 photos looking E towards Towney crossing from Padworth Lane.
3 E from Basingstoke Road.
4 E from Aldermaston station. 5 W from station. 6 W from station Road bridge.
7 & 8 Frouds Lane compound. 9 E from Frouds Lane bridge. 10 W from bridge.

 

[swt_passenger]

Looking at the picture of a yard full of road rail lorries, has anyone got an idea what the proportion of work being done by the MPVs is, compared to more conventional means?

Are they still not getting the full intended operational capability out of the MPV wiring train fleet?

 

[3973EXL]

Aldermaston to Thatcham.

1 & 2. East & West from Wickham Knights crossing East of Midgham.
3 & 4. Views East & West from Midgham station.
5 & 6. Views from the Kennet path near Oxlease Bridge/Heales Lock.
7 & 8. Crannel's crossing E & W.

 

[3973EXL]

Aldermaston to Thatcham cont.

1. East near Midgham bridge.
2 & 3. Views E & W Midgham overbridge Brimpton Road.
4 & 5. Views E & W Thatcham.

 

[edwin_m]

After this initial stage at BTM, the track and signalling layout will be modified in multiple stages to achieve the final arrangement, just as it was at Reading. Some electrification could be introduced theoretically as soon as the new compatible trackside equipment is installed, but with bimodes available and to avoid too much rework to the knitting through the stages I think it's a good bet that final wiring and energisation will await the end game layout, with the exception of the two terminal roads intended for the Digby Wyatt shed, which will be fairly easy to add at some currently undefined future phase when the PSB is finally abolished.

I also think there will be no electrification until the remodelling/re-signalling is finished. I believe at Reading they retained the original signals, point machines etc at the initial re-signalling, replacing them individually as they were eliminated by subsequent layout changes. If this happens at TM too, then any remaining "old" equipment would presumably also need immunising if it was still in place when any electrification took place.

MarkyT Yes I think you are right about that. Yesterday, arriving at T.M. I walked through the side entrance (in many ways now perhaps the main entrance*) and pondered the fate of the lone figure at 0300, say, in that huge nearly empty building, when all that is to be controlled is a straight line between south of Parsons St and south of Bridgwater. One wonders whether the stretch could just be 'switched out' in the night hours.

Interesting thought. The original entrance in the V formed by the Brunel/Digby Wyatt and the later curved platforms always seems incredibly cramped, but difficult to see how the second entrance near the east end of the Digby Wyatt could be kept after tracks are restored.

The answer may be to extend the main subway under the forecourt and the Digby Wyatt with steps/lifts to the new platforms, emerging via a barrier line on the north side of the station (probably passing under the car park on the former Docks branch for level access to Friary). This would provide a much quicker route for interchange between the Digby Wyatt and the high-numbered platforms, as well as a improving access to the north which would relieve pressure on the original entrance. Something similar was suggested in a Network Rail publication a few years ago.

 

[jyte]

Are the line closure today on the relief lines between Maidenhead and Twyford electrification related or just general renewal?

 

[Railperf]

I understand the wires are now live between Maidenhead and Didcot through Reading from 11th November. is it likely that IEP passenger services aregoing to start using electric power and change to diesel at Didcot now?

 

[TwistedMentat]

I understand the wires are now live between Maidenhead and Didcot through Reading from 11th November. is it likely that IEP passenger services aregoing to start using electric power and change to diesel at Didcot now?

Not happening until Jan 2 from what I've seen in this thread or the Class 800 thread. Right now they're testing, not revenue running.

 

[JN114]

OHLE not due to be signed into Passenger use by ORR until late December. Can be used for testing under certain, controlled conditions.

 

[jyte]

Found this earlier, an 800 raising the pantograph as it departs Reading.

 

[Mintona]

I also think there will be no electrification until the remodelling/re-signalling is finished. I believe at Reading they retained the original signals, point machines etc at the initial re-signalling, replacing them individually as they were eliminated by subsequent layout changes. If this happens at TM too, then any remaining "old" equipment would presumably also need immunising if it was still in place when any electrification took place.


Interesting thought. The original entrance in the V formed by the Brunel/Digby Wyatt and the later curved platforms always seems incredibly cramped, but difficult to see how the second entrance near the east end of the Digby Wyatt could be kept after tracks are restored.

The answer may be to extend the main subway under the forecourt and the Digby Wyatt with steps/lifts to the new platforms, emerging via a barrier line on the north side of the station (probably passing under the car park on the former Docks branch for level access to Friary). This would provide a much quicker route for interchange between the Digby Wyatt and the high-numbered platforms, as well as a improving access to the north which would relieve pressure on the original entrance. Something similar was suggested in a Network Rail publication a few years ago.

I’m fairly sure the Digby Wyatt platform plan will never happen. It’ll cost too much money, and after the farce of electrification there won’t be an appetite to spend it

 

[Sunset route]

I walked through the side entrance (in many ways now perhaps the main entrance*) and pondered the fate of the lone figure at 0300, say, in that huge nearly empty building, when all that is to be controlled is a straight line between south of Parsons St and south of Bridgwater. One wonders whether the stretch could just be 'switched out' in the night hours.

There’s no mechanism to switch out such a huge area of control even if it basically a two Line railway in TCB regs, (I know that some boxes switched out with king levers but they didn’t control the distance involved here) and it would such a huge detour via Westbury to get to and from the West Country so what would be the point. The track mileage can’t be no different to the likes of several one person panel boxes that have little or no traffic at night but still remain open.

 

[snowball]

The Enhancements Delivery Plan still has completion to Cardiff by Dec 2018, but both Modern Railways and Rail, in their current issues, suggest further slippage to March 2019. MR November, page 9, refers to a statement by Neil Thompson, NR's Infrastructure Projects Regional Director, in a recent NR publication (no name or link given), and Rail 839 p. 21 refers to a Commons written reply on Oct 24.

 

[HowardGWR]

I’m fairly sure the Digby Wyatt platform plan will never happen. It’ll cost too much money, and after the farce of electrification there won’t be an appetite to spend it

You may be right, but we have to recall that the T.M. project is not an electrification one, but a redevelopment of the Temple Meads Quarter, which includes a number of capacity-related improvements to T.M. The general approach is that the side of T.M. next to 'Plot 6' is to have a Kings Cross type addition, which would replace the present cramped main entrance facilities and include a transport interchange. If that comes off, I am sure that the Old Station will be used again.

Whether this will happen, is indeed a question mark. There are two many quango-ish irons in the fire. Electrification is not dependent on these issues, but is dependent on the resignalling.

 

[D1009]

You may be right, but we have to recall that the T.M. project is not an electrification one, but a redevelopment of the Temple Meads Quarter, which includes a number of capacity-related improvements to T.M. The general approach is that the side of T.M. next to 'Plot 6' is to have a Kings Cross type addition, which would replace the present cramped main entrance facilities and include a transport interchange. If that comes off, I am sure that the Old Station will be used again.

Whether this will happen, is indeed a question mark. There are two many quango-ish irons in the fire. Electrification is not dependent on these issues, but is dependent on the resignalling.

I would have thought it was dependent on the proposed enhancements to services in connection with the Bristol Metro project, such as the increased service to Yate and the Henbury plan, but I'm not holding my breath, given recent history of other "redevelopment" in Bristol.

While not directly electrification related, during last weekend's closure of Bristol Parkway, there has been significant progress on the preparations for platform 1. The metal wall to the east of the footbridge on platform 2 which prevented a view of the Freightliner yard from most of the platform has been removed along with the little used London end waiting room. The wall has been replaced with temporary screens in preparation for it eventually becoming an island platform. The Freightliner Yard appears to have been remodelled with lots of new ballast in evidence, and the pointwork includes a new double slip.

 

[Envoy]

Would it not be prudent to wire a short section of the Ebbw Vale line from where it just comes off the mainline west of Newport? I say this because if the Wales & Borders franchise starts using bi-modes, it surely would be best for them to operate on electricity on the mainline and then switch to diesel power once they have pulled off/prior to entering - the mainline.

 

[Dai Corner]

Would it not be prudent to wire a short section of the Ebbw Vale line from where it just comes off the mainline west of Newport? I say this because if the Wales & Borders franchise starts using bi-modes, it surely would be best for them to operate on electricity on the mainline and then switch to diesel power once they have pulled off/prior to entering - the mainline.

I think that's normal practice? It helps if a (straight electric) train is misrouted and makes construction a bit easier if the branch is subsequently electrified.

 

[LNW-GW Joint]

I think that's normal practice? It helps if a (straight electric) train is misrouted and makes construction a bit easier if the branch is subsequently electrified.

Not always. There are plenty of examples where the wires go straight over a junction without any run-off on to the branch.
At Newport we can already see that the start of the Marches line (the Maindee triangle) will be getting wired.