Without wishing to enter into a debate about it, I think what the Northern Twitter team were getting at is that the company can't ask the drivers to work rest days because ASLEF have told the drivers not to without a formal RDW agreement. With my professional hat on, I do think that Northern painting that as 'because of ASLEF regulations' is a pretty obvious line. It's not untruthful as such - it just omits certain facts - and it both shares out responsibility, and obfuscates the issue, with some aplomb. Say what you like about Northern's ability to run trains, but their communications team is far from daft.
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Northern's Problems in the North West
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Can you explain to me what is it that ASLEF have to "come clean" about?
As I've posted on here umpteenth times. The RDW agreement ended and ASLEF weren't approached for it to be renewed and apparently still haven't.
All this talk of ASLEF making stupid demands is just heresay.
ASLEF must be fully aware as to why that should be.
So you're not actually saying that it's incorrect?
Good one.
No, I've spoken to our local reps and company council rep if they've been approached by the company for a RDW agreement and the answer is no.
So,if there's been no meeting or approach no demands by ASLEF can be made.
According to 'Live Departures' at Buckshaw Parkway, it's going to terminate at Preston.
EDIT: It looks to be returning as 2T60, 0731 Preston to Manchester Oxford Road (actual departure just short of 0737), but on its outward journey from Stockport to Ribble Junction there's no sign of it after Euxton Junction.
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Can I take it that you've no idea why Northern hasn't requested another RDW agreement?
No! You can take it that ASLEF have no idea why the company haven't sook a rest day agreement.
RTT doesn't handle trains "off route" well, TRUST shows it actually arrived at Preston (station) at 07.33.
http://www.charlwoodhouse.co.uk/rail/liverail/train/13237886/29/05/18
According to Matthew S, the following statement was included in a Northern press release.
You're presumably saying that, contrary to that press release, Northern aren't actually working with ASLEF at all (with a view to getting Rest Day working reinstated).
Now we're getting somewhere
Surely it would be in ASLEF's interests to have an RDW agreement. So why doesn't it take the initiative and suggest to Northern that it might negotiate such?
Because that isn't how the situation works. It's up to the company to approach ASLEF, not the other way round.
It came up on the boards as 'Delayed' with no platform, then disappeared with no announcement made. Makes it kinda hard to catch the train, even if it was running
So what is the point of him then, apart from giving you someone to point to when everyone says that no-one agrees with you re electrification, to everyone's very great amusement ?
I know it's probably a stupid suggestion, but why not cancel every other service on each route, double up the number of carriages and at least give passengers a more reliable service. As a passenger all I want is to know what time my train is coming and I can plan accordingly. Last night leaving Lime Street after the Tall Ships all I heard was "Northern apologises for the cancellation of..." Empty trains waiting in platforms, staff not knowing which train was going to form which service. It's all well and good for people who are savvy and know the system inside out to be able to cope with this (after a fashion) but when the staff on the ground were asking drivers "Can anyone take this to Preston?" it is a pretty poor show for the average member of the travelling (and paying!) passenger.
northwichcat
Veteran Member
I don't like that suggestion. Mainly because some routes have just got their enhanced services, others have had their enhanced services postponed and others aren't due to get enhanced services anyway. Giving a route a 2 hourly service when it is supposed to have a half-hourly service by now would go down very badly. Also many routes have at least some services already operated by the maximum length formation possible, any longer formations would mean stations would have to be missed out due to short platforms and would mean some stations losing more than just 'every other service.'
underbank
Established Member
It looks even stranger to the average traveller when they're hemmed into a single coach sprinter for a 2 hour journey with standing room only, when there is an empty/cancelled 2/3 coach DMUs at another platform.
Bletchleyite
Veteran Member
I completely agree. A simplified emergency timetable with wholly self contained diagrams and all trains at maximum length.
The statement from Northern seems odd to me. They say they have 1,529 drivers of whom over 400 need to sign the road to Blackpool. Really?
Over a quarter of their entire driving staff need to sign Blackpool?
Just doesn't seem to make sense. (And I write this as a former Depot Editor in a diagramming office.)
Really? A crush loaded 153 operating a service on its own?
alansheppard77
Member
How is Northern keeping its franchise disgusting service 200 trains either cancelled or altered today already,how can you possibly plan a journey
Robertj21a
On Moderation
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I'm pleased someone else has asked this very question. I can understand that a good many are needed to know the route, plus spares, plus holiday cover, plus contingency etc etc etc - but 400 ??
Well apparently my last post was deleted because it didnt make sense so I will have another go. Out and about on the Northern 10 pound promotional Rover ticket and frankly in the North West its a complete shambles. The only positive is 37402 is running on the coast although the 67s were listed as cancelled. My first train of the day Halifax to Preston was cancelled went via Man Victoria instead which looked like the usual tale of lates and cancellations. On arrival at Preston virtually everything to Blackpool cancelled running buses between Preston and Blackpool plus cancellations to Colne, Leeds and Windermere etc. Bottom line is it's simply not good enough and I would hate to be commuter in the North West at present.
How many northern drivers are based at Blackpool? , obviously all of them plus the links from any other depots that have work there, I’m sure someone on here has a rough idea what that amounts to .
There have been no talks to re introduce RDW....but no doubt its impacting because route learning for new drivers has stopped. In terms of numbers of drivers ( and guards ) in situ right now, there is enough, but some significant numbers only sign a small number of routes.
Loop & Link
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Evening peak at Liverpool not looking good,
16:45 Wigan
17:00 Warrington BQ
17:09 Preston
17:13 Wigan
17:17 Man Vic
17:55 Manchester Oxford Road (via Warrington Cen)
17:59 Wigan ;
All cancelled.
That’s nothing from Lime St-Huyton from 16:36-17:36 on a line that usually has 5tph! Hopefully stop orders issued for that 17:36 Blackpool between Lime St and Huyton.
Edit: Might be hope for that 17:13 Wigan now but subject to a late start, Driver due off a late Oxford Road, let’s hope the Blackpool guard is there for it!
16:45 Wigan
17:00 Warrington BQ
17:09 Preston
17:13 Wigan
17:17 Man Vic
17:55 Manchester Oxford Road (via Warrington Cen)
17:59 Wigan ;
All cancelled.
That’s nothing from Lime St-Huyton from 16:36-17:36 on a line that usually has 5tph! Hopefully stop orders issued for that 17:36 Blackpool between Lime St and Huyton.
Edit: Might be hope for that 17:13 Wigan now but subject to a late start, Driver due off a late Oxford Road, let’s hope the Blackpool guard is there for it!
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Over the last two or three weeks, the trains on my commute away from Manchester have gradually become emptier and emptier.
On one occasion I was the only passenger leaving at Salford Central in the afternoon.
From what I’ve heard, people are switching to the buses and I can’t say I blame them.
On one occasion I was the only passenger leaving at Salford Central in the afternoon.
From what I’ve heard, people are switching to the buses and I can’t say I blame them.
jamesst
Member
In a loosely linked to the thread kind of question how on earth do the signallers cope with trains being dumped everywhere and journeys half finished? When no-one has any idea what services are running where? Are they working to some kind of contingency plan to try and avoid blocking the main lines?
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