MML Electrification: progress updates

[snowball]

Line being electrified between Bedford - Kettering - Corby, due to open Dec '19.

Unless you've heard something recently about 2019 that the rest of us haven't, the completion date has been 2020 for a long time now. August 2020 if I remember correctly.

 

[HowardGWR]

It’s not been cancelled as such. The full electrification to Sheffield and Nottingham has been removed from Network Rail’s scope. This leaves NR electrifying to Corby and probably Market Harborough (although the latter remains to be confirmed). This is a similar situation to the lines to Bristol Temple Meads. All further electrification will be authorised separately from NR’s maintenance grant by the DfT. If any of the above is an incorrect interpretation of government intent, someone on here will correct me.

That is my understanding but what is very concernng, is that while the Chancellor anounced around £28 billion for road building, without specifying which schemes (yet), nothing was announced for rail capital projects, except some odds and sods and money for preparing further business cases and design statements for such as EWR. In the case of the MML, the business case was made ages ago, under which the present electrification is a part of it. It shoud not be necessary to have to present a new business case for Market Harborough to Sheffield, as that section apart, does not make sense.

 

[CdBrux]

For a start the section south of Sheffield and through Chesterfield will presumably be electrified by HS2.
Then there is the claim that the BCR for electrification was not shown separately from all the other upgrades the line is getting and had it been done so it would have been very poor. So I think a new case would probably be required

 

[Jorge Da Silva]

It’s not been cancelled as such. The full electrification to Sheffield and Nottingham has been removed from Network Rail’s scope. This leaves NR electrifying to Corby and probably Market Harborough (although the latter remains to be confirmed). This is a similar situation to the lines to Bristol Temple Meads. All further electrification will be authorised separately from NR’s maintenance grant by the DfT. If any of the above is an incorrect interpretation of government intent, someone on here will correct me.

I think the Bristol, Swansea and Oxford electrification was deferred in November 2016. Swansea, Windermere and north of Kettering was cancelled in July 2017. The Electric Spine is unknown and assumed cancelled or delayed indefinitely.

 

[uxm]

It’s not been cancelled as such. The full electrification to Sheffield and Nottingham has been removed from Network Rail’s scope. This leaves NR electrifying to Corby and probably Market Harborough (although the latter remains to be confirmed). This is a similar situation to the lines to Bristol Temple Meads. All further electrification will be authorised separately from NR’s maintenance grant by the DfT. If any of the above is an incorrect interpretation of government intent, someone on here will correct me.

So what you are inferring is that the electrification project has been deferred rather than scrapped? I'm not sure if that is the case.

 

[uxm]

Also, is the electrification serving the new bi mode aventras or the thameslink services?

 

[Jorge Da Silva]

Also, is the electrification serving the new bi mode aventras or the thameslink services?

New Bi-mode stock for services beyond Kettering and EMU's to Corby. Not Thameslink

 

[Mollman]

For a start the section south of Sheffield and through Chesterfield will presumably be electrified by HS2.

I believe they have confirmed Clay Cross to Sheffield and wherever the northern junction back onto HS2 will be.

 

[swt_passenger]

Also, is the electrification serving the new bi mode aventras?

When was the rolling stock decided, or is that a guess?

 

[WymoWanderer]

Unless you've heard something recently about 2019 that the rest of us haven't, the completion date has been 2020 for a long time now. August 2020 if I remember correctly.

Yes, August 2020, passenger use from December 2020
See slide # 34 of the Network Rail September 2018 Enhancements Delivery Plan - https://cdn.networkrail.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2018/10/Enhancement-Delivery-Plan-.pdf

 

[Aictos]

Yes, August 2020, passenger use from December 2020
See slide # 34 of the Network Rail September 2018 Enhancements Delivery Plan - https://cdn.networkrail.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2018/10/Enhancement-Delivery-Plan-.pdf

That might well be the actual plan but if existing projects are anything to go by see Preston/Manchester to Blackpool electrification schemes as well as the infamous TL project then I can't help but be cynical and go with May 2021 as the date for passenger use.

Of course I am happy to be proven wrong but current project management isn't exactly inspiring!

 

[themiller]

So what you are inferring is that the electrification project has been deferred rather than scrapped? I'm not sure if that is the case.

No, I'm not saying that it's been deferred! What I am saying is that it's been taken out of the current scope. If it's to go ahead, it'll be as a new project and will have to pass the hurdles at that time. It won't be a requirement on NR to 'go and do it and hand over the bill on completion'.

 

[edwin_m]

When was the rolling stock decided, or is that a guess?

Rolling stock will to be a matter for the new franchise.

 

[swt_passenger]

Rolling stock will to be a matter for the new franchise.

Exactly what I was thinking. Bombardier have announced a possible solution, but that’s all it is so far.

 

[furnessvale]

Thanks for the correction - with the Market Harborough track straightening, will they take the golden PR opportunity to improve the timetable and advertise Leicester to London in "Under an Hour"?

Not a lot wrong with that. Some years ago, maybe even now, Swiss railways had a policy of spending money on improvements which would achieve exactly that, rather than spending it where the easiest timing improvements could be gained.

 

[59CosG95]

Not a lot wrong with that. Some years ago, maybe even now, Swiss railways had a policy of spending money on improvements which would achieve exactly that, rather than spending it where the easiest timing improvements could be gained.

The caveat is that, some years ago, maybe even now, the Swiss railways have the MONEY.
And not nearly as many trains. More services operate per day in Kent than all of Switzerland.

 

[edwin_m]

Not a lot wrong with that. Some years ago, maybe even now, Swiss railways had a policy of spending money on improvements which would achieve exactly that, rather than spending it where the easiest timing improvements could be gained.

However, it wasn't done just to make a good press release! The national timetable (Taktfahrplan) relies on trains connecting with each other every hour at key stations, which is much easier to achieve if the running time between those places is just less than the hour. This results in a network of buses and trains connecting with each other, making a journey from anywhere to anywhere much easier by public transport. So people who don't even use the upgraded routes benefit from them.

 

[59CosG95]

However, it wasn't done just to make a good press release! The national timetable (Taktfahrplan) relies on trains connecting with each other every hour at key stations, which is much easier to achieve if the running time between those places is just less than the hour. This results in a network of buses and trains connecting with each other, making a journey from anywhere to anywhere much easier by public transport. So people who don't even use the upgraded routes benefit from them.

Would it be a wise assumption to make that each of Switzerland's individual cantons all have devolved powers, and work with SBB/CFF/FFS to provide an integrated transport network (buses, trams, narrow-gauge rail etc.) that meshes seamlessly with the "main line"?

 

[LNW-GW Joint]

That is my understanding but what is very concernng, is that while the Chancellor anounced around £28 billion for road building, without specifying which schemes (yet), nothing was announced for rail capital projects, except some odds and sods and money for preparing further business cases and design statements for such as EWR. In the case of the MML, the business case was made ages ago, under which the present electrification is a part of it. It shoud not be necessary to have to present a new business case for Market Harborough to Sheffield, as that section apart, does not make sense.

Network Rail has to show it can deliver electrification at an acceptable cost, otherwise the business case is toast.
Maybe Bedford-Corby will be the scheme to do that, but it's too early to tell.
The bi-mode and general upgrade plans for the MML means an electrification decision is not urgent.
HS2 plans will also affect the business case.

 

[edwin_m]

Would it be a wise assumption to make that each of Switzerland's individual cantons all have devolved powers, and work with SBB/CFF/FFS to provide an integrated transport network (buses, trams, narrow-gauge rail etc.) that meshes seamlessly with the "main line"?

Maybe so, but that's a bit of a separate issue from the <1h between main stations (you probably need both to achieve the goal), and getting rather a long way off topic!

 

[59CosG95]

Maybe so, but that's a bit of a separate issue from the <1h between main stations (you probably need both to achieve the goal), and getting rather a long way off topic!

Indeed - to paraphrase Sanka from Cool Runnings - "oh shut up about the damn Swiss' railways"

Back to Northants, I've noticed that more TTCs (over the Slows) have appeared north of Finedon Rd Bridge in Wellingborough, with dangly bits up too.

Additionally, the SHS (square hollow section) portal masts for Tensorex kit/MPAs (as seen on the GWML) have started to appear in the same area.
I noticed someone on here posted about GWML-esque steelwork being extant in a yard; as the MML is using UKMS (the best of both worlds from Series 1 and Series 2), such portals are what they're probably due to be used for.

 

[Bald Rick]

And not nearly as many trains. More services operate per day in Kent than all of Switzerland.

Urban myth. That was often said about a decade ago, but then someone actually counted them up and found it isn’t right.

 

[59CosG95]

Urban myth. That was often said about a decade ago, but then someone actually counted them up and found it isn’t right.

Ahhh - my apologies.

 

[snowball]

Not one but two press releases from yesterday:

https://www.networkrail.co.uk/feeds...erations-to-train-services-in-leicestershire/

Network Rail is urging rail passengers to check before they travel on Saturday 10 and Sunday 11 November as the weekend sees a whole host of work to upgrade the Midland Main Line in the latest stage of the £1.5billion investment.

Network Rail engineers will continue on the Market Harborough Line Speed Improvement Project and will carry out work to the track bed to enable increased train speeds and improved journey times by straightening the line.

Work will also take place to strengthen Rockingham Road bridge in Market Harborough. The bridge needs to be strengthened so that it is ready to carry the additional ballast which is required to support the higher line speed.

To allow this work to be carried out, the road will close on Friday 9 November and reopen on Monday 19 November. Pedestrian access will be maintained throughout the work.

Upgrades will also take place on the southern end of the Midland Main Line which will see Odell Viaduct in Bedfordshire demolished and reconstructed.

All of this work means a reduced service between London St Pancras and Bedford. These services will connect into replacement buses between Bedford and Leicester and Kettering and Corby.

Passengers planning on travelling are urged to check before they travel via National Rail Enquiries or with East Midlands Trains. Due to the ongoing work taking place to renew the lifts at Bedford railway station there is no step-free access to platforms 2, 3 or 4. Customers who will be travelling during this time and need assistance are urged to plan ahead and book assistance for their journey, especially those that may be travelling to attend events on Remembrance Sunday.

Wendy Bell, Sponsor for Network Rail, said: “Next weekend sees various stages of work to upgrade the railway as part of the Midland Main Line Upgrade and will see two key structures along the route upgraded.

“The work does mean changes for both rail passengers and motorists and we are urging them to plan ahead. We are working closely with train operators to keep disruption to a minimum and we’d like to thank travellers and residents for their patience whilst this takes place.”

Dan Lucas, General Manager South for East Midlands Trains, added: “There is a significant amount of work taking place on the Midland Main Line on the weekend of the 10th and 11th of November. It will mean customers travelling to and from London, particularly to and from stations north of Bedford, will have extended journey times. We would urge everyone to check before they travel and leave plenty of time to make their journey.

“In addition, works at Bedford station to upgrade the lifts means there is no step free access to platforms 2, 3 and 4. If you need assistance, please contact us before you set off and we will help you get where you need to go.”

Passengers can book assistance at Bedford station through their train operator.

Passengers can contact Thameslink by

• Phone: 0800 058 2844

• Online: thameslinkrailway.com/assistedtravel

Passengers can contact East Midlands Trains via

• Phone: 08000 11 33 23

https://www.networkrail.co.uk/feeds...lterations-to-train-services-in-bedfordshire/

Network Rail is urging passengers in Bedfordshire to check before they travel on Saturday 10 and Sunday 11 November as the £1.5billion investment into the line continues.

As part of the Midland Main Line Upgrade, Odell Viaduct near Odell and Sharnbrook needs to be raised to allow for the safe clearance of overhead line equipment in anticipation of electrification of the line between London to Kettering and Corby via Bedford.

Between Friday, 10 November and Monday, 12 November, Network Rail workers will demolish and reconstruct the bridge during 54 hours of round the clock work. Train services will return to normal on Monday, 12 November with the work completing before the first train service.

Work is also taking place further north on the Midland Main Line at Market Harborough. Network Rail engineers will carry out work to the track bed to enable increased train speeds and improved journey times by straightening the line. Network Rail will also carry out work to strengthen Rockingham Road bridge in the town.

All of this work means a reduced service between London St Pancras and Bedford. These services will connect into replacement buses between Bedford and Leicester and Kettering and Corby.

Passengers planning on travelling are urged to check before they travel via National Rail Enquiries or with East Midlands Trains. Due to work taking place to renew the lifts at Bedford railway station there is no step-free access to the station from platforms 2, 3 or 4. Customers who will be travelling during this time and need assistance are urged to plan ahead and book assistance for their journey, especially those that may be travelling to attend events on Remembrance Sunday.

Network Rail engineers have been on site at Odell Viaduct since August 2018 and have worked to install a temporary footbridge. Once the bridge has been reconstructed, Network Rail engineers will remain on site to remove waste materials, reconstruct the parapet walls, reinstate services and tarmac the road.

To allow the work to take place, Back Lane has been closed since September 2018. Pedestrian access has been maintained via a temporary footbridge.

Wendy Bell, Sponsor at Network Rail, said: “This is the latest stage of vital work to upgrade the railway in Bedford as part of the Midland Main Line Upgrade and will see a key structure along the route upgraded.

“The work does mean changes for rail passengers and we are urging them to plan ahead. We are working closely with train operators to keep disruption to a minimum and we’d like to thank travellers and residents for their patience whilst this takes place.”

Dan Lucas, General Manager South for East Midlands Trains, added: “There is a significant amount of work taking place on the Midland Main Line on the weekend of the 10th and 11th of November. It will mean customers travelling to and from London, particularly to and from stations north of Bedford, will have extended journey times. We would urge everyone to check before they travel and leave plenty of time to make their journey.

“In addition, works at Bedford station to upgrade the lifts means there is no step free access to platforms 2, 3 and 4. If you need assistance, please contact us before you set off and we will help you get where you need to go.”

Passengers can book assistance at Bedford station through their train operator.

Passengers can contact Thameslink by

• Phone: 0800 058 2844

• Online: thameslinkrailway.com/assistedtravel

Passengers can contact East Midlands Trains via

• Phone: 08000 11 33 23

• Online: https://www.eastmislandstrains.co.uk/information/contact-us/ • Text Direct: 18001 08000 11 33 23

 

[grumpyoldman01]

Pendolinos wouldnt provide anything like the same overall benefits on a line where ordinary trains can already run at 115, or 125 mph over certain sections. It’s the same on the GW and ECML. The WCML is a bit of a one off, really.

An investigation into the benefits of tilt was undertaken by BR on a route-by-route basis at the time that the APT-S project was going through the appraisal process.

In simple terms, this took as the base the APT-S proposal, and compared it with a non-tilting version of the same train; consequently, the non-tilting train had the same power but was significantly lighter, and the benefits of the improved power-to-weight ration were significant.

I don't know if a copy of the report is gathering dust somewhere in the National Archive or in the NRM, but from memory the MML was the only route were tilt gave a significant time benefit; on the other routes analysed, there wasn't anything significant on the GW and WCML, and on the ECML a non-tilting train was marginally quicker between King's Cross and Edinburgh than a tilting one.

I'm sorry, I can't remember the methodology used to determine the potential journey times for tilting v non-tilting trains, but I guess the theoretical maximum speed based upon track alignment and gradient would have been used; moreover, although I can't remember what the journey times were, the two key factors which have really stuck in my mind was that non-tilt was marginally quicker than tilt on the ECML, and that the only real benefit from tilt was on the MML.

 

[mr_jrt]

...it that were the case, why do the Mk4 carriages built for the ECML have a tilt profile?

 

[grumpyoldman01]

...it that were the case, why do the Mk4 carriages built for the ECML have a tilt profile?

Sorry, don't know - I wasn't directly involved with the IC225 project.

My GUESS is that it was to help make them "futureproof"; there wasn't a requirement for 140mph at that time but it was a sensible provision for the future as it could be incorporated at little - perhaps nil - extra cost at time of construction, and having the capacity for tilt to be added at a later date could possibly fall in the same category.

 

[w1bbl3]

...it that were the case, why do the Mk4 carriages built for the ECML have a tilt profile?

The mk4 had a complex gestation having originated specification wise from the ATP-S project. The initial intention was for a follow on order to be placed for WCML usage (with tilt) , but by the time production started BR had moved onto the idea of designing a 26m long mk5 coach without tilt for the WCML.

 

[richieb1971]

Won't MK4 ECML stock require tilting to go 140mph? I know the curves are lighter, but the extra speed may require it.

 

[Aictos]

Won't MK4 ECML stock require tilting to go 140mph? I know the curves are lighter, but the extra speed may require it.

I don't see why because when they were testing them at 140mph between Peterborough and Grantham with flashing green aspects on the signals (Which were put in and only applied to the Class 91s as it indicated to the driver that he could increase his speed to 140mph) I don't think there's many if any curves on that route.