First West of England (Bristol, Bath & The West)

[carlberry]

FFS!!! Mind you, agree the comments are very funny in the main.

So essentially, two buses don't collide as they are skilfully driven by professionals whilst a person films it with an illegally held cameraphone and then gets scared as she hadn't realised the angle a driver in the Eclipse had to take.

It's scary that somebody sends in evidence of their illegal use of a phone whilst in charge of a car thinking it's an example of other peoples bad driving!

 

[-Colly405-]

It's fine for the city centre, but the 73 is the only service that serves both of the two railway stations, so that's where the issue lies. The 70 has just been altered to only serve Temple Meads between 2000 and 0000. And the 72 is not much better as it serves Cotham and Redland first.

I don't get the need for this. Why is there a need for a bus to serve both TM and BPW? Nobody in their right mind would get the bus between the two when there are regular trains that only take around 10 minutes. And if you arrive in Bristol by train and want to get to the City Centre, then you can get bus from TM instead of Parkway, as everywhere that has trains to Parkway has trains at a similar or better frequency to TM (other than west of Cardiff)

 

[ValleyLines142]

I don't get the need for this. Why is there a need for a bus to serve both TM and BPW? Nobody in their right mind would get the bus between the two when there are regular trains that only take around 10 minutes. And if you arrive in Bristol by train and want to get to the City Centre, then you can get bus from TM instead of Parkway, as everywhere that has trains to Parkway has trains at a similar or better frequency to TM (other than west of Cardiff)

From what I understand, I think what WelshBluebird is saying on Post #21097 is that anyone living on or near to Filton Avenue or Gloucester Road now has a reduced service to either of the two stations; its nothing to do with having a direct link between the two by bus but to get to either of them will now be harder with only the 73 operating. This time last year there was the 70, 71 and the 73, as well as the 72 but as I said in my last post it is a much longer route.

On a slightly unrelated note, when my cousin and I went to see Jessie J last week in the O2 Academy, we decided that as Filton was closed, we'd get a train to Parkway and get the 73 into the centre of Bristol, as whilst there were regular rail replacement buses, they would only have operated to Temple Meads and we still would have had to either walk or get the 8 from there to the centre anyway.

 

[WelshBluebird]

Another 'have a go at First day.' The Bath Chronicle reporting how two buses, a U2 and a 5, 'missed each other by inches' in a 'very scarey' incident when they passed on a narrow section of road in Twerton. All this filmed on a phone and presumably passed to the paper who then involved a spokesperson from First. Pathetic! I suppose if this had been say a brewery delivery lorry and a furniture removal van trying to pass each other it wouldn't have made a hot news story. There's some good comments though. Moan over!!

Based on comments on local Facebook groups, I think there are two reasons why it's made a story:

1. As I am sure you know, the route the number 5 takes was changed last year in response to buses struggling to pass each other in the same area. From comments at the time this never used to a problem but has become one due to increased car parking on the road in the area. This was covered in the local media too, though I don't THAT much was made of it. But I guess the same thing happening again has ruffled some feathers.
2. Again as you know, the U2 bus route was changed to run through this area a few months ago which reintroduced the problem above. What I think is actually causing the complaining now though is the the U2 is mainly a student service, and there is a lot of local hostility to students in the Twerton area - basically students and the universities seem to get blamed for everything. I suspect if this had been two 5's making the same maneuver, even considering point 1, it wouldn't have been as much of a story either. There has also been a fair bit of complaining about some of the school buses being canned, with the U2 tacking their places, but with school kids struggling to travel due to number of students using the buses and the poor reliability of them (though I think both of those issues have gone away now) and about the U2 being double deckers, so I suspect part of this is also a general whinge about the U2.

I don't get the need for this. Why is there a need for a bus to serve both TM and BPW? Nobody in their right mind would get the bus between the two when there are regular trains that only take around 10 minutes. And if you arrive in Bristol by train and want to get to the City Centre, then you can get bus from TM instead of Parkway, as everywhere that has trains to Parkway has trains at a similar or better frequency to TM (other than west of Cardiff)

Basically what DanTrainMan says below. If you live on or near the 73 route at the moment, you have a pretty good link to either station. Ok the services do often get caught up in the general Bristol traffic, and the odd bus gets canned at the centre (either due to traffic or driver issues) but the options are there. By removing a quarter of the buses the 73 provides, you not only reduce the usefulness of the service but also increase the chance that you will be caught with a service terminating early. Add that to the points I made of getting from Temple Meads to some places (as the 73 is the main bus someone from Temple Meads heading to Stokes Croft / Cheltenham Road / Gloucester Road would use) and from Parkway to town (as the 73 is the only regular bus for that route).

From what I understand, I think what WelshBluebird is saying on Post #21097 is that anyone living on or near to Filton Avenue or Gloucester Road now has a reduced service to either of the two stations; its nothing to do with having a direct link between the two by bus but to get to either of them will now be harder with only the 73 operating. This time last year there was the 70, 71 and the 73, as well as the 72 but as I said in my last post it is a much longer route.

On a slightly unrelated note, when my cousin and I went to see Jessie J last week in the O2 Academy, we decided that as Filton was closed, we'd get a train to Parkway and get the 73 into the centre of Bristol, as whilst there were regular rail replacement buses, they would only have operated to Temple Meads and we still would have had to either walk or get the 8 from there to the centre anyway.

Exactly this. The Temple Meads end used to have pretty good links but that has been cut pretty heavily lately, and the Parkway end only has the 73 as a choice anyway.

And that has been my experience recently too during the Filton Bank blockade, I've been using the 73 to get from town to Parkway and back and it is easier than faffing around with the replacement buses, getting to Temple Meads then having to get from Temple Meads into town properly. Of course it does depend where in town you are going, but for a lot of the city, Temple Meads just is not well located so being able to get the 73 from Parkway into town was very useful.

Most of the time the time taken by the 73 means any benefit is negated, but if it is easier / quicker to get a train to Parkway (either because of location, or because of replacement buses) or your destination is a distance away from Temple Meads, then the 73 can be a good alternative (that will be made less useful if the frequency is reduced thanks to a separate service that won't even call at Parkway!)

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

Based on comments on local Facebook groups, I think there are two reasons why it's made a story:

1. As I am sure you know, the route the number 5 takes was changed last year in response to buses struggling to pass each other in the same area. From comments at the time this never used to a problem but has become one due to increased car parking on the road in the area. This was covered in the local media too, though I don't THAT much was made of it. But I guess the same thing happening again has ruffled some feathers.
2. Again as you know, the U2 bus route was changed to run through this area a few months ago which reintroduced the problem above. What I think is actually causing the complaining now though is the the U2 is mainly a student service, and there is a lot of local hostility to students in the Twerton area - basically students and the universities seem to get blamed for everything. I suspect if this had been two 5's making the same maneuver, even considering point 1, it wouldn't have been as much of a story either. There has also been a fair bit of complaining about some of the school buses being canned, with the U2 tacking their places, but with school kids struggling to travel due to number of students using the buses and the poor reliability of them (though I think both of those issues have gone away now) and about the U2 being double deckers, so I suspect part of this is also a general whinge about the U2.

Basically what DanTrainMan says below. If you live on or near the 73 route at the moment, you have a pretty good link to either station. Ok the services do often get caught up in the general Bristol traffic, and the odd bus gets canned at the centre (either due to traffic or driver issues) but the options are there. By removing a quarter of the buses the 73 provides, you not only reduce the usefulness of the service but also increase the chance that you will be caught with a service terminating early. Add that to the points I made of getting from Temple Meads to some places (as the 73 is the main bus someone from Temple Meads heading to Stokes Croft / Cheltenham Road / Gloucester Road would use) and from Parkway to town (as the 73 is the only regular bus for that route).



Exactly this. The Temple Meads end used to have pretty good links but that has been cut pretty heavily lately, and the Parkway end only has the 73 as a choice anyway.

And that has been my experience recently too during the Filton Bank blockade, I've been using the 73 to get from town to Parkway and back and it is easier than faffing around with the replacement buses, getting to Temple Meads then having to get from Temple Meads into town properly. Of course it does depend where in town you are going, but for a lot of the city, Temple Meads just is not well located so being able to get the 73 from Parkway into town was very useful.

Most of the time the time taken by the 73 means any benefit is negated, but if it is easier / quicker to get a train to Parkway (either because of location, or because of replacement buses) or your destination is a distance away from Temple Meads, then the 73 can be a good alternative (that will be made less useful if the frequency is reduced thanks to a separate service that won't even call at Parkway!)

The U2 is cheap shot/low grade journalism - to be honest, it's a non story. Then you mix in the issues with the U2 of which much of the problem is to do with BaNES not supplying buses when Culverhay closed. First's travails were very handy for the council in that respect.

As regards the 73, don't argue with anything you say. I guess the issue is that the m1 (and t1) will abstract trade from Sadly into town and so how is that going to impact the 73 and bums on seats? Clearly, the extension to Temple Meads for the 70 being cut saves the PVR and, in addition, saves drivers and they've clearly done some calculations. That said, I was always told that a move from 15 to 20 mins is the difference between "turn up and travel" and going out for a specific journey!

 

[WelshBluebird]

The U2 is cheap shot/low grade journalism - to be honest, it's a non story. Then you mix in the issues with the U2 of which much of the problem is to do with BaNES not supplying buses when Culverhay closed. First's travails were very handy for the council in that respect.

I know there is at least one Bath Live / Bath Chronicle (whatever you want to call them!) on one of the Twerton local Facebook groups, so I suspect that is where the story came from, and I think it was probably the local issues with buses and the U2 in particular which is what caused the post on the FB group to get as much attention as it did, which is why the local media picked it up (you see the same with most of these "X Live" local paper sites now, half their "news" articles are things picked from Facebook or Twitter).

As regards the 73, don't argue with anything you say. I guess the issue is that the m1 (and t1) will abstract trade from Sadly into town and so how is that going to impact the 73 and bums on seats? Clearly, the extension to Temple Meads for the 70 being cut saves the PVR and, in addition, saves drivers and they've clearly done some calculations. That said, I was always told that a move from 15 to 20 mins is the difference between "turn up and travel" and going out for a specific journey!

I'd love to see some actual numbers on journeys along the routes of the 70/72/73. At least in my experience, the buses pick up and drop off a hell of a lot at Temple Meads, and then along Stokes Croft up to Filton Avenue. So much so I really still don't see how the M1 is going to affect these services at all. Of course, I have never actually used any of the services into UWE, or past Parkway up to Bradley Stoke and Cribbs, so I can't comment on the usage of existing services up to there, which is why I'd love to see the actual numbers!

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

I think it was probably the local issues with buses and the U2 in particular which is what caused the post on the FB group to get as much attention as it did, which is why the local media picked it up (you see the same with most of these "X Live" local paper sites now, half their "news" articles are things picked from Facebook or Twitter).

Very true - that and people wanting their 5 mins of fame. Frankly, they should be embarrassed to be "scared".

I really still don't see how the M1 is going to affect these services at all. Of course, I have never actually used any of the services into UWE, or past Parkway up to Bradley Stoke and Cribbs, so I can't comment on the usage of existing services up to there, which is why I'd love to see the actual numbers!

I know what you're saying but we're not going to see them The m1 will abstract some trade around Bradley Stoke into the city centre but that's about it. However, is that enough to justify dropping the 73? Of course, had the m1 served Parkway as it was supposed to, then that would also have explained things and justified something like a 15 min headway (TM to Parkway) with half hourly extensions to Sadly. I'm still perplexed as to why the m1 can't serve Parkway - sorting out the turn by the taxi rank and the lanes at the rear entrance doesn't appear to be a major undertaking (or am I getting all a bit FBB)?

Has there been any other hints to service changes in South Bristol from the m1 appearing? The 90 seems like the most obvious candidate. Also, there was some talk of the Long Ashton to Hengrove metrobus appearing - that gone quiet?

 

[freetoview33]

Very true - that and people wanting their 5 mins of fame. Frankly, they should be embarrassed to be "scared".



I know what you're saying but we're not going to see them The m1 will abstract some trade around Bradley Stoke into the city centre but that's about it. However, is that enough to justify dropping the 73? Of course, had the m1 served Parkway as it was supposed to, then that would also have explained things and justified something like a 15 min headway (TM to Parkway) with half hourly extensions to Sadly. I'm still perplexed as to why the m1 can't serve Parkway - sorting out the turn by the taxi rank and the lanes at the rear entrance doesn't appear to be a major undertaking (or am I getting all a bit FBB)?

Has there been any other hints to service changes in South Bristol from the m1 appearing? The 90 seems like the most obvious candidate. Also, there was some talk of the Long Ashton to Hengrove metrobus appearing - that gone quiet?

This is the reason I think metrobus was poorly planned. I also think it's mad introducing the M1 at a 10 min frequency. Because in 3 years when the cribbs extension opens it's likely the route through sadly will have it's frequency dropped.

 

[Dhassell]

Another day... Another article slating First Bus...

First Bus caught misleading passengers about who runs Bristol's buses

https://www.bristolpost.co.uk/news/bristol-news/first-bus-caught-misleading-passengers-2247683

 

[goldisgood]

Another day... Another article slating First Bus...


https://www.bristolpost.co.uk/news/bristol-news/first-bus-caught-misleading-passengers-2247683

Seriously... the person tweeting likely made a mistake, which is going to happen when the twitter responses are from the other side of the country (I think Leeds or Norwich aren't they?). First have apologised, I'm not sure how this is newsworthy? 'Bus company employee makes accidental mistake'

 

[ValleyLines142]

So where does the U3 go? Is it the same route as the old X74/UWE Express?

 

[freetoview33]

So where does the U3 go? Is it the same route as the old X74/UWE Express?

Yes. Although it will be replaced by the m1 in January which will use the new m32 bus junction.

 

[-Colly405-]

I know what you're saying but we're not going to see them The m1 will abstract some trade around Bradley Stoke into the city centre but that's about it. However, is that enough to justify dropping the 73? Of course, had the m1 served Parkway as it was supposed to, then that would also have explained things and justified something like a 15 min headway (TM to Parkway) with half hourly extensions to Sadly. I'm still perplexed as to why the m1 can't serve Parkway - sorting out the turn by the taxi rank and the lanes at the rear entrance doesn't appear to be a major undertaking (or am I getting all a bit FBB)?

I might be wrong, and I can't find any of the old metrobus (or, as it was back then, Metrobus!) maps, but I'm fairly sure that the m1 was never going to serve Parkway, but there was going to be a service from Emersons that would. I do think, though, that diverting the m1 via Parkway would add an unreasonable amount to the journey, but the whole Parkway situation could be resolved by running buses through the west car park (a la rail replacement) and back to the bus stops...

So where does the U3 go? Is it the same route as the old X74/UWE Express?

On and beyond the M32, yes. In town, it is the same as the m3.

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

I might be wrong, and I can't find any of the old metrobus (or, as it was back then, Metrobus!) maps, but I'm fairly sure that the m1 was never going to serve Parkway, but there was going to be a service from Emersons that would. I do think, though, that diverting the m1 via Parkway would add an unreasonable amount to the journey, but the whole Parkway situation could be resolved by running buses through the west car park (a la rail replacement) and back to the bus stops...

It was - see https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-bristol-31960936 - however, the earlier incarnations were for BPW to have a dedicated service rather than being a divert. As I said before, it really shouldn't be so onerous to come up Hunts Ground past the back of Nuffield gym and the open car parks, sort out the barriers/lanes, then run into the back of BPW and then past the 20 min kiss and ride car park. Appreciate the left turn isn't manageable so just punch an access through the refuge area to the right of the taxi rank.

 

[freetoview33]

The metrobus services had many incarnations, the current routes only came into being very late in the day. Early last year the plan was still very different!

SBL: Temple Meads - Centre - SS Great Britain - Long Ashton Park & Ride - Highridge - Hengrove Park (Every 20 mins)
X47: Temple Meads - Centre - SS Great Britain - Long Ashton Park & Ride (Every 5/10 mins)
X90: Cribbs Causeway - Bradley Stoke - U.W.E - Centre - Bedminster - Knowle - Hengrove Park (Every 10 mins)
X91: Parkway - U.W.E - Hambrook - Lyde Green - Emersons Green (Every 20 mins)
X92: Emersons Green - Lyde Green - Hambrook - U.W.E - Centre (Every 20 mins)
X93: Emersons Green - Lyde Green - Hambrook - Centre - Bedminster - Knowle - Hengrove Park (Every 20 mins)

So the
X90 became the M1
X49 became the M2
X92 became the M3

 

[father_jack]

Mendip Explorer 69xxx single deck vehicle on an outbound 43 around 1500 today.

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

The metrobus services had many incarnations, the current routes only came into being very late in the day. Early last year the plan was still very different!

SBL: Temple Meads - Centre - SS Great Britain - Long Ashton Park & Ride - Highridge - Hengrove Park (Every 20 mins)
X47: Temple Meads - Centre - SS Great Britain - Long Ashton Park & Ride (Every 5/10 mins)
X90: Cribbs Causeway - Bradley Stoke - U.W.E - Centre - Bedminster - Knowle - Hengrove Park (Every 10 mins)
X91: Parkway - U.W.E - Hambrook - Lyde Green - Emersons Green (Every 20 mins)
X92: Emersons Green - Lyde Green - Hambrook - U.W.E - Centre (Every 20 mins)
X93: Emersons Green - Lyde Green - Hambrook - Centre - Bedminster - Knowle - Hengrove Park (Every 20 mins)

So the
X90 became the M1
X49 became the M2
X92 became the M3

Think that plan is a little older - the link I posted had just the three routes and that was 2015.

Mendip Explorer 69xxx single deck vehicle on an outbound 43 around 1500 today.

Meanwhile 30875 has been working off Wells depot giving some lucky souls a nice uncomfortable trip

 

[D2007wsm]

Details of the Christmas and New Year Services are available online at https://www.firstgroup.com/bristol-...es/christmas-and-new-year-bus-services-201819.

Interestingly, the 376, X1 and X7 are running on Boxing Day but not on New Years Day.

 

[freetoview33]

Personally I would have done the following.

M1: Cribbs Causeway - Aztec West - Bradley Stoke - U.W.E - Centre - Bedminster - Knowle - Hengrove Park (Every 30 mins)
M2: Cribbs Causeway - Filton - Parkway - U.W.E - Centre - Bedminster - Knowle - Hengrove Park (Every 30 mins)
M3:
M4: Thornbury - Almondsbury - Aztec West - Bradley Stoke - Centre (Every 30 mins)
M5: Emersons Green - Lyde Green - Hambrook - U.W.E - Centre (Every 30 mins)
M6: Temple Meads - Centre - SS Great Britain - Long Ashton Park & Ride (Every 20 mins - Up to every 10 in peak)
M7: Temple Meads - Centre - SS Great Britain - Long Ashton Park & Ride - Highridge - Hengrove Park (Every 20 mins)

Think that plan is a little older - the link I posted had just the three routes and that was 2015.



Meanwhile 30875 has been working off Wells depot giving some lucky souls a nice uncomfortable trip

https://www.sitesplus.co.uk/user_docs/952/File/MetroBus 8 Feb 17.pdf

published feb 2017

 

[carlberry]

Personally I would have done the following.

M1: Cribbs Causeway - Aztec West - Bradley Stoke - U.W.E - Centre - Bedminster - Knowle - Hengrove Park (Every 30 mins)
M2: Cribbs Causeway - Filton - Parkway - U.W.E - Centre - Bedminster - Knowle - Hengrove Park (Every 30 mins)
M3:
M4: Thornbury - Almondsbury - Aztec West - Bradley Stoke - Centre (Every 30 mins)
M5: Emersons Green - Lyde Green - Hambrook - U.W.E - Centre (Every 30 mins)
M6: Temple Meads - Centre - SS Great Britain - Long Ashton Park & Ride (Every 20 mins - Up to every 10 in peak)
M7: Temple Meads - Centre - SS Great Britain - Long Ashton Park & Ride - Highridge - Hengrove Park (Every 20 mins)
published feb 2017

As long as you use Metrobus spec vehicles you still can!

 

[carlberry]

Details of the Christmas and New Year Services are available online at https://www.firstgroup.com/bristol-...es/christmas-and-new-year-bus-services-201819.

Interestingly, the 376, X1 and X7 are running on Boxing Day but not on New Years Day.

One of those services may still be running on the day!

 

[Private Baxter]

Details of the Christmas and New Year Services are available online at https://www.firstgroup.com/bristol-...es/christmas-and-new-year-bus-services-201819.

Interestingly, the 376, X1 and X7 are running on Boxing Day but not on New Years Day.

That's a first for the 376. Wonder how it will do. It seems more and more Boxing Day services are creeping in each year.
As for NYD, looks similar to this year. Not sure why 376 doesn't run, but this will be at least the third year running. This year a free heritage bus service took its place!

 

[carlberry]

It was - see https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-bristol-31960936 - however, the earlier incarnations were for BPW to have a dedicated service rather than being a divert. As I said before, it really shouldn't be so onerous to come up Hunts Ground past the back of Nuffield gym and the open car parks, sort out the barriers/lanes, then run into the back of BPW and then past the 20 min kiss and ride car park. Appreciate the left turn isn't manageable so just punch an access through the refuge area to the right of the taxi rank.

I suspect that the operator would want quite a bit of work to improve sightlines round the corners, as well as the bumps removed (to operate a frequent service, not just rail replacement buses) and network rail wont want that much work happening at the same time as all the rail replacements going on. Perhaps Filton Bank is complete and electrification is live past Newport.

 

[carlberry]

That's a first for the 376. Wonder how it will do. It seems more and more Boxing Day services are creeping in each year.
As for NYD, looks similar to this year. Not sure why 376 doesn't run, but this will be at least the third year running. This year a free heritage bus service took its place!

It needs Wells depot to be open and, I assume, the costs dont add up. Having said that there were some serious loads on the freebie services!

 

[Whiteway215]

Unusual vehicle on the 173 then 172 this evening. 30875 left Bath well loaded at around 17-30. Should have been an interesting trip over the Mendips seeing it was in the scrap compound at Penzance in the summer!

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

It needs Wells depot to be open and, I assume, the costs dont add up. Having said that there were some serious loads on the freebie services!

How many of the passengers on the freebie services were enthusiasts?

The Boxing Day services benefit from the sales. NYD is a lot quieter generally.

 

[Luk3y]

New metrobus spotted at the factory https://flic.kr/p/2d7quen

 

[carlberry]

How many of the passengers on the freebie services were enthusiasts?

At a guess from memory about a third. The one I did dropped about 20 passengers at Temple Meads, with several suitcases! (Possibly annoyed a few taxi companies!).

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

Personally I would have done the following.

M1: Cribbs Causeway - Aztec West - Bradley Stoke - U.W.E - Centre - Bedminster - Knowle - Hengrove Park (Every 30 mins)
M2: Cribbs Causeway - Filton - Parkway - U.W.E - Centre - Bedminster - Knowle - Hengrove Park (Every 30 mins)
M3:
M4: Thornbury - Almondsbury - Aztec West - Bradley Stoke - Centre (Every 30 mins)
M5: Emersons Green - Lyde Green - Hambrook - U.W.E - Centre (Every 30 mins)
M6: Temple Meads - Centre - SS Great Britain - Long Ashton Park & Ride (Every 20 mins - Up to every 10 in peak)
M7: Temple Meads - Centre - SS Great Britain - Long Ashton Park & Ride - Highridge - Hengrove Park (Every 20 mins)

https://www.sitesplus.co.uk/user_docs/952/File/MetroBus 8 Feb 17.pdf

published feb 2017

The five routes diagram was earlier I think.

The revised one with the three routes was definitely around by late 2014 as per http://www.bradleystokejournal.co.u...planning-application-green-light-councillors/

I’d quite like, as I’d said before, to have a Weston metrobus route to use the Long Ashton to town route but it’s tricky with the Excel interworking.

 

[D2007wsm]

It needs Wells depot to be open and, I assume, the costs dont add up. Having said that there were some serious loads on the freebie services!

They may run them from Lawrence Hill or Hengrove, as has been done in previous years. Last year the X3/X3A/X4 ran from Lawrence Hill using Weston Drivers, as I believe the 39 did with Bath Drivers. With Lawrence Hill providing maintenance support for everything.

The only buses which came out of Weston Depot was the 2 Streetlites for the A3, with supervisory and maintenance support provided by Bristol. The drivers had their meal breaks and driver change overs at the Airport rather than Weston.

This is the first year I've ever known the X1 to run on Boxing Day, though up until a few years ago New Years Day was generally a Sunday service with the 353/W1 taking the reins.