Surreytraveller
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- 21 Oct 2009
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- 2,810
You can still get to the slow lines even from Platform 2This was a Gatwick, first stop Purley.
You can still get to the slow lines even from Platform 2This was a Gatwick, first stop Purley.
A power outage in Sussex really shouldn't affect other lines in and out of a central London Terminus like Victoria. It's probably 20-25 miles away! Thats a huge distance in London power infrastructure terms. If it was a signalling failure in Sussex, the signalling control is concentrated in one physically remote place that is covering much too wide an area to be able to react locally and mitigate, if not resolve, the stuck train issues. I have a lot of sympathy for those many Gatwick Express customers I saw piled up on the Gat-Ex platforms - their flights won't wait for them. But that is just one line, not the only route out of Victoria and plenty of routes diverge many miles before Gatwick/3 Bridges. The whole efficiency versus effectiveness thing has just gone way too far on the railway and it is costing the railway dearly.I sincerely hope you are not serious with those questions.
A power outage in Sussex really shouldn't affect other lines in and out of a central London Terminus like Victoria. It's probably 20-25 miles away! Thats a huge distance in London power infrastructure terms. If it was a signalling failure in Sussex, the signalling control is concentrated in one physically remote place that is covering much too wide an area to be able to react locally and mitigate, if not resolve, the stuck train issues. I have a lot of sympathy for those many Gatwick Express customers I saw piled up on the Gat-Ex platforms - their flights won't wait for them. But that is just one line, not the only route out of Victoria and plenty of routes diverge many miles before Gatwick/3 Bridges. The whole efficiency versus effectiveness thing has just gone way too far on the railway and it is costing the railway dearly.
I know, I was simply saying it was unusual, not impossible or unique.You can still get to the slow lines even from Platform 2
A power outage in Sussex really shouldn't affect other lines in and out of a central London Terminus like Victoria. It's probably 20-25 miles away! Thats a huge distance in London power infrastructure terms. If it was a signalling failure in Sussex, the signalling control is concentrated in one physically remote place that is covering much too wide an area to be able to react locally and mitigate, if not resolve, the stuck train issues. I have a lot of sympathy for those many Gatwick Express customers I saw piled up on the Gat-Ex platforms - their flights won't wait for them. But that is just one line, not the only route out of Victoria and plenty of routes diverge many miles before Gatwick/3 Bridges. The whole efficiency versus effectiveness thing has just gone way too far on the railway and it is costing the railway dearly.
Possibly, but it is going to continue unabated with even wider areas covered remotely. Society becomes evermore dependant on automation and computer control - it's inevitable. Only a total change in train control protocol in ways I can't imagine could change this. Manual or local control is gone forever.A power outage in Sussex really shouldn't affect other lines in and out of a central London Terminus like Victoria. It's probably 20-25 miles away! Thats a huge distance in London power infrastructure terms. If it was a signalling failure in Sussex, the signalling control is concentrated in one physically remote place that is covering much too wide an area to be able to react locally and mitigate, if not resolve, the stuck train issues. I have a lot of sympathy for those many Gatwick Express customers I saw piled up on the Gat-Ex platforms - their flights won't wait for them. But that is just one line, not the only route out of Victoria and plenty of routes diverge many miles before Gatwick/3 Bridges. The whole efficiency versus effectiveness thing has just gone way too far on the railway and it is costing the railway dearly.
Must have been a newbie then
The Southern / Thameslink network is much worse for reactionary delay that anywhere else on the network...On SWR at least, code black is pretty rare. Code red is used in abundance but black is seldom used.
Passengers were being advised that they could use SWR trains but I guess it depends where you needed to go.Has the cleaning lady trod on the 3-pin plug at Three Bridges ROC ???
Possibly, but it is going to continue unabated with even wider areas covered remotely. Society becomes evermore dependant on automation and computer control - it's inevitable. Only a total change in train control protocol in ways I can't imagine could change this. Manual or local control is gone forever.
Northbound trains currently non stopping Gatwick Airport due to lighting problems.At time of posting, not a single screen working on the concourse at Gatwick.
Most Southbound skipping it too. I take it, this is an unrelated issue to the East Croydon one.Northbound trains currently non stopping Gatwick Airport due to lighting problems.
Northbound trains currently non stopping Gatwick Airport due to lighting problems.
No UPS there then?
Yes...
Yet another UKPN power issue ! think it took the UPS with it when it went !
London Bridge was rubbish this evening. Not a single manual announcement. Every train shown as on time and then just disappeared off the boards as the departure time passed.
Well, obviously! Nothing is infallibleSo I would assume that UPS (Uninterruptible Power Supply) is only good for certain types of "interruption" then? I think they need to change the name!
So I would assume that UPS (Uninterruptible Power Supply) is only good for certain types of "interruption" then? I think they need to change the name!
Thanks for some useful information at last. It sounds like it took out both Gloucester Road and east Croydon interlockings - are these still relay interlockings? Back in the era when these types of relay interlockings were being installed on the Southern, it was usual to obtain the signalling power from the traction substations. So was there an issue with the traction supply?The power failure was in south London, not Sussex. All signalling was lost in an area covering Streatham / Anerley to South and West Croydon. Nothing could run through those areas. We need to be clear - this had nothing to do with the ROC, except that trains in one part of the failed area (Streatham) are controlled from there. Most of the failed area is controlled from Three Bridges ASC. At no point did any of the ROC or ASC systems fail. There would have been the same issue had the area been controlled from local signalboxes at every station, except it would have taken longer to fix, as their electrical protection wouldn’t have been so good.
On SWR at least, code black is pretty rare. Code red is used in abundance but black is seldom used.
I loved the comment from a commuter who, when advised to use alternative routes, replied 'show me a route from London to Brighton that doesn't go through East Croydon.
AIUI there was a power surge which caused all the protecting devices to kick in (as designed) to protect various bits of sensitive kit - interlockings, transmission, etc. This would explain why some UPS went off line, and why some signalling was restored much more quickly than others.
It affected several other interlockings too, all but one of them relays.
Victoria to Horsham via Sutton.
Horsham to Three Bridges
Three Bridges to Brighton
Might be quicker to use a bicycle.