Short faring

[Green2]

Hi all,
I have made a huge mistake and am ashamed of my actions.
I regrettably have been buying tickets to the start and end of my journey in to work 20 times over the last 6 months. 5 of these unknowingly (not that this makes a difference) without a valid railcard. to make matters worse, when caught by a ticket gate inspector I panicked in my state of fear and shock and repeatedly stated my ticket came from the origin the ticket stated. I did give my correct name and address and was told the company would be in touch. Is there any hope for me?
Thanks in advance.

 

[joeneat]

So you only bought a ticket for part of your journey?

 

[Mcr Warrior]

So you only bought a ticket for part of your journey?

Possibly "doughnutting" (i.e. nothing held for the middle bit of the journey) and maybe also claiming railcard discount on occasion without holding a valid railcard.

 

[Kilopylae]

Hi, welcome to the forums. What journey did you make, and what origin and destination were printed on the ticket?

 

[Green2]

Possibly "doughnutting" (i.e. nothing held for the middle bit of the journey) and maybe also claiming railcard discount on occasion without holding a valid railcard.

Yes. That is correct

 

[Mcr Warrior]

One for the forum experts, but could be expensive.

If the ToC is agreeable to an out of court settlement, you may get asked to pay the full anytime fare for each and every journey you made during the six month period, plus a contribution towards the ToC's costs.

 

[Green2]

One for the forum experts, but could be expensive.

If the ToC is agreeable to an out of court settlement, you may get asked to pay the full anytime fare for each and every journey you made during the six month period, plus a contribution towards the ToC's costs.

Thank you. This is what I figured from reading previous posts.
My main fear is a conviction and losing my job/prison. Although I have no other prior offences/penalty fares etc
I had a lapse of judgement for a long time. There is no excuse.

 

[Mcr Warrior]

One now for the forum experts to outline a "least worst" possible way forward for you. Might need to wait to see what the ToC has to say when they get in touch with you in due course.

 

[Tazi Hupefi]

Thank you. This is what I figured from reading previous posts.
My main fear is a conviction and losing my job/prison. Although I have no other prior offences/penalty fares etc
I had a lapse of judgement for a long time. There is no excuse.

You can't go to prison unless you've been convicted at least once (of intentional fare evasion) before, and even then it would take a whole string of convictions before prison even becomes a realistic outcome.

If it goes to court, you'll be fined and ordered to pay costs etc, probably around £500-£700 and a criminal record for your first conviction, assuming you plesd guilty and don't earn too much.

 

[Hadders]

Welcome to the forum.

You will receive a letter from the train company (or an investigation company acting on their behalf) which will probably take a few weeks to arrive saying that they have received a report, are considering prosecuting you and asking for your version of events. It is important that you engage with and reply to this letter. You might want to include the following in your reply:

- That you are sorry for what has happened
- What you have learned from the incident
- That you are keen to settle the matter without the need for court action
- Offer to pay the outstanding fare and the train company's administrative costs in dealing with the matter

Make sure your reply is short and concise, don't give a sob story - they've heard it all before. Most train companies are usually prepared to offer an administrative (commonly known as an out of court settlement) for people who engage with the process and who haven't come to their attention before. There is no guarantee of this, and the fact that you have done this several times means that the train company would be well within their rights to prosecute you in the magistrates court.

If you are offered a settlement the amount varies depending on the train company and circumstances but tend to be a few hundred pounds plus the outstanding fare.

 

[Green2]

Thanks for your advice both.
From reading other threads on here, time is of the essence. I am planning on preparing my letter this week in anticipation of the correspondence from the company as well as a full list of the journeys that were made.

 

[TheJester]

Without giving incriminating information away:
Which TOC (Train Operating Company)
Broadly which stations

 

[T-Karmel]

It's only my guess, but I suppose they could suggest/insist on you doing that journey everyday for a very long time, so if I were you, I'd prepare entire list of those journeys and if you bought them online - all booking confirmations, or bank statements for the account you paid it with if you paid with card at the station etc. As much as you can find to prove you weren't doing that journey everyday. Or if in some occasions you were buying ticket for entire journey, keep record of that as well.

But first thing is surely to await their letter and that might take up to 6 months.

Also, regarding name of that type of journey - where I work down South we call it "sandwich ticket", cause you've got two slices of bread. What is missing is the filling.

 

[Green2]

Without giving incriminating information away:
Which TOC (Train Operating Company)
Broadly which stations

Thameslink is the TOC.
I do not wish to give the stations.

 

[jumble]

Hi all,
I have made a huge mistake and am ashamed of my actions.
I regrettably have been buying tickets to the start and end of my journey in to work 20 times over the last 6 months. 5 of these unknowingly (not that this makes a difference) without a valid railcard. to make matters worse, when caught by a ticket gate inspector I panicked in my state of fear and shock and repeatedly stated my ticket came from the origin the ticket stated. I did give my correct name and address and was told the company would be in touch. Is there any hope for me?
Thanks in advance.

I would suggest not fessing up to doing this multiple times unless anyone asks you about it.
You may find the TOC are only interested in discussing your latest misdemeanour and it would be foolish to correct them.

 

[RPI]

Thameslink is the TOC.
I do not wish to give the stations.

From previous posts on here, Thameslink are generally quite open to settling out of court.

 

[30907]

Thameslink is the TOC.
I do not wish to give the stations.

That's wise.

You may find the TOC are only interested in discussing your latest misdemeanour

Quite so - unless their fraud people have spotted your journey patterns and have the evidence, but at less than one journey a week I would doubt they have done so.

 

[HSP 2]

Hi all,
I have made a huge mistake and am ashamed of my actions.
I regrettably have been buying tickets to the start and end of my journey in to work 20 times over the last 6 months. 5 of these unknowingly (not that this makes a difference) without a valid railcard. to make matters worse, when caught by a ticket gate inspector I panicked in my state of fear and shock and repeatedly stated my ticket came from the origin the ticket stated. I did give my correct name and address and was told the company would be in touch. Is there any hope for me?
Thanks in advance.

Had your railcard ran out? If so this would only be for your last 5 journeys, if you did not realise that your railcard had expired get a new ASAP to prove to the ToC that you are owning up to the point that you did make a mistake.

 

[Green2]

Had your railcard ran out? If so this would only be for your last 5 journeys, if you did not realise that your railcard had expired get a new ASAP to prove to the ToC that you are owning up to the point that you did make a mistake.

This is one of the first things I did after. Is it worth mentioning in my response to the letter they will send?

 

[221129]

This is one of the first things I did after. Is it worth mentioning in my response to the letter they will send?

Not really as it's not relevant.

 

[Green2]

thanks for your replies. For my own peace of mind, what is the likelihood of a settlement? Should I be consulting with a lawyer before my letter comes?

 

[Tazi Hupefi]

thanks for your replies. For my own peace of mind, what is the likelihood of a settlement? Should I be consulting with a lawyer before my letter comes?

No. You shouldn't need legal advice at all to navigate yourself through this, unless there's some extraordinary circumstance applicable to your incident.

 

[Green2]

No. You shouldn't need legal advice at all to navigate yourself through this, unless there's some extraordinary circumstance applicable to your incident.

How long does it normally take for this letter to arrive? It's been almost 3 weeks and I still haven't heard anything!

 

[Fawkes Cat]

How long does it normally take for this letter to arrive? It's been almost 3 weeks and I still haven't heard anything!

It varies - and can be up to six months, because that's the length of time the railway have to decide that they might take someone to court. And bear in mind that Covid has thrown a lot of offices into chaos, so the railway may be behind with their correspondence.

So you can't assume that there's nothing to worry about yet. Give it the full six months - and then a little longer in case the first you hear is a letter from the court (sent after the railway have told the court that they want to prosecute you) - and only then can you be reasonably certain that you're in the clear.

 

[Green2]

It varies - and can be up to six months, because that's the length of time the railway have to decide that they might take someone to court. And bear in mind that Covid has thrown a lot of offices into chaos, so the railway may be behind with their correspondence.

So you can't assume that there's nothing to worry about yet. Give it the full six months - and then a little longer in case the first you hear is a letter from the court (sent after the railway have told the court that they want to prosecute you) - and only then can you be reasonably certain that you're in the clear.

Would it be better to reach out to them now and engage before it reaches the court stage?
I want to settle out of court and keen to sort this issue out asap.

 

[Tazi Hupefi]

Would it be better to reach out to them now and engage before it reaches the court stage?
I want to settle out of court and keen to sort this issue out asap.

You need to wait for them to write to you. They probably haven't even processed your case yet! I imagine there's hundreds of people caught each day which presumably need adding to some sort of database and case management software. They have up to 6 months to deal with this, so just stay calm and wait. You can't really speed it up.

If you're lucky, they could even lose your paperwork and nothing ever arrives!

The court isn't going to get involved unexpectedly, so don't worry about that just yet.

 

[WesternLancer]

Would it be better to reach out to them now and engage before it reaches the court stage?
I want to settle out of court and keen to sort this issue out asap.

Just make sure if you move address in next 6 to 9 months at least you have a postal re-direction in place from Royal Mail. See their website if you need to set one up.

 

[Green2]

Hi all, I am the original poster of this thread. Somebody has been posting the responses that came yesterday and the subsequent thread from this user name. This is not me, I have reported the posts and changed my password. But I just wanted to make it clear the most recent posts and the other thread are NOT from me.

 

[Darandio]

Hi all, I am the original poster of this thread. Somebody has been posting the responses that came yesterday and the subsequent thread from this user name. This is not me, I have reported the posts and changed my password. But I just wanted to make it clear the most recent posts and the other thread are NOT from me.

Just the ones from yesterday? They are in an identical writing style and there is absolutely nothing wrong with what was asked in them. Normally when people 'hack' an account on the internet they use it for nefarious purposes, not to continue asking completely normal questions following the same theme!

 

[Egg Centric]

Just the ones from yesterday? They are in an identical writing style and there is absolutely nothing wrong with what was asked in them. Normally when people 'hack' an account on the internet they use it for nefarious purposes, not to continue asking completely normal questions following the same theme!

Very curious, isn't it?