IET's grounded - what would you run?

[adc82140]

are you seriously asking that question there are plenty of coach companies who usually run coach holidays with spare coaches (less holidays taken rn) why not utilise them

I don't believe drivers are compelled to come in to work with no notice on a Sunday on demand.

 

[py_megapixel]

are you seriously asking that question there are plenty of coach companies who usually run coach holidays with spare coaches (less holidays taken rn) why not utilise them

This has been discussed before. Coach holiday companies have largely furloughed their staff and haven't kept their vehicles ready to go. And even if the staff and vehicles are theoretically available, I doubt drivers want to come in at such short notice on a weekend.

 

[Jamesrob637]

Doubt it. Crew knowledge would be a barrier. Anyway I thought their units where not so badly affected with many cleared for traffic.

Only one Manchester to Redcar has been short-formed today in order to run a Liverpool to Newcastle as 3-car rather than have to cancel it, so not a bad show on TPE.

 

[43096]

Are the XC sets identical to the Castles? Or would they have to be crewed by XC staff?

Not identical, but sliding door design is the same, for example. Close enough that they could be operated by GWR without much difficulty.

 

[RobShipway]

Robbies, obviously

More seriously, yes that is a good point.

It would take too long to train me, anyway I am too far in the South east to be able to be driving trains for either GWR or LNER.

 

[Snow1964]

Could you take the 387s off Heathrow services and temporarily replace them with borrowed (or hired) 345s

Then use the extra 387s to Bristol Parkway even if Didcot-Bristol requires carrying a guard

Clearly not worth it for day or two, but if it might be few weeks before all the trains are rectified then possibly worth looking at

 

[JonathanH]

Could you take the 387s off Heathrow services and temporarily replace them with borrowed (or hired) 345s

Then use the extra 387s to Bristol Parkway even if Didcot-Bristol requires carrying a guard

Clearly not worth it for day or two, but if it might be few weeks before all the trains are rectified then possibly worth looking at

There is no need. If it becomes possible to run 387s west of Didcot, and other comments suggest it isn't yet possible, it is likely that GWR can source their own 387s to do so. There will be a contract between GWR and HEX which requires the HEX 387s to be used where intended. Even from 17 May, GWR are still only running hourly Paddington to Didcot relief line services and fewer services in the peak relative to the full 387 diagrams.

 

[JN114]

GWR are still only running hourly Paddington to Didcot relief line services and fewer services in the peak relative to the full 387 diagrams.

No... GWR are using 30/33 387s in the peaks, the maximum allowed, due to strengthening required for social distancing.

There are no surplus 387s on weekdays - you would have to rob Peter to use the cliche phrase.

Reducing HEx to half hourly would give 2 HEx 8 cars back, but they’d be useless for additional services beyond Didcot as the Swindon drivers who sign beyond Didcot; don’t sign the modified HEx 387s with their very different cab layouts and everything driven through the ETCS Screen. Also I can’t see HEx consenting to their use, although happy to be proven wrong...

 

[cactustwirly]

The most sensible/feasible suggestion is the use of XC HSTs, these are based at Laira so could be used to operate between Reading and Exeter.

LNER are operating a near normal service, with most of their 801s unaffected, so it would make sense to cut LNER services so a few 801s could be borrowed for London to Cardiff services.

Then some northern 150s could be sent down to Bristol to release 166s to be used on Cotswold services and Swindon to Bristol shuttles, maybe cut the Gatwick to Reading services to free up turbos as well.

 

[JN114]

LNER are operating a near normal service, with most of their 801s unaffected, so it would make sense to cut LNER services so a few 801s could be borrowed for London to Cardiff services.

Not a bad idea - non-ATP fitted sets would be limited to 110mph on GWML as that’s what the various non-ATP safety systems are all set up for on the route. (IIRC Voyagers are dispensated Reading to Didcot)

 

[43096]

No... GWR are using 30/33 387s in the peaks, the maximum allowed, due to strengthening required for social distancing.

There are no surplus 387s on weekdays - you would have to rob Peter to use the cliche phrase.

Reducing HEx to half hourly would give 2 HEx 8 cars back, but they’d be useless for additional services beyond Didcot as the Swindon drivers who sign beyond Didcot; don’t sign the modified HEx 387s with their very different cab layouts and everything driven through the ETCS Screen. Also I can’t see HEx consenting to their use, although happy to be proven wrong...

In extremis you could just ditch the Padd-Reading element of the Didcot stoppers, as Crossrail provide a frequent service on the same stretch.

The other option would be to keep 365s on Great Northern and send some of their 387s to GWR temporarily.

 

[warwickshire]

Dft see sense and use x three 143 Pacers on the exmouth lines again.
First group own these units.
Will release 150 and 165 etc elsewhere.
So either then.
165 and 166 onto the cotswolds. Ie Worcester to didcot Parkway. 387 to London. From didcot
Or most likely Cheltenham Spa to didcot Parkway or Swindon which is most convenient. Then 387 to London

 

[SteelWeelApeal]

In extremis you could just ditch the Padd-Reading element of the Didcot stoppers, as Crossrail provide a frequent service on the same stretch.

The other option would be to keep 365s on Great Northern and send some of their 387s to GWR temporarily.

There is also no need for the 387 stoppers to be 8 coaches west of Reading (and probably Slough). Four would more than suffice, at least off peak

 

[adc82140]

Whilst we all know on here why it's not feasible, the public will see Ely full of withdrawn stock and want to know why it's not been brought back. The industry will have to educate quickly on this, and hopefully not be caught on the back foot.

 

[Class 317]

The number of short term options for GWR are quite limited as I see it.

Chiltern may be able to sub lease some class 165's replaced by loco hauled rakes. I believe Chiltern are only operating 1 or 2 class 68 diagrams at the moment so they may be able to sub lease say 3-4 units.

Sleeper day coaches may be able form a short rake during the daytime like in some previous summers freeing up class 158's or a HST from a local diagram in Cornwall. Same may be possible at London end assuming suitability trained staff.

The possibility of sub leasing a small number of some sprinters from other operates might be possible but unlikely to be more than a few available.

Potentially TFL may be able to operate some additional Paddington to Reading services if staff / units are available freeing up additional class 387 for Didcot shuttles.

Given the reduced timetable on West coast Advanti may be able to free up a couple of voyagers to allow xc to help out with extra or strengthened services.

Xc could may also be able to deploy the forth HST diagram as well.

All assumes some of the IET drivers can also drive other units.

 

[HSTEd]

Given that the full Crossrail Service has not commenced, how many surplus Class 345s are there?

Are they cleared on the fast lines to Reading?
Could they be used to run Reading-London shuttles, with passengers changing trains at Reading?

 

[JonathanH]

Are they cleared on the fast lines to Reading?

Yes, 345s can use the main lines between Paddington and Reading, not least when two track railway closes the relief lines.

Could they be used to run Reading-London shuttles, with passengers changing trains at Reading?

90mph maximum. Whether it would actually happen is a different matter.

Given that the full Crossrail Service has not commenced, how many surplus Class 345s are there?

Possibly some - 17 needed on the west side each day - but depends what other plans there are for them with test running in the tunnels due to commence and the transfer of some 9-cars to the East side imminent.

There are certainly no signs of revised schedules for TfL Rail tomorrow and some new activity in the tunnel.

 

[popeter45]

suprised nobody has brought up the idea of using the 180's on the routes they where originally ordered for?

 

[hstsrule]

Well, I think that LNER could run IC225s, GWR could run the Castle Set HSTs, TPE would have to just run 185s or something hauled by a 68 and Hull Trains just can't run any services at all. Note: all of the running services would have to severely reduce services, especially LNER.

 

[D365]

It would take too long to train me, anyway I am too far in the South east to be able to be driving trains for either GWR or LNER.

It was a joke about coach driving.

suprised nobody has brought up the idea of using the 180's on the routes they where originally ordered for?

London to Manchester?

But which 180s do you mean, unless you are suggesting a sub-lease from Grand Central?

 

[galwhv69]

 

[Neptune]

Then some northern 150s could be sent down to Bristol to release 166s to be used on Cotswold services and Swindon to Bristol shuttles, maybe cut the Gatwick to Reading services to free up turbos as well.

That’s the same 150’s that are currently covering for unavailable 195’s due to the yaw damper issue.

 

[cactustwirly]

That’s the same 150’s that are currently covering for unavailable 195’s due to the yaw damper issue.

But they are running as pairs, so these can be split and release a few 150/2s to GWR.

 

[JonathanH]

But they are running as pairs, so these can be split and release a few 150/2s to GWR.

Aren't GWR equally running 150/2s around in pairs around Exeter that could be split - where is the need greatest?

 

[LOL The Irony]

But they are running as pairs, so these can be split and release a few 150/2s to GWR.

Northern have their own rolling stock issues right now and are in no position to help GWR out.

 

[Neptune]

But they are running as pairs, so these can be split and release a few 150/2s to GWR.

The 150/2’s are on the east and rarely run in pairs and are even more stretched with the 195 issues. How about GWR send us some up to help our stock shortage. A problem in the north is always a crisis in the south for some reason.

 

[RPI]

Are the three 143's still at St Philips marsh? Lol!

 

[Killingworth]

In a crisis you consider all possible options. It's a long time ago that British Airways had to ground their entire Trident fleet, at that time operating a significant number of their short haul routes. Lots of cancellations but they covered some of the critical Heathrow flights to Newcastle with Concordes that were not being over worked on their Tranatlantic duties.

Brilliant move. Did wonders for PR and at normal prices they must have been full.

Who knows what imaginative and practical ideas may emerge from this crisis?

Some of the ideas being suggested aren't too far away from bringing Lion out of the museum to run the Titfield Thunderbolt (first Ealing comedy film shot in colour and released in 1953).

 

[yorksrob]

Actually, given that this situation looks likely to last a bit longer than previously thought, it might be worth retraining staff to run things such as the HST's, and the newly refurbished GC mk4's.

The fact that the DfT has asked the industry to source replacement trains suggests this type of medium term solution - they're not going to find examples of their existing fleets 'down the back of the sofa'.

 

[Failed Unit]

If we are looking long term. Could 365s cover London - York as it stops at all shacks (in ECML terms)