South Wales 'Metro' updates

[Tomos y Tanc]

The new TfW website is vague about when specific timetable changes will be implemented on the Core Valley Lines, and I noticed that the CVL was left out of the recent announcement of revised TT changes over the next few years.

South Wales Metro | Transport for Wales

Transport for Wales | Buy Cheap Train Tickets and Check Train Times

tfw.wales

I'd have thought that it's highly likely that initially the tram/trains will operate the current timetable alongside DMUs. That way testing, driver training etc can take place without major service disruption.

The alternative 'big bang' approach would probably involve quite a lengthy closure of the network between the end of the current diesel operation and the start of the new tram/train operated timetable.

 

[Cardiff123]

I'd have thought that it's highly likely that initially the tram/trains will operate the current timetable alongside DMUs. That way testing, driver training etc can take place without major service disruption.

It's not just highly likely, it's inevitable. The Taff Valley lines via Pontypridd will all be wired first, then the Rhymney line will be done. So the tram-trains will come into service first before the Stadler Flirts. We'll have the tram-trains running on the Pontypridd lines alongside the last of the 150s running on Rhymney to Penarth / Barry / Vale of Glam until the Rhymney line is wired. Unless of course the Flirts are introduced on the Rhymney line before it's fully wired, running on diesel.

 

[John R]

alongside the last of the 150s running on Rhymney to Penarth / Barry / Vale of Glam until the Rhymney line is wired. Unless of course the Flirts are introduced on the Rhymney line before it's fully wired, running on diesel.

You'd think that once the stock is available, TfW would want to use it asap, even if on diesel. The press would have a field day if they weren't being used when they could be. And financially, better to send stock off lease when you can.

 

[Envoy]

Vale of Glamorgan Council are running a consultation regarding imnprovements at Barry Docks Railway Station:> Barry-Docks-Transport-Interchange.aspx

The aim of the proposed Barry Docks Transport Interchange is to provide a bus and taxi interchange, enhance station access and facilities to accommodate increasing numbers of people using an increased number of trains, each with increased seating capacity, which will stop at Barry Docks Station from 2023 onwards.

Most of the car parking spaces that you see on the plan are already in place as part of the Council’s Dock Offices staff parking. It looks to me that not enough parking provision is being made for rail users along with few electric car charging stations. All well and good to encourage people to use public transport but the plain fact is that without easy parking by Metro stations, some people will make their entire commute by car. (Some people won’t walk more than about 8 minutes).

 

[CardiffKid]

I notice that Queen Street has had a significant paint job applied to it. There isn’t a single spec of turquoise left and all the signage has the red/orange branding previously only seen at Llandaf and Radyr.

I had thought the red/orange design was a early design that had been changed.

Is the red/orange likley to be Metro branding (with the red reserved for mainline stations)?

 

[WesternBiker]

Most of the car parking spaces that you see on the plan are already in place as part of the Council’s Dock Offices staff parking. It looks to me that not enough parking provision is being made for rail users along with few electric car charging stations.

I agree completely. The line to Barry Island is noticeable for poor parking provision at most of its stations. The car park at Barry (town) was often completely full pre-pandemic.

But the whole area around Barry Docks station needs radical improvement: with the disused building adjacent to it, the access path is quite creepy late at night.

 

[Envoy]

I notice that Queen Street has had a significant paint job applied to it. There isn’t a single spec of turquoise left and all the signage has the red/orange branding previously only seen at Llandaf and Radyr.

I had thought the red/orange design was a early design that had been changed.

Is the red/orange likley to be Metro branding (with the red reserved for mainline stations)?

Perhaps they ought to paint the word ‘METRO' on all the railway bridges on the system in order to get the message across that an upgraded transport system is coming?

 

[59CosG95]

The "Work In Your Area" dashboard site now lists piling between Pontypridd & Radyr from 16/10/2021 to 01/04/2022.

 

[John R]

Seems a long time for 7 miles?

 

[Cardiff123]

Deleted

 

[Tomos y Tanc]

Work is starting on the Pontypridd - Merthyr section.

The railway line between Merthyr Tydfil and Pontypridd will be closed between Saturday 23 October and Wednesday 27 October to allow engineering work to take place, as part of preparations for the introduction of brand new electric tram-trains. Replacement bus services will be in operation between Merthyr Tydfil and Pontypridd.

The closure will allow engineers to carry out complex work including repositioning signals, installing and testing new equipment, devegetation, realigning the track, and installing the overhead line equipment system.

https://news.tfw.wales/news/south-wales-metro-work-to-continue-in-merthyr-tydfil

 

[Starmill]

The trouble is that things like electrification are outwith the control of the Welsh Government. They're aspirations rather than plans, not that there's anything wrong with having aspirations.

It's still possible for rail infrastructure outside of the core valleys to be devolved from the Department for Transport to Transport for Wales, but as you say not currently.

 

[edwin_m]

While l agree the main thrust of your argument there is a certain irony in English nationalism being portrayed as a bad thing while Welsh and Scottish nationalism is fine.

I think the point here is that the government that's run by English Nationalists has various powers over Scotland, Wales and NI. The nationalists in other nations generally only influence their own affairs.

 

[cjp4]

A few more new maps on the TFW site, including the cross Cardiff Bay line now being shown as an "Emerging Priority to 2029" suggesting this has moved from Cardiff Council aspiration to a TFW/Welsh Gov one.
South Wales Metro: Future developments | Transport for Wales (tfw.wales)

Ebbw Vale line also highlighted with the branch to Abertillery and extension of the Aberdare line up Hirwaun way.

What's missing though is quite interesting, the north-west corridor is described as bus corridor. So no rail line planned any time soon.

 

[snowball]

I think the point here is that the government that's run by English Nationalists has various powers over Scotland, Wales and NI.

and seems to want to extend them to or beyond their limits, by threatening to build roads in Wales and Scotland that have been regarded since devolution as outside UK govt responsibility, including the M4 Newport bypass that the Welsh govt has explicitly decided against.

 

[Cardiff123]

Ok let's not get into politics and bring roads into the discussion. The M4 debate has been done to death and is off topic here.
My point was that Cameron's (and to a certain extent) May's UK Governments were centre-right and open to progressive devolution to Wales, hence we saw the Core Valley Lines devolved under Cameron's and May's Conservative government's. I doubt even the CVL would be devolved to Wales under the current UK Govt if the Welsh Govt asked for it.

Welsh Govt want full control of rail infrastructure devolved to Wales (as it is in Scotland) so they can progress rail enhancement schemes that UK govt show no interest in, even though it's UK Govt's responsibility through Network Rail to enhance the rail network in Wales, as it not devolved. So what we see is Welsh Govt getting hold of what it can to get projects done (eg. the CVL) and taking money from other budgets to give to NR to get schemes done it sees as vital, eg. Ebbw Vale enhancements.

Stephen Crabb was actually a pragmatic UK Govt Welsh Secretary, and helped to get the CVL devolved to Welsh Govt. He himself recently called for the full control of rail infrastructure in Wales to be devolved to Welsh Govt in a recent Welsh Affairs Select Committee UK Parliament report.
Simon Hart on the other hand acts more like an imperial viceroy taking orders from above, taking every opportunity to argue with Welsh Govt.

 

[Wolfie]

I think the point here is that the government that's run by English Nationalists has various powers over Scotland, Wales and NI. The nationalists in other nations generally only influence their own affairs.

Currently that is so. Previously Scots and Welsh MPs imposed things solely on England e.g. student loans.

To be clear l am talking on a factual basis and not expressing any personal views.

I would be surprised if it doesn't get done under GBR, in order to show how it serves the whole country. They'll have to finish off the rest of the GWML regardless.

That seems highly likely and eminently sensible.

 

[CardiffKid]

Am I the only person who can’t see anything concrete that’s new?

Lots of reanouncing of existing/known plans and yet more aspirations.

Apologies for being the grumpy old (well 36yr) synic, but is there any *news* in today’s announcement?

 

[yorkie]

If we can stay away from politics and speculation in this thread, that would be appreciated.

People are welcome to discuss politics and speculation in the appropriate forum sections of course!

Some posts have been moved to https://www.railforums.co.uk/threads/tfw-welsh-govts-future-ambitions.223869/#post-5361097

 

[Nicholas Lewis]

This might be on here already so apologies if its a duplication but an interesting lecture from PWI about the more involved solutions being deployed across CVL in respect of electrification.

Core Valley Lines Electrification Traction power modelling & OLE system

 

[anthony263]

Theres been a lot of track and sleepers delivered to one of the yards amey/tfw using round the corner from the Taff's well depot.

 

[Broseley man]

Theres been a lot of track and sleepers delivered to one of the yards amey/tfw using round the corner from the Taff's well depot.

Has anyone local got an update on the infrastructure progress anywhere on the CVL, please?

Any photos?

 

[DaveHarries]

This might be on here already so apologies if its a duplication but an interesting lecture from PWI about the more involved solutions being deployed across CVL in respect of electrification.

Core Valley Lines Electrification Traction power modelling & OLE system

Thanks for that link. I note that, at about 18:45 into that clip it says 2 new depots. I know of the one being built at Taffs Well but where will the other one (of which I am not aware of any plans) be located?

Dave

 

[anthony263]

Well they are renting a few units in moy Road industrial estate next ti the Taff's well depot

 

[Dai Corner]

Thanks for that link. I note that, at about 18:45 into that clip it says 2 new depots. I know of the one being built at Taffs Well but where will the other one (of which I am not aware of any plans) be located?

Dave

Just watching the video, and I think they are referring to Canton as a new electric depot. TfW have recently bought the Pullman Rail part of the site.

 

[Tomos y Tanc]

Just watching the video, and I think they are referring to Canton as a new electric depot. TfW have recently bought the Pullman Rail part of the site.

Or it could be a reference to Treherbert which is being upgraded, although the same thing applies to Rhumney.

 

[59CosG95]

The so-called "Devils Footbridge", between Treforest & Treforest Estate has been demolished, with a new OLE-compliant footbridge due to be installed by August this year (i.e. 2022).

Christmas Day demolition of Devils Footbridge on the Radyr to Ponty route… | Christopher Courtney

Christmas Day demolition of Devils Footbridge on the Radyr to Ponty route section of the CAM line. Great effort by the team to complete the demolition 6 hours ahead of programme, leaving the 2pm afternoon shift with reinstatement works and site demobilisation works! Now the hard work begins with...

www.linkedin.com

Bridge Location:

51°34'49.3"N 3°18'59.3"W · 51.580357, -3.316483

maps.app.goo.gl

 

[Meerkat]

The so-called "Devils Footbridge", between Treforest & Treforest Estate has been demolished, with a new OLE-compliant footbridge due to be installed by August this year (i.e. 2022).

Christmas Day demolition of Devils Footbridge on the Radyr to Ponty route… | Christopher Courtney

Christmas Day demolition of Devils Footbridge on the Radyr to Ponty route section of the CAM line. Great effort by the team to complete the demolition 6 hours ahead of programme, leaving the 2pm afternoon shift with reinstatement works and site demobilisation works! Now the hard work begins with...

www.linkedin.com

Bridge Location:

51°34'49.3"N 3°18'59.3"W · 51.580357, -3.316483

maps.app.goo.gl

Surprised they were allowed to take it down without having even started design and procurement for a replacement!

 

[Tumbleweed]

That's sad, spent a lot of my childhood watching trains from there!

There was another bridge further up- over the former Llantrisant line which had been demolished as it was literally falling down.

 

[Tomos y Tanc]

That's sad, spent a lot of my childhood watching trains from there!

There was another bridge further up- over the former Llantrisant line which had been demolished as it was literally falling down.

Anybody know the origin of the name "the devil's footbridge"?

Something to do with the steam from engines maybe?