First Greater Glasgow

[cnjb8]

4 of the 5 03 plates still in service today. Considering a lot gets said in negative manner about First and maintenance, 19 years out of them now is fair going especially with the state of some of Glasgow's roads.

Them being Volvo B7TLs probably helps. They outlasted the ex-London Tridents

 

[PaulMc7]

Them being Volvo B7TLs probably helps. They outlasted the ex-London Tridents

That's very true. Even from a comfort point of view as a passenger they're not the worst even now to be quite honest. The E300s and E400s take the most discomfort out of everything for me personally

 

[route101]

Them being Volvo B7TLs probably helps. They outlasted the ex-London Tridents

They feel smoother and heavier like the normal B7TLs. They also have more comfortable seats compared to the old tridents.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 6 Mar 2022 ==

That's very true. Even from a comfort point of view as a passenger they're not the worst even now to be quite honest. The E300s and E400s take the most discomfort out of everything for me personally

With the low height E400s, they don't offer a smooth ride. Not just the examples on the 6 but with other operators who use E400s of a similar vintage.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 6 Mar 2022 ==

Does anybody know where the best places are to get the remaining B7RLE’s and which ones have been withdrawn from service so far?

The 6 had a fair few the last time I was in Glasgow.

 

[Trnsprt4Sctlnd]

If gearboxes specifically are being maintained/serviced well at there intervals as well as faults fixed promptly there shouldn’t be problems with auto gearboxes

 

[Strathclyder]

The 5 President B7TLs have the same seating as the 53-reg ALX400 Tridents did. Have considered these to be the finest Volvo deckers in the fleet in terms of refinement for some time now; I hold them in higher regard than the Gemini B7s. Rather remarkable given their age, now astronomical mileage and the poor condition of many of Glasgow's main roads.

Most of the President Tridents (barring the earliest prefix-reg examples: eg 32840 etc) had the same seating - the type that left you with a numb backside at best - as the native stock of a similar age; this same type of seating was specced on most of First's new stock nationwide roughly between late 2000/early 2001 and early 2003. It probably wasn't a terrible type of seating when factory-fresh, but they lost all semblance of comfort as wear and tear set in.

The only real standouts would've been most of the ex-Hutchison's buses of that vintage: the 4 B10BLEs - ALX300s 66233/234 (X303/304 JGE) & Renowns 66281/282 (Y181/182 BGB) and the 4 Optare Excels they acquired (these had standard bus seating, as per the linked image by Flickr's southlancs). The B10BLEs, like the rest of the ex-Hutchie buses First took on, simply had their original seating reupholstered with the First moquette that was standard for retrims at the time they entered the fleet.

T736JGB

First Glasgow 62936 : One of four Optare Excels acquired with the take over of Hutchison's routes in 2007. All four passed to First Devon & Cornwall in 2012 but were fairly quickly placed in reserve where they remained for at least 4 more years.

www.flickr.com

All things considered, I'd rather put up with that Excel's seating for a short/medium-length journey than what most of First's President Tridents were foisted with, strictly in regards to overall comfort levels and the ex-Hutchie B10BLE's seating for anything longer than that. Perhaps I'm being a tad biased here, but the latter quartet were far and away the most comfortable B10BLEs in the fleet.

 

[LT02 NVV]

Does anybody know where the best places are to get the remaining B7RLE’s and which ones have been withdrawn from service so far?

Dumbarton’s 206 & 208 routes are full of them still, a few appear on some 1 Services still.

 

[Joerf21]

Dumbarton’s 206 & 208 routes are full of them still, a few appear on some 1 Services still.

Seen one on the 2 today

 

[PaulMc7]

Seen one on the 2 today

My 2 this morning to work was one and it wasn't tracking on the app either whereas the E300 it normally is always tracks

 

[LT02 NVV]

Speaking of E300s, 67833 is on the 3 today, I just saw it an hour ago, has it moved to Scotstoun recently?

 

[JumpinTrainz]

Speaking of E300s, 67833 is on the 3 today, I just saw it an hour ago, has it moved to Scotstoun recently?

Yes Scotstoun and Dumbarton are getting E300s from Blantyre in exchange for E200MMCs from the 34/34A.

 

[ScotRail158725]

Yes Scotstoun and Dumbarton are getting E300s from Blantyre in exchange for E200MMCs from the 34/34A.

they’re getting all of the Enviro 200MMCS At Caledonia

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 7 Mar 2022 ==

More of the 38 branded EVs in service today with 32599 and 32600 now off fleet bound for Essex

 

[LT02 NVV]

66736 is on the M11 today it seems, which is weird for an Eclipse to do that route, but nonetheless, it’s nice to have a WX54 Eclipse still out & about in service (plus it’s a very nice change from the Mini-E200 44906, which has been constantly been on the M11 for the past few days).

 

[JumpinTrainz]

Noticed a lot more electrics on the 60/60A which is a nice change.

I wonder why First don’t upgrade fleets by the depot anymore and instead do it by the route. In previous years Parkhead used to receive new singles which would upgrade the (then) 40, 61, 62 routes. Now it tends to be more specifically one route.

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

Noticed a lot more electrics on the 60/60A which is a nice change.

I wonder why First don’t upgrade fleets by the depot anymore and instead do it by the route. In previous years Parkhead used to receive new singles which would upgrade the (then) 40, 61, 62 routes. Now it tends to be more specifically one route.

Because you would end up with some services that don't pay enough to justify new vehicles and, in the days of limited capital for new vehicles, you have to go where the returns are. It works on a macro level too - hence why First Glasgow gets lots of new vehicles in comparison to FSE or other OpCos - Buses of Somerset haven't had a new bus since 2009 (aside from demos and loans).

 

[Trnsprt4Sctlnd]

Because you would end up with some services that don't pay enough to justify new vehicles

Idealistically, there’s nothing special about Glasgows fleet of buses.

 

[route101]

Idealistically, there’s nothing special about Glasgows fleet of buses.

Glasgows fleet is a lot better than First Southampton's, all streetlites. There is a few token streetdecks coming into service soon.

 

[PaulMc7]

The unfortunate thing with Glasgow's fleet is the fact there's now gonna be a seemingly never ending cycle of needing to replace large amounts of vehicles as they hit the end of their lifespan as there's such an imbalance in age between newer stock and old

 

[cnjb8]

The unfortunate thing with Glasgow's fleet is the fact there's now gonna be a seemingly never ending cycle of needing to replace large amounts of vehicles as they hit the end of their lifespan as there's such an imbalance in age between newer stock and old

I think that’s true of all the First fleets. For instance in 2010, all they purchased were some B9s for London (all were sold to Metroline, Tower Transit and GoAhead) and a few B7s for Bristol

 

[JumpinTrainz]

A good friend works out of Caledonia - plan is that Scotstoun are to receive Yutong’s for the 2 and 3.

 

[Glasgowbusguy]

The Yutongs seem much better quality than the Enviros.

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

The unfortunate thing with Glasgow's fleet is the fact there's now gonna be a seemingly never ending cycle of needing to replace large amounts of vehicles as they hit the end of their lifespan as there's such an imbalance in age between newer stock and old

I think that’s true of all the First fleets. For instance in 2010, all they purchased were some B9s for London (all were sold to Metroline, Tower Transit and GoAhead) and a few B7s for Bristol

The problem in 2010 is a little different - there was very little available capital and it was all funnelled towards London.

With Glasgow, we have already seen an attempt to balance the fleet profile. Some of the 2012 e300s have headed to Midland and East Anglia to update their fleets, and we're seeing e400mmc heading to Midland as well. Elsewhere, you're seeing Leeds losing Streetdecks to Southampton, and Bristol losing e400mmc to Weymouth. Of the 200 deckers that arrived in 2012, very few are still with their original OpCo and have been used to upgrade fleets across the UK.

That will be the way of things. In Glasgow, some routes will never justify new or nearly new fleet, and that's the same across the group so expect new vehicles into the best operations and then it will cascade out.

 

[PaulMc7]

A good friend works out of Caledonia - plan is that Scotstoun are to receive Yutong’s for the 2 and 3.

Nice to see a bit of variety coming with that and I've only heard good things about McGill's set of them. Not used one before but it's nice to see something different

 

[vla50]

The problem in 2010 is a little different - there was very little available capital and it was all funnelled towards London.

With Glasgow, we have already seen an attempt to balance the fleet profile. Some of the 2012 e300s have headed to Midland and East Anglia to update their fleets, and we're seeing e400mmc heading to Midland as well. Elsewhere, you're seeing Leeds losing Streetdecks to Southampton, and Bristol losing e400mmc to Weymouth. Of the 200 deckers that arrived in 2012, very few are still with their original OpCo and have been used to upgrade fleets across the UK.

That will be the way of things. In Glasgow, some routes will never justify new or nearly new fleet, and that's the same across the group so expect new vehicles into the best operations and then it will cascade out.

IIRC there are some 52 registered Darts working some of the local services. I recall South West got rid of them in 2018 when the MMCs came in, so yes some services do not justify new buses.

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

IIRC there are some 52 registered Darts working some of the local services. I recall South West got rid of them in 2018 when the MMCs came in, so yes some services do not justify new buses.

Indeed, routes like the Dumbarton locals or the 8 or 90 are unlikely to justify newish vehicles but you can see some e300s move to replace Eclipses in Glasgow, or some to replace Eclipses in other spots.

 

[Joerf21]

Nice to see a bit of variety coming with that and I've only heard good things about McGill's set of them. Not used one before but it's nice to see something different

I thought all first glasgows buses are to be funded by scottish goverment, and they would be built in scotland

 

[Jordan Adam]

I thought all first glasgows buses are to be funded by scottish goverment, and they would be built in scotland

Part funded, there's no requirement for them to be built in Scotland. McGill's have just taken delivery of 55 Yutongs from the same funding source for example.

I'm glad they're switching to Yutongs for the next order, far superior vehicles overall.

 

[Noddy1]

I thought I saw a report saying that half of the buses ordered under the latest grant for electric buses were to be built in Scotland? Would First Glasgow/Aberdeen therefore not receive some of their quota from ADL. I would imagine Stagecoach would receive some from ADL as well.

 

[Volvodart]

If Stagecoach order most of their buses from Alexander Dennis as per usual, there will not be that many more from other operators there.

 

[Jordan Adam]

I thought I saw a report saying that half of the buses ordered under the latest grant for electric buses were to be built in Scotland? Would First Glasgow/Aberdeen therefore not receive some of their quota from ADL. I would imagine Stagecoach would receive some from ADL as well.

The 74 buses allocated to First only make up about 26% of the buses being funded under ScotZEB.

 

[PaulMc7]

Will hydrogen be a route for First in Glasgow at some point with the way electricity and fuel costs are going? Amazed there's not been a fare increase either to be honest